1up (Shane Bettenhausen) E3 prediction

[Angelcurio]

Shane Bettenhausen from 1up.com has posted his E3 predictions about the 3 next gen consoles:


E3 2006: The big 3

Last week, I couldn't take part in the weekly 1up Yours radio podcast because I was tied up at a pre-E3 press conference. This meant that I wasn't there to battle Luke, Garnett, and John on the big issues facing our industry...and that sucks, since someone has to be there to balance out their bitter, jaded opinions with a sobering dose of realism. And since I might not be around for this week's taping, I figure this venue would be a suitable one for my E3 predictions.

This will be my 10th (I'm old!!) E3, and all signs point to it being the most exciting one in a long-ass time. Who will win? Who will lose? Here's my take on what will happen in 2 weeks....

Nintendo Revolution

Nintendo's E3 press conference will be a true make-or-break moment for them: The company currently has an amazing amount of momentum with the DS, and if the Revolution can deliver on its promises, it'll instantly become the biggest story of the show. Why? Although PS3 and 360 games will undoubtedly look beautiful, nearly all of them will just be spruced-up versions of the same stuff you've been playing for the past 10 years. With Revolution games, you actually have to play each and every game to fully understand and enjoy it. Because of this, I fully predict Nintendo to steal the top spot in terms of mass-media coverage--if the Today show can only do one segment on this whole E3 shindig, I bet that you'll see that Katie Couric bitch waving around a Revolution remote like a possessed homeless lady. Playing a Rev game makes you feel a little bit insane, and I love it.

Ultimately, the success or failure of Revolution will depend solely on Nintendo's first-party efforts. Although I know that we'll be seeing some truly exciting third-party offerings at E3, Nintendo must debut with a stunning lineup of games that both capitalize on legacy IP (Zelda, Mario, etc) and push the boundaries of creative game design (Brain Age, Nintendogs, etc). Personally, I think that they can do it.

Will every Revolution game be awesome? Of course not. Will the most exciting games at E3 be on Revolution? I think so. Also, I can't wait to see how long the line will be to play these games. Scary stuff.

PlayStation 3

I've somehow managed to pick up the nickname "Sony Bettenhausen" from my podcast fans, but seriously...I'm no Sony fanboy! I'm merely a realist. Where have I played 75% of my games over the past 4 years? PS2. Where will I be playing the majority of my games for the next few years? PS3. Sony has 60% of the market. That's not going to change quickly or easily. (Though I do believe that Nintendo has a major chance to erode that percentage by drawing new players to Revolution....) The PS3 has the technological edge over 360 (this point seriously isn't for debate, kids. Blu-Ray will make a difference.), lots of quality first-party offerings, massive third-party exclusives that appeal to me (Final Fantasy, GTA, Metal Gear, plus many more...), and a fully-free online gaming service. PS3 will be the big summer blockbuster of the gaming scene--big, expensive, and over-the-top. More predictions: the PS3 will have a metric ton of games this fall, and the best-looking PS3 games will look obviously better than most Xbox 360 games. Your everyday third party stuff (say, like John Woo's Stranglehold) will probably look more or less identical across PS3 and 360, though.

Seriously, it's almost as if people (around here, at least) want the PS3 to fail. I agree that it's often tough to love SCE...when Kutaragi comes out and rambles about the PlayStation 3's Live 4D World Space + Time capabilities, it's easy to get a tad discouraged about their vision. (Thanks to some random GAF kid for this awesome photoshop, btw.) But c'mon people, are you really 100% happy with the Xbox 360? Does that fulfill your expectations for a next-gen experience? Think of all the great games you've played on the PS2...it was the clear-cut winner of this previous generation, and Sony knows what must be done in order to keep its lead.

Xbox 360

http://img236.imageshack.us/img236/6430/faceplatesunlr7ix.jpg

OK, time for some honesty here. First off, I totally own this cheesy orange faceplate that looks like it came out of 1977. Also, I really believe that Microsoft has dropped the ball with the 360 this Spring. While a handful of top-quality games (GRAW, Oblivion, Fight Night) have kept 360s powered on with those early adopters, MS isn't really giving gamers many reasons to be excited about the console. Why? Well, Microsoft has not shipped any games since the day the console came out. Sure, they've made downloadable content available for PGR3, Kameo, and PDZ...but that doesn't count as actually releasing games. What's more...no Microsoft first-party game has a release date. They're totally squandering the lead they have over PS3 and Revolution. So far, they've sold 1.2 million units here in the states (they likely could have moved more if not for production problems), but with only a few must-have titles on shelves, I can see why gamers would want to wait to see what the competition will be offering this fall.

Microsoft will also have to announce a change in its Xbox Live pricing structure. Sure, it's an awesome service, but if Sony and Nintendo will be offering comprable online play for free, well...MS has no other choice than to make XBL free, as well.

Luckily, MS does have a solid first-party game lineup at E3. Gears of War, Too Human, and Mass Effect will all impress, and expected stuff like Forza 2, Fable 2, and Halo 3 (or is it Halo: Forerunners first?) will create a lot of excitement. Will this lineup be enough to combat what Sony and Nintendo has? Hmm...good question. Perhaps a bigger question will be whether or not all of these titles will actually make it to store shelves in time to combat PS3/Revolution. Godspeed, Cliffy and Denis!

Link: http://www.1up.com/do/blogEntry?bId=6947747&publicUserId=1002415

[Martinx]

I like that he is being realistic. Especially when he is talking about the xbox360.

[Meth]

The writer does sound like a Playstation fanboy even though he denies it. I think he is right when he says that it seems alot of people what the Playstation 3 to fail. It will be interesting to see what Sony has to offer at E3. I am hoping for a massive launch line-up like he said. Also more information about the "Playstation HUB" and whatever accessories that can be used with the Playstation 3 like video chat and keyboard and mouse options.

[StrikeMaster Ice]

I doubt MS is going to offer XBL service for free, but I do see a price cut for XbL service.

[Organic_Shadow]

He is being called a fanboi because he is the only one on the 1up.com staff that doesn't want the PS3 to fail, and doesn't constantly talk shats about it.

I wish he would have actually made some predictions though, instead of kinda rambling about each company.

[Trinity]

Great stuff, the PS3 and the Sony brand will kill E3.

I mean, seriously, what would happen if some takes the big hit (sony and some other companies) and launch the playstation 3 at 399.99 dollars? I know, chaos

[udontneed2know]

I've been saying 1up is loaded with Microsoft fanatics for awhile now but this pretty much proves it when you have an actual worker there getting crap from everyone else for supporting Sony.

Sony is becoming the Bulls of the 90's. Its been 10 years and Sony has yet to be dethroned. In fact they have done nothing but gain momentum this generation. Now they want Sony to fail, they want a new console leader for whatever reason.

It happens in everything you know. If you have a boss for 10 years, you want him gone or you want to be gone. If the Yankees win 4 years in a row, your tired of it even if your a New Yorker. Same with the Bulls. If Lebron James won MVP awards 3 years in a row, you'd yell for a change.

Now its Sony's turn to recieve that. They've been on top for a decade, now people want them to fail.

[Alkemist]

Microsoft fanatics? I'd say Nintendo fanatics. I dig Nintendo, don't get it twisted, NR will most likely be my 2nd console....but I just find it nausiating sometimes how they put them on a pedistal and always give them the benefit of the doubt over any other console...specifically Sony.

I agree pretty much with everything he has said. He said what I've been thinking for quite some time now. Good read though, good to find that one of the 1up staff sees things a different way.

[Terarrim]

Your right about Nintendo. I am not nocking it at all. However you see all the where is the Price etc for the Sony, the whole industry sometimes lambasting Sony. Yet there are no calls for Nintendo's price, or the relative lack of information on this console (although more information has come out recently).

I would agree with this article in that Sony has the most to lose. This is fairly obvious as the company who sits at the top of the console race at present have to do more work to stay the same or improve than the challengers.

[ShinMaruku]

They fact that they seem to be ragin on the PS3 points to that it has their attention and if it goes as promised then they will have to shut up or look stupid

[Organic_Shadow]

Microsoft fanatics? I'd say Nintendo fanatics. I dig Nintendo, don't get it twisted, NR will most likely be my 2nd console....but I just find it nausiating sometimes how they put them on a pedistal and always give them the benefit of the doubt over any other console...especially Sony.

I agree pretty much with everything he has said. He said what I've been thinking for quite some time now. Good read though, good to find that one of the 1up staff sees things a different way.

I agree. Everyone acts like Nintendo can do no wrong. Say anything slightly negative about them and everyone jumps all over you. I don't see how people can blame us for "being scared of Playstation eventually being defeated" when Nintendo pretty much already has. Look at the total number of their consoles sold. It has declined dramatically every generation, and nothing seems to indicate that this will cease. Each console had some sort of "thing" about it(not going to say gimmick) to try and make it unique and better than the rest, but it never quite got them past the initial blast of sales at launch, and to continue to sell well through the rest of it's lifespan. The Gamecube is a great example, because I feel like people are acting almost th exact same way now about the Revo that they did back before the GC. "Ohh man! It's gonna be awesome! That unique feature is going to really separate them from the competition! They will have the edge! Times are a changin'!" but after a year or two when the dust settled it was still the same group of die-hard Nintendo fans still playing with them.

Now, please don't take this as bashing Nintendo. Those guys are awesome and they deserve a lot of credit and respect for the things they have paved the way for in the videogame industry, but I don't see them surviving much longer, let alone breaking their routine of declining "interest" in the consoles. Is it the competition? The hardware? The special features? The shoving of mascots down our throats? Or a combination of all these? What will it matter if they steal the show at E3 this year if they aren't going to do well through the lifespan of the console? Kinda ruins it for Sony and M$ that they get their "parties crashed" for a few E3's only to have the competing factor fade off and go silent.

Sony and M$ have slowly turned the industry into a thing that it wasn't back in the days of NES. They have started to put forth this "routine" of pushing ideas, pushing hardware power, demanding more money, and telling us why their product is worth this money. Nintendo may break out of their downhill habit through low prices and playing their cards right, but can they do it for much longer with a market that has changed, and with an audience primarily made of nostalgic adults? Keep throwing the "yeah but the controller..." defense at me, I have heard it, but I am still not convinced that Nintendo is going to be doing well in the console market for this next generation.

[ShinMaruku]

I honestlly have yet to the revolution make a splash with people aroudn me, they say it's rather stupid. I'd love for them to go the way of sega, they cna makes a lot of money that way.

[Trinity]

The good thing is...just 12 more days. wOOt!

[Organic_Shadow]

Indeed!!!!

I find lot's of people who like it, but they don't know if they are going to buy one, and they don't know much about it. Funny how optimistic so many "game news" sites out there can be about the Revo when there is next to no concrete info about it. The PS3 has a small handful of concrete infos but that seems to be enough for the haters to use as ammunition in their claims that it will fail. :roll:

[Dasimpse]

i dont think its HUMANLY possible to insult NINTENDO. my reasons

THey got me into gaming 1!

They invented the game pad

They invented the rumble pak

They invented the analogue stick.

they invented 3d gaming like mario, they invented mario kart. They invented the DS

EVERY thing that Nintendo have ever done has ALWAYS pushed the envelope in one way or another. I totally believe SOny and Microsoft are guilty of the more power to the same old games.

where nintendo really want to see HOW to get my mum playing games. My missuss glued to nintendogs.

In one word Nintendo are AMAZING.

If nyone was gonna call me a fanboy id be proud to be a nintendo fanboy. Im just a fan of games, and nintendo made that fan, ME :D

I think its a totally different vibe this time to the gamecube, the gamecube tried to be a straight up games machine. What did it do groundbreaking like the revolution??

I think people will be surprised at nintendo this time. They arent in a console war. they are geniuses at making a console that costs less to buy and more importantly much less to produce, and they reap in profit from classic games.

Take the DS it costs 100 thousand to make a game on ds, but 1 million on the psp. its less than half the price and its absolutely destroyed the PSP in sales worldwide.

Lets be honest we all thought it would be close, and im sure nintendo did.

i honestly think that if they seperate themselves enough they will truelly shine. If people ever want to talk about stolen ideas, every single thing that is going on now is a stolen design of nintendos.

and i bet they will continue to dominate the innovation.

[Graham]

Nintendo have gone off the rails these last couple of generations, but there is no denying that they are defintiely pioneers in their field, and have led the way for many innovations currently in use.

Their games have entertained me for years, and when the revo is released, I hope to re-live some of those fond memories!

[Lefein]

I'd like to see 100Million PS3s sold and 100Million Revolutions too :)

[Graham]

As I've said, I'll be a meaningless statistic when it comes to comparing PS3 and Revolution sales! :D

[Azu]

Lol. Organic_shadow, none of the earlier Nintendo consoles (or handhelds) had anything special hardware-wise(Gameboys had Pokemon (A GAME), which helped sell the different versions a lot). Gamecube is just a little more powerful than PS2, N64 was like PS1 etc. SNES was quite similar to other consoles of its era, but it had GAMES. The problem with N64 and Gamecube was that they WEREN'T any different than their competitors. Just more or less powerful.

You know what went wrong? GAMES. Yeah, Nintendo has made some great games for N64 and GC, but the 3rd party support has been pathetic, it got a little better on Gamecube but still lost to PS2.

Revolution is the first home console from Nintendo to be different in other ways just than power-wise. It's funny you say "everyone says Nintendo can't do wrong" when all I read around PS3 forums is how Nintendo will fail with Revolution, the controller is bad/gimmicky and Nintendo's games are boring/for kids only. Nintendo has done dumb things in the past, but Revolution isn't one of them. The people who have actually tested the controller and Revolution's games are really excited, and I believe the same will happen to most who give the console a chance. Can you say the same about the ones that have tested PS3 or Xbox 360? I've heard from Xbox fans how Xbox 360 was a disappointment, how it just doesn't seem like a next-gen console (yet). In the end, will PS3 be all glory when it's released. Are you sure you won't think "haven't I played this games thousands of times before, pressed the same button to slash the sword like this millions of times"?

The only bigger problem Revolution could have is the lack of 3rd party support, but from what I've been reading and hearing, even that won't be a problem (and we'll see that at E3).

I happen to know plenty of people who are really excited of Revolution. Of course you can't expect the same from forums that are dedicated to Playstation. Most of you are thinking how PS3 will definitely be the best console to get, and think of Revolution as the "possible 2nd console". I happen to be wise enough not to say something like "Sony will fail", even though that's a possibility, because anything could happen (except Xbox 360 winning, it just hasn't got anything special going on). If you want to get all realist, yeah, Revolution won't probably sell more than PS3, but what it will do is sell more than Gamecube. If not, I'm really disappointed. So what if the sales have gotten worse every generation? All of them have been just power updates (NES -> add better hardware = SNES -> add better hardware = N64 -> add better hardware = Gamecube).


Sony and Microsoft aren't changing the industry with their new consoles. They're just doing what has been done before, just with the attitude "more is better". Don't understand me in the wrong way, I'm really waiting for PS3 mainly because of games like Heavenly Sword, Lair, Warhawk, (possibly exclusive) FFXIII and (if developed) Kingdom Hearts 3. I think PS2 is the best last-gen (or current gen, depends how you see things) console. Why? GAMES. Then why am I waiting more for Revolution? GAMES (and how you play them). Revolution has massive potential, it seems it's getting a lot of support from 3rd parties, some big ones like Ubisoft, Sega and Konami, some small like Crossbeam Studios and NIBRIS.



Funny how optimistic so many "game news" sites out there can be about the Revo when there is next to no concrete info about it.
OH... MY... GOD!

*tries to relax*

Do you know why they're excited? GAME SITES ARE SO EXCITED BECAUSE THE GAME JOURNALISTS HAVE ACTUALLY PLAYED REVOLUTION GAMES. I know the journalists in my country's best gaming magazine have tested it, as they've said it themselves. They can't speak about it freely because of NDAs. I'm excited, because most of the ones that have tested it say everything works well and most recently EGM's editor-in-chief said he's "OMG! super-psyched" about Revolution.

We know surprisingly much about Revolution. Maybe you're not that interested in it to know about everything that has been said, but the only thing we really lack information is games. We know names (mostly from Nintendo, and lately more from other developers too), and we've heard many developers are developing something for Revolution, but nothing more. Why couldn't we be enthusiastic when we hear some great developer making games for Revolution? All you have to say is "Tekken 6 PS3" and many of here are having multiple orgasms. :|

As you said, we know little more about PS3. Every little event (like GDC) where we have "seen" PS3 and/or its games, has had a very limited amount of info. There has been some bigger things revealed (like say the PS Network thingie), but all the small and big details have been left unsaid. This applies to both, Rev and PS3: just because WE (the gamers) know little about the consoles/their games, it doesn't no one knows anything.

The situation with PS3 and Revolution is very much alike. We know pretty much, but still many things need clarification and additional info.

[Dasimpse]

N64 INVENTED the analogue stick and changed gaming forever!

[CRD90]

N64 INVENTED the analogue stick and changed gaming forever!No they never Atari did. Wiki (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Analogue_stick#History)

[Gersjann]

Lol. Organic_shadow, none of the earlier Nintendo consoles (or handhelds) had anything special hardware-wise(Gameboys had Pokemon (A GAME), which helped sell the different versions a lot). Gamecube is just a little more powerful than PS2, N64 was like PS1 etc. SNES was quite similar to other consoles of its era, but it had GAMES. The problem with N64 and Gamecube was that they WEREN'T any different than their competitors. Just more or less powerful.

You know what went wrong? GAMES. Yeah, Nintendo has made some great games for N64 and GC, but the 3rd party support has been pathetic, it got a little better on Gamecube but still lost to PS2.

Revolution is the first home console from Nintendo to be different in other ways just than power-wise. It's funny you say "everyone says Nintendo can't do wrong" when all I read around PS3 forums is how Nintendo will fail with Revolution, the controller is bad/gimmicky and Nintendo's games are boring/for kids only. Nintendo has done dumb things in the past, but Revolution isn't one of them. The people who have actually tested the controller and Revolution's games are really excited, and I believe the same will happen to most who give the console a chance. Can you say the same about the ones that have tested PS3 or Xbox 360? I've heard from Xbox fans how Xbox 360 was a disappointment, how it just doesn't seem like a next-gen console (yet). In the end, will PS3 be all glory when it's released. Are you sure you won't think "haven't I played this games thousands of times before, pressed the same button to slash the sword like this millions of times"?

The only bigger problem Revolution could have is the lack of 3rd party support, but from what I've been reading and hearing, even that won't be a problem (and we'll see that at E3).

I happen to know plenty of people who are really excited of Revolution. Of course you can't expect the same from forums that are dedicated to Playstation. Most of you are thinking how PS3 will definitely be the best console to get, and think of Revolution as the "possible 2nd console". I happen to be wise enough not to say something like "Sony will fail", even though that's a possibility, because anything could happen (except Xbox 360 winning, it just hasn't got anything special going on). If you want to get all realist, yeah, Revolution won't probably sell more than PS3, but what it will do is sell more than Gamecube. If not, I'm really disappointed. So what if the sales have gotten worse every generation? All of them have been just power updates (NES -> add better hardware = SNES -> add better hardware = N64 -> add better hardware = Gamecube).


Sony and Microsoft aren't changing the industry with their new consoles. They're just doing what has been done before, just with the attitude "more is better". Don't understand me in the wrong way, I'm really waiting for PS3 mainly because of games like Heavenly Sword, Lair, Warhawk, (possibly exclusive) FFXIII and (if developed) Kingdom Hearts 3. I think PS2 is the best last-gen (or current gen, depends how you see things) console. Why? GAMES. Then why am I waiting more for Revolution? GAMES (and how you play them). Revolution has massive potential, it seems it's getting a lot of support from 3rd parties, some big ones like Ubisoft, Sega and Konami, some small like Crossbeam Studios and NIBRIS.



Funny how optimistic so many "game news" sites out there can be about the Revo when there is next to no concrete info about it.
OH... MY... GOD!

*tries to relax*

Do you know why they're excited? GAME SITES ARE SO EXCITED BECAUSE THE GAME JOURNALISTS HAVE ACTUALLY PLAYED REVOLUTION GAMES. I know the journalists in my country's best gaming magazine have tested it, as they've said it themselves. They can't speak about it freely because of NDAs. I'm excited, because most of the ones that have tested it say everything works well and most recently EGM's editor-in-chief said he's "OMG! super-psyched" about Revolution.

We know surprisingly much about Revolution. Maybe you're not that interested in it to know about everything that has been said, but the only thing we really lack information is games. We know names (mostly from Nintendo, and lately more from other developers too), and we've heard many developers are developing something for Revolution, but nothing more. Why couldn't we be enthusiastic when we hear some great developer making games for Revolution? All you have to say is "Tekken 6 PS3" and many of here are having multiple orgasms. :|

As you said, we know little more about PS3. Every little event (like GDC) where we have "seen" PS3 and/or its games, has had a very limited amount of info. There has been some bigger things revealed (like say the PS Network thingie), but all the small and big details have been left unsaid. This applies to both, Rev and PS3: just because WE (the gamers) know little about the consoles/their games, it doesn't no one knows anything.

The situation with PS3 and Revolution is very much alike. We know pretty much, but still many things need clarification and additional info.OMG! That was a really good post. I couldnt have said it better myself. You must be my lost twin brother or something. We think excactly the same way. I just hope there are more of people like you who has paid attention to the gaming market the last 20 years and not just grown up in the PS1/PS2 era testing older Nintendo games 10 years after they originally released, while thinking: I dont understand whats so special about these crappy looking games. * Bows in respect :D *

[Lefein]

The Eye-Toy is very inventive... I dont see how people are saying Sony is doing the same stuff.

HELLO! Guitar Hero!

[Organic_Shadow]

-Dasimpse, Nintendo DID NOT INVENT ANY of those things. Gamepads? Analog sticks? The Atari and other retro systems had game pads too. The N64 stick was not analog, it was digital(ie: 8-way like a d-pad) but used a stick. Retro game systems and arcade games had sticks for HOW LONG? Sony was the first to make an analog stick that relied on how much pressure you put upon it to affect the game you were playing.

-Also Azu, I wasn't talking about handhelds at all. Notice how I keep saying console....

-People have played the PS3 too, and also are being restricted with NDAs, what's your point? Yeah, a lot of magazine editors are physched about the Revolution. You know why? They are MUCH older than average gamers. Most video game magazine's staffs are comprised of people in their late 20's to upper-30's. Why do you think the PSM crew mentions their love of DS any chance they can get?

-When did I say we knew nothing? I said we know next to nothing. Take that as you will but it is still quite true.

Nintendo has been stereotyped as being primarily aimed, and fitted for a younger audience. Sure, they have a lot of games rated T and M but the consumers, and the parents still see Mario, Zelda, and cute things that they want their kids playing. The industry knows this, and developers/publishers put their games on the systems accordingly. The momentum that PS2 has gained is why so many games are being made for it-- because the publishers know they will sell. With the low number of total GC units sold, a lot of 3rd party publishers and devs don't want to risk putting their games out on it if they aren't going to make a profit. That's how business is.... it sucks, I know. Don't jump all over MY case because PARENTS AND COMPANIES IN THE INDUSTRY see Nintendo this way. Because of these factors, it will be hard for Nintendo to acquire third-party support if there isn't a very big, profitable userbase for them to make any money from. Nintendo will need to draw people in with THEIR games first, and then get third party devs to take risks. It will be an uphill battle. Will the new controller and unique games be enough to pull Nintendo out of the quicksand? I don't know, but so far it doesn't seem likely, especially with the hype surrounding the Revo being very similar to the Gamecube.

I'm sorry you feel like im attacking the Revo, but I am getting pretty sick and tired of so many people acting like Nintendo is golden and flawless. Sure, there are A LOT of Sony fanbois out there, but many of them are still capable of giving Sony constructive criticism. I haven't seen any Nintendo fans do anything of the sort so far. Only randomly popping out to bash Sony/M$ and praise their DS and Revo controller. That doesn't mean that Sony/M$ fans don't do the same, but as soon as everyone accepts the fact that the companies they pledge allegiance to have flaws and problems the better will all get along, and won't have to take up ridiculous amounts of space in forums with posts like these.

EDIT:
@Gersjann: I love NES and SNES as well. Does that mean that I cannot ever give Nintendo criticism? No. Constructive criticism usually helps more than it insults. If it were not for criticism we would still be stuck with the boomerang(there i said it) DS3 in November....

You are doing nothing but serving as an example to my original post.

[Dasimpse]

How the hell was the n64 Stick an 8 way digital, when it was called the "ANALOGUE" stick. YOUR TALKING RUBBISH MARIO 64 WAS THE FIRST ANALOGUE GAME, You controlled the speed he ran with the stick same for Banjo Kazzoie etc.

MARIO 64 a launch N64 game was the FIRST analogue game, and SOny COPIED the analogue stick and released the DUAL SHOCK! with the rumble pad! that the N64 had already done WITH STARFOX 64!!!

i dont know any console that used a PAD before nintendo, sorry if they did. I thought all other companys used a Joystick! it was the first pad i ever saw, it was the first analogue stick i ever saw, and it was the first rumble pak i ever felt.

[Steroyd]

Sega Saturn had the first ever thumb sized Analogue stick on a gamepad.

Back in the day Sega, Sony and Nintendo were flairing their new controllers, and Sega rolled out their Analogue sticks first.

Quite Nintendo Fanboyish of you Dasimpse, did Nintendo create gaming as well? :snigger

[Dasimpse]

Sega Saturn had the first ever thumb sized Analogue stick on a gamepad.

Back in the day Sega, Sony and Nintendo were flairing their new controllers, and Sega rolled out their Analogue sticks first.

Quite Nintendo Fanboyish of you Dasimpse, did Nintendo create gaming as well? :snigger

sorry my friend But KNIGHTS was the first analogue game on the SATURN and it came AFTER mario 64 :D

Sorry i luv ninty!

[Lefein]

It is perfectly acceptable to love Nintendo. I love Nintendo too. I didnt play my GameCube that much but I have a feeling the Revolution will be like meeting an old friend.

[antuk15]

i dont think its HUMANLY possible to insult NINTENDO. my reasons

THey got me into gaming 1!

They invented the game pad

They invented the rumble pak

They invented the analogue stick.

they invented 3d gaming like mario, they invented mario kart. They invented the DS

EVERY thing that Nintendo have ever done has ALWAYS pushed the envelope in one way or another. I totally believe SOny and Microsoft are guilty of the more power to the same old games.

where nintendo really want to see HOW to get my mum playing games. My missuss glued to nintendogs.

In one word Nintendo are AMAZING.

If nyone was gonna call me a fanboy id be proud to be a nintendo fanboy. Im just a fan of games, and nintendo made that fan, ME :D

I think its a totally different vibe this time to the gamecube, the gamecube tried to be a straight up games machine. What did it do groundbreaking like the revolution??

I think people will be surprised at nintendo this time. They arent in a console war. they are geniuses at making a console that costs less to buy and more importantly much less to produce, and they reap in profit from classic games.

Take the DS it costs 100 thousand to make a game on ds, but 1 million on the psp. its less than half the price and its absolutely destroyed the PSP in sales worldwide.

Lets be honest we all thought it would be close, and im sure nintendo did.

i honestly think that if they seperate themselves enough they will truelly shine. If people ever want to talk about stolen ideas, every single thing that is going on now is a stolen design of nintendos.

and i bet they will continue to dominate the innovation.

Yes Yes ninty did all that, but if it was'nt for Sony and Playstation brand name, Gaming would'nt be as big as it is now. Sony brought Gaming to the mass's with the playstation.

[GS kid]

Yes Organic_Shadow, your original post was pretty dead on. Nintendo comes out with the initial wow momentum from it's fanboys and then in 2 years it's pretty much over as a market success.

My issues with Nintendo have to do with their lack of more adult titles from their own studios. Metroid is about the closest it got and it was from an american developer and not from their internal studios. I want to see what Shigeru Miyamoto could do with his talent towards a mature game.

I also didn't like their denial and downplaying of online gaming when they tried to push their GBA-to-Gamecube connectivity thing instead.

I was also sick of the endless mario games. Mario 64 was nice.... but Mario party, golf, baseball, tennis, etc..... Does it ever end?!??!

That's the part of Nintendo that angers me the most. I don't mind you doing the kiddie games, but I'm an adult and expect more then that crap for the rest of my gaming life. Get on the ball and serve our needs too.

I see Revo pretty much following in Gamecube's footsteps in the end, although it may do a little better. That's my opinion.


As for the analog stick thing?

Wiki is wrong. The earliest console I can recall having a analog stick is 1292 Video System Family from about 30 years ago.

http://darkwatcher.psxfanatics.com/console/1292.htm

Oh...and Organic_Shadow..... the N64 analog stick is not digital. It's the classic analog stick that uses potentiometers to detect changes in voltage to come up with X & Y values for game control.

Digital sticks use mainly the following .....





The leaf switch.....

http://www.retroblast.com/photos/joysticks/wico_leaf.jpg

The micro switch....

http://www.arcadeshop.com/pics/joystick-ms-8way.jpg

The membrane switch.....

http://common.weblogsinc.com/common/images/1524287985352731.JPG?0.8528623941599898




As for some people wanting the PS3 to fail?

I agree with udontneed2know. Most people start turning on the guy who keeps winning all the time. Happens in sports all the time.

I wanted Nintendo to fall from it's #1 position, just not nearly as far as it has.

I want Sony to fall from it's #1 position too. I want Microsoft to win a round. But I want them to win by no more then 5 million consoles tops.

If Microsoft was to win over Sony by the same 75 million that the PS2 did, I would not be a happy camper. I want it to be close, not a landslide. That's when people do their best work is when they are neck and neck with others. :P

[ShinMaruku]

People need to remeber after Nintendo got turned down by Atari they went down and dirty, and curbed the makret for the Nintendo while the Master system (Yes, Sega had a system way back then too) got shanked and did bad. :cry:

They ain't pure, they all the same, it's just that Nintendo is so small compared to the other two, so it seems that they aren't like them, but all the same.

[tien]

dontneed2know
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more... Posted: Wed Apr 26, 2006 4:52 pm

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I've been saying 1up is loaded with Microsoft fanatics for awhile now but this pretty much proves it when you have an actual worker there getting crap from everyone else for supporting Sony.




Yup, this is why i do not go there, but this guy brings up a point. My mind was on the revolution as my 2nd console. But having red the latest Game Informer, it has been boosted up there with sony in my mind. This guy has a point in saying that the Revolution may steal the show. the more I read that piece on Red steel, I realize that for a PC and console gamer. the control setup just might be that sweetspot to lure over PC affectionates.

I sure hope Sony is keeping tabs on Revolution and are urging devs to come up with ways for interacting. And that they have a like controller. I read in the same issue that microsoft is making a 3D type camera as well, even though the name is corny and not worth mentioning. One guy on this thread is right. In all of Ninety's attempts to set themselves apart, the revolution wont be a bad attempt on that part. One thing though, maybe they ought to have a more traditional controller as an option.

For one thing the graphics are not that bad, and for the speed and accuracy the controller will give, the AI is much improved adn everything in the game is faster. Sigh, more I read, and if devs can really come up with good uses for this controlller. revolution will at least take second place behind SOny of course this generation.

[Jimmy!!]

I take the revolution as a joke as of right now....the hype seems like it will die down easily. it's designed for those ADHD kids :lol:

[tien]

Sorry for double posting, but las t thing I ever want to see is MS winning any rounds where consoles are concerned.

[night52]

Dasimpse how can u say nintendo invented the analogue stick..didnt u read the link CRD90 posted :roll:


In 1982 Atari released the first controller with an "analog" stick for their Atari 5200 home console. However, the non-centering joystick design proved to be ungainly and unreliable, alienating many consumers at the time. During that same year, General Consumer Electronics introduced the Vectrex, a vector graphics based system which used a self-centering analog stick, obviously a precursor to the modern design.

In 1996 Nintendo introduced a modern analog stick on their Nintendo 64 controller. Unlike the D-pad, the analog stick allowed for varying levels of pressure and 360-degree control, translating into more precise movements in games such as Super Mario 64. Incidentally, Super Mario 64 DS was criticized by some for imprecise control due to lack of an analog stick on the Nintendo DS.

[Gersjann]

-Dasimpse, Nintendo DID NOT INVENT ANY of those things. Gamepads? Analog sticks? The Atari and other retro systems had game pads too. The N64 stick was not analog, it was digital(ie: 8-way like a d-pad) but used a stick. Retro game systems and arcade games had sticks for HOW LONG? Sony was the first to make an analog stick that relied on how much pressure you put upon it to affect the game you were playing.

-Also Azu, I wasn't talking about handhelds at all. Notice how I keep saying console....

-People have played the PS3 too, and also are being restricted with NDAs, what's your point? Yeah, a lot of magazine editors are physched about the Revolution. You know why? They are MUCH older than average gamers. Most video game magazine's staffs are comprised of people in their late 20's to upper-30's. Why do you think the PSM crew mentions their love of DS any chance they can get?

-When did I say we knew nothing? I said we know next to nothing. Take that as you will but it is still quite true.

Nintendo has been stereotyped as being primarily aimed, and fitted for a younger audience. Sure, they have a lot of games rated T and M but the consumers, and the parents still see Mario, Zelda, and cute things that they want their kids playing. The industry knows this, and developers/publishers put their games on the systems accordingly. The momentum that PS2 has gained is why so many games are being made for it-- because the publishers know they will sell. With the low number of total GC units sold, a lot of 3rd party publishers and devs don't want to risk putting their games out on it if they aren't going to make a profit. That's how business is.... it sucks, I know. Don't jump all over MY case because PARENTS AND COMPANIES IN THE INDUSTRY see Nintendo this way. Because of these factors, it will be hard for Nintendo to acquire third-party support if there isn't a very big, profitable userbase for them to make any money from. Nintendo will need to draw people in with THEIR games first, and then get third party devs to take risks. It will be an uphill battle. Will the new controller and unique games be enough to pull Nintendo out of the quicksand? I don't know, but so far it doesn't seem likely, especially with the hype surrounding the Revo being very similar to the Gamecube.

I'm sorry you feel like im attacking the Revo, but I am getting pretty sick and tired of so many people acting like Nintendo is golden and flawless. Sure, there are A LOT of Sony fanbois out there, but many of them are still capable of giving Sony constructive criticism. I haven't seen any Nintendo fans do anything of the sort so far. Only randomly popping out to bash Sony/M$ and praise their DS and Revo controller. That doesn't mean that Sony/M$ fans don't do the same, but as soon as everyone accepts the fact that the companies they pledge allegiance to have flaws and problems the better will all get along, and won't have to take up ridiculous amounts of space in forums with posts like these.

EDIT:
@Gersjann: I love NES and SNES as well. Does that mean that I cannot ever give Nintendo criticism? No. Constructive criticism usually helps more than it insults. If it were not for criticism we would still be stuck with the boomerang(there i said it) DS3 in November....

You are doing nothing but serving as an example to my original post.

I agree with a lot of what you are saying, but i dont agree when you talk trash about the Gamecube. Sure Nintendo has done plenty of stupid things, but the Gamecube was a very good gaming console. Actually i see it as the best current gen console even if it isnt as powerful as the Xbox, but it was at least twice as good as the PS2 in my book. All i wanted to say was that it doesnt help no matter how good gameconsole you make if no developer is gonna make games on it.

Just think about it for a second if the cube could have had half of the games which have been made on the PS2, exclusively made from the ground up on it. The cube didnt have 1/10 of the 3rd party support of the PS2 or half of the xbox and still it has sold over 20 millions units almost entirely based on first-party in house productions. To me that says a lot about the quality of the games that Nintendo makes themselves :wink:

Now for the 2 humongous faults they made with the Gamecube:
1: If it wasnt for the small discs that put of a lot of multiplatform developers (EA always released ultracrappy ports on it) because of the size and space on them, i feel that they would have had tons more 3rd party developer support with a normal DVD discs as media instead. ( I call it lazy developers that just want to take the easy and most profitable way out = PS2 because of the large fanbase which makes it a sureseller)

But the positive part about those small discs was that it made the games load ultrafast and much better/stable framerate in the games compared to the other 2 consoles. (Ofcourse only for games made exclusevily from the ground up on it)

2: The design!! The purple box with a carrying handle made it look like my first fisher price cassette player for kids 2-5 years old :no
At least i bought the platinum edition which looks sleek, but that came out much later. I actually sold my launch purple one to buy the platinum bundle with wind waker when that came out.

Now the Revolution uses normal DVD discs= More developers like that.
It is just as easy to develope on as the Gamecube architecture was= Developers sure like that and the games will start to look really good already in the first generation because they are familiar with the hardware.

It has an insane sexy design( By far the best looking next generation console if you ask me= All consumers likes that!
It uses a new type of controllers.= That could be both positive and negative, but all i read about is how excited both the developers and gamers are about the possibilities!

I also doesnt need to output the games in high-def so it can use that power elsewhere in the games.
I read somewhere that the Xbox 360 uses about 30% of its powers to do the games in high def.
And it also wont run a operative system in the background like the 2 other consoles.
I also read that the operating system in the PS3 could take up to 20% of its cpu power!

And to top it off its going to be the cheapest, smallest, most silent and minimal power usage with a good enough hardware to make the games look twice as good as Resident evil 4. = Thats good enough graphics in my book and probably most others books!

As you can see, i dont see a single negative thing about the revolution except that it doesnt support high definition or play next generation movies. It doesnt need to either because its designed to do one single thing: Play games/have fun and nothing else :D

[GS kid]

Dasimpse how can u say nintendo invented the analogue stick..didnt u read the link CRD90 posted :roll:


In 1982 Atari released the first controller with an "analog" stick for their Atari 5200 home console. However, the non-centering joystick design proved to be ungainly and unreliable, alienating many consumers at the time. During that same year, General Consumer Electronics introduced the Vectrex, a vector graphics based system which used a self-centering analog stick, obviously a precursor to the modern design.

In 1996 Nintendo introduced a modern analog stick on their Nintendo 64 controller. Unlike the D-pad, the analog stick allowed for varying levels of pressure and 360-degree control, translating into more precise movements in games such as Super Mario 64. Incidentally, Super Mario 64 DS was criticized by some for imprecise control due to lack of an analog stick on the Nintendo DS.

And apparently you missed my post above...


As for the analog stick thing?

Wiki is wrong. The earliest console I can recall having a analog stick is 1292 Video System Family from about 30 years ago.

http://darkwatcher.psxfanatics.com/console/1292.htm

[Gersjann]

And whats the point of arguing which company made the first analogue stick, when the first company to make proper use of it and make a game that was equally as inventive/groundbreaking (super mario 64/ nintendo 64) to go along with it?
CASE CLOSED!

[Final_fantasy]

STOP COMPLAINING LIKE OLD GRANNIES GOING AFTER FLIES ON THEIR PIES!!! enough yelling, sheesh. can we get on topic. The predictions stated were quite interesting. i personally do agree that the blu-ray drives being in the ps3 are an advantage. think of how much more GAME for your BUCKS you can get. plus other developer chosen extras. the revolution is something to like though. affordable, and not to forget, the unique controller. i mean, when i play a game with a samurai warrior as me, i can actually slice and dice a person in the game. as for the 360, i see no point in getting it as of yet. no appealing games. atleast not to me.

[The House]

i say that 64 made every other console put analogues in theirs because since they saw the succesful FPS( goldneye... Perfect Dark.... )on 64. then Playstation 2 invented the dual analogue, then Xbox got the best analogues for FPS games, now what is next generation going to bring. we will see at E3 when Sony reveils it's controller and more Revolution controller info.

ONLY 12 MORE DAYS.

[chopchopyep]

wanted Nintendo to fall from it's #1 position, just not nearly as far as it has.
I want Sony to fall from it's #1 position too. I want Microsoft to win a round. But I want them to win by no more then 5 million consoles tops.


"Microsoft to win a round", when you're playing marbles you can win a round.

:roll:

When the PS2 was on top, THATS where the best games came out, cause as a company you are free to create.You dont have to waste money and time on promoting the console and the platform itself, and people work on the software, and promote software.

What you will see if its that close is a BS kiddie mudfight.Every staff member will be so focused on getting the console out there that the games will suffer from it, or course when you are under pressure to win consumers you need games NOW, so that means less developement time, more bugs.

An ICO or colossus would never be released if sony wouldn't be in the position to just risk it making these games.If sony would need GT right away it would never come out as perfect as GT3, we would have got the crappy GT2000.

People ask why where the SNK fighting games made with some much attention to detail?Thats because there was no pressure to finish the game quick so you can put it out on a schedule to impress another company.

[UCONN for life]

I really think that the Xbox 360 excitement is really gonna hurt it in the long run. It kinda seems like a "Diet PS3" so that really hurts it. Sony is in the best spot right now, because most people know enough about it to want it. Nintendo needs to turn a lot of heads quick, because they can definately catch up to Sony, but there are a lot of skeptics they need to convert.

[mrnagy88]

The PS3 and 360 are in one market, and the Nintendo is in a completely different price range.. they will barely affect one another, unless Nintendo gets all the 3rd party support, but it's not likely that we will see so many games ported between them, because the Revolution is less powerful...

We basically have a 2 firm oligopoly between Sony and the 360, and the closer they are together, the more they will try to offer us, if one of them can prove to consumers that it is the better console, they will gain market share... it's not like make-up or something, where you can change your products every month, they already released the 360, if they change it again in 3 years, only Microsoft will suffer...

I don't care who wins, I just want the best console to be on top, whoever makes the best machine deserves to be on top :-)

[GS kid]

wanted Nintendo to fall from it's #1 position, just not nearly as far as it has.
I want Sony to fall from it's #1 position too. I want Microsoft to win a round. But I want them to win by no more then 5 million consoles tops.


"Microsoft to win a round", when you're playing marbles you can win a round.

:roll:

When the PS2 was on top, THATS where the best games came out, cause as a company you are free to create.You dont have to waste money and time on promoting the console and the platform itself, and people work on the software, and promote software.

What you will see if its that close is a BS kiddie mudfight.Every staff member will be so focused on getting the console out there that the games will suffer from it, or course when you are under pressure to win consumers you need games NOW, so that means less developement time, more bugs.

An ICO or colossus would never be released if sony wouldn't be in the position to just risk it making these games.If sony would need GT right away it would never come out as perfect as GT3, we would have got the crappy GT2000.

People ask why where the SNK fighting games made with some much attention to detail?Thats because there was no pressure to finish the game quick so you can put it out on a schedule to impress another company.

That is like the dumbest logic. If it's the games that sell a system, then you don't need to advertise your system. The games do the talking for it.

So Sony would have to put their money into advertising and not the games if they aren't on top? What are they gonna say in the advertising? Buy our PS3 cuz it can play this great game ...er....a....um... well we don't have a game cuz we spent all our money on these ads! :roll:


Sony has plenty of money. And besides...... most of the games on the console aren't made by Sony, they are made by 3rd part devs. Their ads are multiplatform ads, so they are the same ads with all the console logos at the bottom of the page.

An even console field wouldn't hurt things at all.

[kudoshinchi]

i dont think its HUMANLY possible to insult NINTENDO. my reasons

THey got me into gaming 1!

They invented the game pad

They invented the rumble pak

They invented the analogue stick.

they invented 3d gaming like mario, they invented mario kart. They invented the DS

EVERY thing that Nintendo have ever done has ALWAYS pushed the envelope in one way or another. I totally believe SOny and Microsoft are guilty of the more power to the same old games.

where nintendo really want to see HOW to get my mum playing games. My missuss glued to nintendogs.

In one word Nintendo are AMAZING.

If nyone was gonna call me a fanboy id be proud to be a nintendo fanboy. Im just a fan of games, and nintendo made that fan, ME :D

I think its a totally different vibe this time to the gamecube, the gamecube tried to be a straight up games machine. What did it do groundbreaking like the revolution??

I think people will be surprised at nintendo this time. They arent in a console war. they are geniuses at making a console that costs less to buy and more importantly much less to produce, and they reap in profit from classic games.

Take the DS it costs 100 thousand to make a game on ds, but 1 million on the psp. its less than half the price and its absolutely destroyed the PSP in sales worldwide.

Lets be honest we all thought it would be close, and im sure nintendo did.

i honestly think that if they seperate themselves enough they will truelly shine. If people ever want to talk about stolen ideas, every single thing that is going on now is a stolen design of nintendos.

and i bet they will continue to dominate the innovation.

Since everyone already fighting about analog stick, I also to tell you that Nin didn't start first 3D gaming either, and sorry they didn't get into gaming first either. So three things are wrong but continue to argue.

[angelsky]

People need to remeber after Nintendo got turned down by Atari they went down and dirty, and curbed the makret for the Nintendo while the Master system (Yes, Sega had a system way back then too) got shanked and did bad. :cry:

They ain't pure, they all the same, it's just that Nintendo is so small compared to the other two, so it seems that they aren't like them, but all the same.

Don't forget Sony was double-crossed by Nintendo and as a payback Sony took its marketshare !!

[Crazy Phat]

i dont think its HUMANLY possible to insult NINTENDO. my reasons

THey got me into gaming 1!

They invented the game pad

They invented the rumble pak

They invented the analogue stick.

they invented 3d gaming like mario, they invented mario kart. They invented the DS

EVERY thing that Nintendo have ever done has ALWAYS pushed the envelope in one way or another. I totally believe SOny and Microsoft are guilty of the more power to the same old games.

where nintendo really want to see HOW to get my mum playing games. My missuss glued to nintendogs.

In one word Nintendo are AMAZING.

If nyone was gonna call me a fanboy id be proud to be a nintendo fanboy. Im just a fan of games, and nintendo made that fan, ME :D

I think its a totally different vibe this time to the gamecube, the gamecube tried to be a straight up games machine. What did it do groundbreaking like the revolution??

I think people will be surprised at nintendo this time. They arent in a console war. they are geniuses at making a console that costs less to buy and more importantly much less to produce, and they reap in profit from classic games.

Take the DS it costs 100 thousand to make a game on ds, but 1 million on the psp. its less than half the price and its absolutely destroyed the PSP in sales worldwide.

Lets be honest we all thought it would be close, and im sure nintendo did.

i honestly think that if they seperate themselves enough they will truelly shine. If people ever want to talk about stolen ideas, every single thing that is going on now is a stolen design of nintendos.

and i bet they will continue to dominate the innovation.

Since everyone already fighting about analog stick, I also to tell you that Nin didn't start first 3D gaming either, and sorry they didn't get into gaming first either. So three things are wrong but continue to argue.Wasn't the PS1 the console that created 3D gaming. Virtua Fighter was the premiere game that showed what 3D gaming was all about. Well at least from my experience.

[Ero_senin]

Ohh yeah nintendo invented the world!!! :lol: :lol: :lol:

Please be real they didn't invented anything they just apply some invented thigs to the video games.

[lordmadjack]

Wow, this has gone off topic...but I'll throw my two cents in ;)



No, Nintendo didn't "invent" any of those, but they did improve on them and use them quite well...


Sega's done it as has Sony, Nintendo, Microsoft and Atari and every other company

known to man,technology improves all the time, innovation doesn't always

come from invention...look at the Gameboy camera, innovative but ultimately held

back by technology...then the Eye Toy and now the Eye Toy 2 and the MS one as

well and each time new technology will push these ideas further...


So I say quit arguing over who invented this, or started that and enjoy the fact that

eventually all this amazing technology will be improved even further and in the end

Gamers like all of us are the true winners:D

[Venger]

I'd say DS proves Nintendo is onto something. It wasn't even meant to be a serious handheld, just a stop gap between the GBA and the next GB-whatever. It has sold like crazy on often simple, innovative games that sound lame but seem to be quite addictive to play. All they've done with revolution is take that idea, simple innovative gameplay to the consoles.

The challenge will be if they suffer the usual tech goof of the last few generations. N64 used cartridges purely because Mario64 worked best with them, it proved a major mistake against the far larger storage area of the PS1 cd based system. They went with a unique proprietary format for GC, and it couldn't play dvd movies. The question will be, how many modern gamers will go for pure gameplay on a machine not much more than double the power of their last console.

I have a feeling revolution is going to sell a lot, but not be considered a serious platform, it'll be the machine people pull out for having buddies over and playing goofy multiplayer games. But when people want to play a serious game they'll go to PS3 or 360. I doubt revolution will be compared against the other platforms for long. It'll find its own unique niche.

[lordmadjack]

Hmmm some good points, anyway I'll say one thing, it is DAMNED refreshing to finally see some PS3 love from(in my opinion) the most biased game site of all time...1UP :D

They have been putting down the PS3 every single chance they get! :evil:

[Dasimpse]

Ok ok let me rephrase my statement, imagine im KEn Kuteragi talking about Bacwards compatibilty on the playstation 3 lol.

Nintendo didnt invent those things but they were the first company to use them effectively. and show every one else why ITS ESSENTIAL for gaming to have those things.

i didnt say nintendo got into gaming, they got me into gaming.

and to the guy on the last page who said SONy BROUGHT IT TO THE MASSES. I DONT CARE LOL, I WAS PLAYING GAMES waaaaay before sony came allong and i still would be now, i just probably wouldnt be sivving through a milion "Stock car crash" games by midas to find something decent lol

maybe its who got you into gaming and you love them for it, but do remember there are MANY MANY gaming fans on these boards that Know what the original metal gear played like on the day of release. LIVES were changed by MARIO 3.

CHRONO TRIGGER, FINAL FANTASY 6, SECRET OF MANA 2.

Games that im sorry have killed all squares games they have released after INCLUDING FF7.

the fact is And im proud to say this. IF YOU KNOW ANYTHING about games, you cant hate nintendo, when sony are On their 9th console including handhelds i will give them the same respect. the only difference is i honestly think that if sony DROPPED to 20 million sales, you wouldnt see a playstation after that. I KNOW NINTENDO MAKE GAMES FOR THE LOVE OF THE ART. I cant say the same thing FOr MICROSOFT OR SONY!

[lordmadjack]

To say that Nintendo does it for the love of games is foolish, they're in it, like every

one TO MAKE MONEY...but guess what? If the games aren't fun then nobody will buy

them...will they. :D


Keep in mind the big N was at the top of the heap for many years, NES SNES and all

inbetween...and they would have stayed on top if they hadn't MADE BIG MISTAKES,

I love Nintendo but they have done stupid things...


I'm glad that your best days were on Nintendo, they make stellar games on great

platforms, but others were shown the love by Sony and others Sega and some only

on the PC, I love MArio as much as the next guy and happily await Twighlight

Princess, but to deny Sony is a VERY foolish thing, they're what made gaming

mainstream! They decided to break down the age barrier and allow M games on

their system (somthing that for a LONG time Nintendo wouldnt do) They also pushed

the "home entertainment system" in a new direction by including various other

medias, which was copied and improved upon by future machine (as mentioned in

my earlier post) Even Nintendo has copied that idea and decided that the Rev will

play DVD's...


However I digress, I respect your posistion and also admire Nintendo :D They are a

great company that makes great games and while not perfect, will continue to do so :D

[Chappers]

After having read all of people's opinions on here, my own personal opinion is as follows:

Nobody is safe in the console manufacturing business. Ask Atari. Ask Sega.

The console buying public is a fickle mistress to please.

Nintendo are the wisest of the remaining manufacturers, and the fact that they have stuck to their ethos of gaming deserves respect. But I think they are going blind to the bigger picture. I feel that they are turning more and more introverted and are in danger of going stale. Some fresh young blood could turn that around, and perhaps Revolution is that blood.

Sony are an interesting creature. A giant of the electronics world, and one who has seen it's fair share of downfall and bad press. It's become fashionable to knock Sony, possibly because of it's size and complacency. But times they are a-changing. Sony and Nintendo fell out a long time ago back in the days when Sony was to make a CD-drive add-on for the SNES, and I wonder if the wound has ever healed. But those who've followed Sony's progress these past couple of years will have observed a company that is shedding a skin. They seem to have received a big kick up the ass and are coming back fighting fit. The Playstation franchise has been a cash-cow for Sony, and I think they realise that they can't rest on their laurels, hence they seem to be trying to push the envelope in what they are trying to offer in the Playstation3 experience, and for that I am happy.

As for Microsoft, once considered (and still by some) to be the great evil of the computing world, they have the power and funds to do whatever they want, but it worries me how little vision they seem to have. They gave XBox1 a comparatively short lifespan, and by only giving XB360 a DVD9 drive I question just how far into the future they thought this generation would last before forcing it's adopters to pay for upgrades. Having used a 360 a lot, I, like other, just don't get that "next gen" feel from it yet.

[lordmadjack]

Well thought out post Chappers, I agree with nearly everything you've said :D

[Gersjann]

The challenge will be if they suffer the usual tech goof of the last few generations. N64 used cartridges purely because Mario64 worked best with them, it proved a major mistake against the far larger storage area of the PS1 cd based system. They went with a unique proprietary format for GC, and it couldn't play dvd movies.

Nice points Venger :wink:

That covers about 99% of the reasons why the PS1 outdid the N64 and the PS2 outdid the Gamecube. But since the Revolution now uses DVDs as a storage media, its biggest disadvantage is gone. And please anyone, dont come with the arguement that the PS3 use Blu-ray discs and all the storage space advantage it has over the ordinary DVD because it will output them in HD and take up tons more space than the games on the Revolution which will output all games in standard resolution, making it possible that the games on it to be bigger than those on the Xbox 360.

PS1 won because it had a much bigger ( At least 10 times the size, but games like Ocarina of time proved that you could make games big enough on the cartridge format and not a single game on the PS1 came close to that game except FF7 in my opinion)and cheaper storage media to develope games on. Cartridges was very expensive and the PS1 could play CDs, which were a big deal at that time.

PS2s biggest advantage wasnt the storage space over the Gamecube. Sure it had 2-3 times the space on the discs than the cubes 1.5 GB (90% of the games on the PS2 dont even fill up a single layer dvd disc and in the beginning they used cd rom(750 MB) as storage for the games. Talk about misleading...if you think about it, both the cube(1.5 GB) and the Dreamcast (1 GB)had bigger games in the beginning :lol: ), but the most important advantage it had over the cube was that the it used special/different type of discs, which again made it more expensive to develope games on them.

And ofcourse the #1 reason why PS2 became so popular in the beginning: It could play DVD movies! Now does that make a gameconsole or the games for it better than the other? Hell no!
Sony is the mediaking! Each time they release a console, they try to sell you a product that does all kind of things (Jack of all trades, master of none) so they could use those features as a backup in the beginning when obviously the first-gen games didnt/doesnt live up to the hype.

I will also say that many of theses things also counts for the 360 and all its mediacenter streaming abilities. I couldnt care less about those features either. Only reason they didnt build it in the console itself is that it would be to compete against themselves in the computer world making the PC obsolete. I also dont like the Microsoft monopoly in the computerworld, but i will not judge them on the quality because of that when it comes to the Xbox 360. That console is a completely different thing than windows on a PC.

And if people are put of with the Monopoly MS has in the computerworld like me, just watch what the PS3 could possible do! It is marketed as a super computer and tries to monopolise all multimedia in one box.
Blu-ray for movies! Cell for all computers/TVs..etc and the games themselves to rule the console world. MS current monopoly could look like childs play in comparisment :no

The worst thing that could happen is that PS3 sells 200 million units this next generation, MS doesnt succeed to even sell 20 millions+ like the first Xbox and Nintendo becomes only a software developer for Sony.
Then it will have no competition and will have no pressure, developing tons of crappy games like it did in the beginning before the Xbox came to the market. This is pretty much how i see the situation today. I see the PS2 as the quantity gaming console and not the quality gaming console as the Gamecube.

PS2 sure has some really spectacular games, but all those has come out in the later part of its lifecycle. Ofcourse some of the reason is that they finally learned to take advantage of the hard to develope games on hardware, but most of the reason is when MS entered the market. Sony doesnt look at Nintendo as a real competitior, but they sure do with MS. Why? Because MS has a ton of money and can stay in the console market for a long time and they are bound to be successful with something in the future if they try hard and many times enough.

MS is the only company which could enter the console market at that point in time taking losses in the billion dollar class and thank god for that happening keeping Sony on its toes. I still to this day refuse to believe that Sony would release the PS3 so soon or try to make it as powerful as it looks like its going to be, if it wasnt for MS breathing down theire neck.
Im sure they would have gone down the Blu-ray road anyway but thats another issue. Blu-ray isnt directly linked to automatickly every game being big and of amazing quality. Its made to once again trying to monopolise the movie industry making all companys paying royaltys to Sony for using it!

I buy a gameconsole to play games on them, not watching movies and stuff. I have a standalone player for that kind of entertainment and those will always be of better quality. I think its lame to watch movies on a gameconsole/pc :no

[lordmadjack]

Others however, may think differently Opinions are great that way:p ...I have many

friends who's only DVD player at first was a PS2, and they enjoyed it...I knew many

including myself who thought the MP3 abilities of downloading and playing music on

the Box was great. This is one of those mistakes I was talking about, Nintendo could

have saved themselves all kinds of grief by choosing the DVD format, space wise

and developer wise :D


Next point, I agree with some of your points, but some are skewed...The PS2 launch

library, while not perfect by any means was still decent and many were pleased, cool

games like SSX, TimeSplitters, Madden 2000 and DOA2 Hardcore kept people busy...

Also, remember the PS2 was against the well established and excellent Dreamcast

and it still did quite well :D While we're on the subject the PS2's only claim to

success was not only the DVD, but the fact that Sony like Nintendo before them had

built brand loyalty AKA fans of the PS wanted a PS2. Thats the reason I got one and

I know first hand thats the reason many of my friends got one as well, and due to

the PS2's success thats the reason I plan on purchasing a PS3...and the PS is the

second highest selling console of all time if I'm not mistaken :D That and the

superior hardware and capabilities always bring in the "graphic whores".


I find people are far too hard on the Box (both current gen and 360), true this is a

PS3 forum, but this type of close mindedness is sad. The Box was a fine system and

far more than Halo kept it afloat, my personal favorite being Deus Ex :D and the

360 while a tad on the weaker side this time will also pump out many stellar

exclusive hits, I'm sure.


Like I've said in this area where Sony came in and made Gaming mainstream and

added multifunctionality, others will follow, not one console next gen. only focus will

be gaming, just look at the Rev...DVD playability.

[tien]

Gersjann
Dedicated Member


The worst thing that could happen is that PS3 sells 200 million units this next generation, MS doesnt succeed to even sell 20 millions+ like the first Xbox and Nintendo becomes only a software developer for Sony.
Then it will have no competition and will have no pressure, developing tons of crappy games like it did in the beginning before the Xbox came to the market. This is pretty much how i see the situation today. I see the PS2 as the quantity gaming console and not the quality gaming console as the Gamecube.




MS is the only company which could enter the console market at that point in time taking losses in the billion dollar class and thank god for that happening keeping Sony on its toes. I still to this day refuse to believe that Sony would release the PS3 so soon or try to make it as powerful as it looks like its going to be, if it wasnt for MS breathing down theire neck.
Im sure they would have gone down the Blu-ray road anyway but thats another issue. Blu-ray isnt directly linked to automatickly every game being big and of amazing quality. Its made to once again trying to monopolise the movie industry making all companys paying royaltys to Sony for using it!




Sigh, I made these points countless times, do I ever get dignified with a response................NO(resoundlingly so).

Anyway, these words ring truest on this thread. Again, I always meant to find the link, but when MS released the xbox's specs, Sony was getting ready to RE-release the PS2 if necessary. An VU1 and VU0 that played nicer with the GS and EE. They also was going to raise the transistor count. Know what saved them, PS1 brand name, its timing to market and its 'cool' perception. Not to mention Lan Lorning stiffing oddworld fans. to me it was like, buy an xbox or else, that pissed me off, andafter that I cared less for Abe.

Most importantly, Siny did what MS did:
1) Nintendo acted like the gestapo to anyone who was not first party, I am not certain of all rules and regulations in publishing a game, but those who know , will know what I mean.

1A) Sony did not put a chokehold on devs, americn devs at that, and with the storage capacity, the PS1 was more attractive to develop for, let alone gave devs a chance to stick the middle fingah at Ninety.

2) Again, anyone who knows this, knows that american devs, and european devs where given manuals in japanese, had to learn assembly(which paid off later). But Sony's attitude(specially Ken's) was to deal with it and suck it up. SO MS only went around asking devs what they would like more in a console. turnabout is fair play. Ken those were acting kinda like ninety, in a more somber sense, but arrogant none the less. So know SOny is covering their bases, MS love em or hate em, only made things bettter for Sony fans.

Like em or not, and I do not want to see them beat SOny, but to succeed at least as much as the original xbox. But a one console market does not bode well, that is why I bid nintendo good luck and will no doubt have a revolution as my second console. So this Gersjann is right, if Sony snoozes, they will lose.

[Dasimpse]

People keep Telling me these numbers of how many SOny sold or nintendo used to slel , like that proves What a good game is.

Thats like Saying 50 cents album is the best music coz its sold the most when id much rather listen to some underground music that allot better and maybe sold a tenth of what 50 cent has.

You guys dont think halo 2 is very good, i think theres much better games but it sold millions upon millions.

UNIT SALES DONT MEAN GOOD GAMES, i think sony has the most developer support and i think sony made "GAMING" cool. Pls dont think that i dont think sony hasnt got really good games coz i think they do, but im just saying it isnt all about sales.

Oh and just so you know the super nintendo had the FX chip in its cartridges and released STUNT RACE FX and STARFOX,. the first games on home consoles to have 3d graphics so i guess nintendo did that first too :D


And im sorry, i know that Nintendo are in it for the money too, they are a business like every one else. I DO ALSO KNOW they do it for the LUV, and i can say that proudly and i think anyone who really KNOWS nintendo's past and future KNOW thats the truth.

THey will always bring the innovation!

[night52]

wow..at first evry1 on this thread was hating on the rev. but now its the same thing for sony..whats next? xbox :roll:

[ShinMaruku]

I blame the Wii. It's evil... :twisted:

[millionai3r3]

Its kind of funny, but I dont know 1 person who has bought anything from Nintendo since the NES, including myself. They all bought SONY or Microsoft, which is kind of sad because of how Nintendo started the industry really moving and creating. I still play my Nintendo emulator on my computer but thats about all the love that Nintendo gets.

[Dasimpse]

Its kind of funny, but I dont know 1 person who has bought anything from Nintendo since the NES, including myself. They all bought SONY or Microsoft, which is kind of sad because of how Nintendo started the industry really moving and creating. I still play my Nintendo emulator on my computer but thats about all the love that Nintendo gets.

every one i know buys something of nintendo it depends who you "roll" with

[Paradigm]

I’m amazed by the mixture of intelligence and lack of imagination in this topic. Some very insightful posts that remind me why I joined here in the first place and almost make me forgive the plague of idiots that have been bombarding the forums the past few months.

Addressing the innovative technologies that Nintendo has brought to the attention of the general public, yes they did not invent them but history rarely gives credit to the original inventors. That is unfortunately a cold hard fact of life. What we can, however, tip our hats to Nintendo for is finding these technologies, assessing their value for future use in the consumer market, and successful executing these technologies in the global market.

And who the Hell honestly thinks that Nintendo has been given too much credit? The truth is quite the opposite. If anything, Nintendo is the battered wife of this industry whose true value is underestimated because the abusers can get over their own shortcomings enough to realize Nintendo’s strengths and potential. I don’t think I have ever heard a true fan of the Xbox give Nintendo any credit beyond what the NES achieved. Which makes perfect sense since Xbox and Nintendo run their companies in completely different manners.

Arguably, one could say it reflects the mentality and mass consumer appeals of both respective countries. MS goes with the flashy, masculine-driven, high-budget, low-innovation approach and this is again not surprising considering the tenets held by the company and the demographic they shoot for. Graphics becomes these whores referendum, and this becomes all the more apparent when this advantage slips away from their greasy little fingers. Granted, this has its place in the console market, and is a guilty pleasure of mine, but in the end lacks any substance.

Nintendo on the other hand favors innovation, substance, “against the grain” mentalities, and the quirky personality inherit in all Japanese exports. Nintendo plays of off the mentality that we had when we where children, and so often lose when we enter adulthood. That is the true reason why people say they are a “kiddy” console. These people are the original “movers and shakers” of the industry. They have been around since the beginning (post collapse, and what I consider the true start of the way of life we know today) and they will be there for the end. Unfortunately with this mentality comes the risk of being labeled, having you products either miss-interpreted or not given attention at all. And of course worst of all arrogance. While that can be debated as a necessary trait of any person or company that aspires to be the best, the points become moot under the weight of cold hard facts. That hubris most often leads to the fall of those who covet it as an essential quality. This is where Nintendo needs to watch themselves very carefully. It has caught up to them before, and most certainly will again if they do not learn from the past.

Now it may seem I hold favoritism, and you are right. I despise Microsoft with the very essence of my being. Of course M$’ shortcomings are shared by both Nintendo and Sony, but none of them are capsulated into a company quite like M$.

In summation, Nintendo is as innovative as they come and I am absolutely positive they will prove this again to the entire world in the next five years. Sony will likely dominate the market, unless Nintendo’s ultimate goal of putting a console in every house is achieved on the most minimal of levels. M$ will learn yet another hard lesson (rushed launch, lack of next gen disc drive, & not enough software ) and will, while having notable successes, fall back to 3rd in both consumer mentality and market share.

[Dasimpse]

Excellent post apart from i Bought an xbox a year after it was launched i got a LAUNCH 360 and i luv nintendo.

I think sony and MS are companies that play safe like Miyamoto said himself, they dont push anything they depend on higher powered processors and more ram, which is a natural progression in gaming. Nintendo push everything.

Lets be honest do you think SOny or Microsoft would have started bringing retro games to their consoles if they didnt see the response NINTENDO got when they said the whole back catalogue of nintendo games will be availavle on the revolution.


I dont think they will ever recieve the respec they deserve.

I cant wait to see how Twighlight princess is gonna run with all the fancy extras on revolution!!!

[Terarrim]

In my mind Sony are being clever with the PS2. Some superb AAA titles coming out all the time on the PS2 and they can afford to drop the price on this console even more in the future. In my mind then the PS3 can go up against the Xbox 360, and the PS2 up against the Wii. Remember that in Japan there are allot more niche games on the PS2 that the Japanese love and thats why the PS2 are still selling like hotcakes over there.

[Zerostatic]

I honestlly have yet to the revolution make a splash with people aroudn me, they say it's rather stupid. LOL


II'd love for them to go the way of sega, they cna makes a lot of money that way.I'd say that's probably NOT going to happen, but that's just a hunch

[-Zaku-]

Well he hit the nail on the head: It seems like people just want the PS3 to fail.

For what reason? I don't know but it seems like people are just jumping on the 'PS3 Bashing' wagon.

[Uncool]

Banned and locked since necro-bumping of this proportion is uncalled for. >_>

[andres]

Still not arrived. Sony reckons they've sent it, but might be something to do with London postal strikes. Will let you know as soon as it lands.

[The_Only]

It's unfortunate that this postal strike thing has happend - so many other sites have got their reviews up already. Don't get me wrong, there's nothing you, I or anyone else can do about it, but it's just another thing that our wonderful "audience" will inevtiably bitch about.

[andres]

sent him a mail asking if he can send another one special delivery. NOt sure what he'll say.

Strange this, because I had Eye pet from the same guy and that's arrived two days after he posted it.

[The_Only]

Odd. :?

I'll keep my fingers crossed for ya.

[The_Only]

Steven informs me that they've sent out a new copy.

[The_Only]

Just so everyone knows, Steven has the game but is busy for much of this week, so he won't be able to provide a review until early next week (he said he's aiming for Monday)

At least the game is in our hands though, so there's no worrying about another delay thanks to the postal strikes.

[andres]

Played about an hour so far, going to spend Sat playing it and will be writing it up Monday. Expect to have it finished by Mond evening.

[The_Only]

Steven, do you reckon this will be ready for tonight?

[BustenRhymes7790]

...Steven?

This is a big review, and it's already quite late compared to all the other sites. I'm not blaming that on anyone, but some communication would be optimal.

[The_Only]

I'm going to email him now -- Steven always replies to emails very quickly, so it's the best way to reach him.

[The_Only]

Ok, I got a reply.

Basically, Steven's wife has received some very bad news and therefore he will be busy until next week and won't be able to write the review up until then. I won't go into detail as it's a private matter, but suffice to say he suggested we get someone else to do the review.

Ok, so, who wants it? We need to sort this asap. I'm staying at my dad's place until October 30 (I did mention this in my thread in the general section, so before you act surprised this was planned weeks ago) so I won't have access to a PS3 for another week, and I don't even own the game as it is.

I know, talk about bad timing but unfortunately there is nothing we can do about it. It seems that this game is bad luck for us or something.

Adam, Joseph, is there anyway you guys could do a review for this week some time? Steven said he'd happily write it up next week if we couldn't get someone else to do it, but i'm sure we can sort something out.

[Master]

Yeah we need this ASAP. I'd like to do it. Should I not bother waiting to get a review copy? I really don't have the money to buy one, but if I can get reimbursed, then it's fine.

[The_Only]

Adam, i'm on Gtalk now, let's have a chat.

[The_Only]

Adam is doing this -- I think he will have a review up tomorrow.

[Master]

I will do my best to have the review done by either tonight or tomorrow.

[Master]

I'm done with the review. I apologize that I only gave this one read (I'm extremely exhausted). I tried covering everything I could without putting it all out there. I hate to agree with all the critics, but man, this game is perfect - hence the 10/10. Borderlands and Chinatown Wars will be ready early next week.


Uncharted 2: Among Thieves Review

With the release of Uncharted 2: Among Thieves, Naughty Dog has created an epic game that rivals the storytelling of Hollywood’s best feature films, and seamless gameplay that sets a new benchmark for future titles. The stunning graphics and fluent cut-scenes deliver the ultimate visual presentation, while the tight action, puzzle, and navigation mechanics make this game king among titles of the current generation of consoles. The world comes alive right from the opening sequence through the numerous chapters that take you from snowy cliff-side towns, slum cities, and speeding trains. The action is intense, yet manageable, and the story is strong enough to keep you on the edge of your seat through the entire single-player campaign. Without hesitation, Among Thieves has solidified its spot high atop the best games this year, and quite possibly one of the best games of all time.

Among Thieves has already received enormous praise among reviewers and gamers alike, so it shouldn’t come as a huge surprise that we loved this game and have great admiration for Naughty Dog and the team that created this enormous spectacle. We gave Among Thieves a perfect score not because every aspect of the game was spot-on, but because the overall experience felt so far ahead of other titles that we were willing to forgive its minor flaws. After spending many hours playing through the single and multiplayer modes, we are left with are jaws dropped and our eyes open wide. Perhaps the only main complaint we have at this time is that we are so excited for the sequel, but Among Thieves will keep us busy for a long, long time.

Nathan Drake first strolled onto the PlayStation 3 with the release of 2007’s Uncharted: Drake’s Fortune. This arrogant treasure hunter could do just about everything – he could solve complex puzzles, scale across rooftops, climb stone walls, take down a small army of enemies with a couple of guns, silently eliminate single enemies, and of course, charm the pants of a girl or two. In Among Thieves, everything we loved about the original game was back, but tweaked just enough to make the controls tighter, the story deeper, the world (and levels) bigger, the scenery more lush, and the action faster and more intense. While many sequels seem to rest on the laurels of what the original game did right, without beefing up new elements, Among Thieves has the ideal balance of familiar gameplay with a healthy coat of polish.

Since many (if not all) of you have played the game, the multiplayer demo, or the original, we won’t get too technical with the actual gameplay mechanics. The basic duck and cover combat strategy returns in the sequel, along with numerous puzzles required to pass various obstacles, and a vast environment for Nathan to climb. Among Thieves takes all of these ‘old’ elements and makes them tighter and easier to use.

Combat in Among Thieves comes in different forms; it can be fast-paced gun battles or a strategic affair where you use the game’s settings to your advantage – hiding behind partially blown up walls, high on rooftops, or clinging to the side of a building. The duck and cover mechanic usually works great, but it’s not without its problems. Occasionally you’ll get stuck covering behind the wrong side of an object, or carelessly jumping to your death as you try to climb down a ladder. Despite the mild frustration, these problems certainly do not hinder the gaming experience.

The game picks up about a year or so after Drake’s Fortune. While most of you have probably already experienced the game, we don’t need to get into too many details, plus for anyone who hasn’t played it yet, we don’t want to give too much away. The basic story follows Nathan, who is searching for the remnants of Marco Polo’s expedition in search of Shangri La and the elusive Cintamani Stone. The game opens (sort of) with a British guy named Flynn, who, with the help of Chloe, tries to convince Drake to track down an old oil lamp from a Turkish museum. This lamp is believed to hold secrets to Polo’s lost expedition. Through a series of very unfortunate betrayals, Drake is set off to search for the stone, minus one British fellow. Familiar faces from Drake’s Fortune return in Among Thieves, so you won’t spend the game alone. In fact, much of the game is played with A.I. companions.

In most other games, A.I. partners are more of hassle than they are worth, but Among Thieves finally gets it right – perfect, in most cases. Your A.I. companions are so incredibly lifelike, that the dialogue feels more like a TV show or a movie instead of a game. As cliché as it sounds, the character development is so strong and deep that we could easily imagine each of their back-stories. Everyone you encounter in the game, minus the countless barrages of bad guys, seems to have a reason to be there – no one is just thrown in. This is a testament not only to the well crafted story, dialogue, and cut-scenes, but also to how each character (ally or enemy) interacts within the environment. In one particular level, Drake has to carry out Elena’s mortally wounded cameraman from a city in Nepal that’s in the midst of a revolution. Chloe and Elena guide you through a hail of gunfire, as you sluggishly work your way through the city. Each A.I. character moves so willfully that at one point we forgot we had to help carry the poor dying cameraman. Naughty Dog has evolved the way we interact with A.I. in games, and raised the bar for future titles.

The environments are extremely expansive and rich. Because there is such a variety in each level, you really feel like you can approach a battle anyway you like. If you fancy throwing a couple grenades into a crowd of bad guys then running for nearby cover, go for it. On the other side of the coin, if you want to keep your identity hidden for as long as possible, you can hide in the shadows and wait for an unsuspecting enemy to walk by, ultimately meeting their demise at your quick hands. You can easily climb to rooftops to get a bird’s eye view of the action below, or run and gun your way through the swarms of enemies. The choice is really up to you and it helps to break up the otherwise linear story elements.

The puzzles in Among Thieves also got a bit of a facelift. Your new journal really comes in handy in solving some of the more difficult puzzles. Among Thieves brings back similar puzzles from Drake’s Fortune, but this time around they feel much bigger and important. The bulk of some levels are almost entirely made up of puzzles, and you really do have to put some time into solving some of the more elaborate ones. Given their importance, solving the puzzles really feels like a victory.

Everyone is drooling over the graphics in Among Thieves, and with good reason – it’s absolutely gorgeous. The gameplay elements are just as stunning as the cinematic scenes, and you’ll find yourself taking breaks to soak in the lush environments – especially in the mountain levels. Everything about the graphics is breathtaking, from the brilliant lighting effects to the more basic hair and clothes of the characters. All the commercials that joke around about a gamer’s girlfriend thinking Among Thieves is a movie are pretty accurate – it looks as good as, if not better than, the best that Hollywood can throw our way. When you mix in the well-told story and lifelike voice acting, it’s clear that this is one of the rare games where it’s almost as fun watching it as it is playing it. But with so much to see and collect you’ll definitely want to take the helm and play through every minute of the game.

All of this is great, but what makes the Uncharted 2 experience so far beyond what we’ve played recently is the inclusion of multiplayer modes. Naughty Dog could have sold the multiplayer elements as a game in and of itself; it’s just that good. Multiplayer modes come in the form of co-op and competitive online action. There are tons of different modes, including a deathmatch, treasure hunt (like capture the flag), and elimination. The levels are all ripped right from the single-player campaign, so it will be familiar and beautiful all at the same time. Pretty much everything you can do in the single-player mode you can do in the multiplayer mode, making this one of the best online competitive experiences we’ve had lately.

Online cooperative comes in several forms, including a survival mode that pins you and a group of friends against swarms of enemies, increasing in difficulty as the game progresses. The co-op mode also allows you to jump in various situations with friends, drawn directly from the single-player campaign, but with much more advanced combat. You’ll want to use a headset to communicate with your friends because the action will come at you fast, with a barrage of enemies.

Uncharted 2: Among Thieves is one of those rare games that deserve a perfect score. Even if every second is not flawless, the game as a whole is so breathtakingly beautiful and exciting to play, that we can forgive the few moments of frustration. Drake’s Fortune set the bar very high for this generation of console gaming, and Naughty Dog again raised the bar, widening our expectations for future titles. We haven’t played a game so well developed in ages. Sure, there are plenty of excellent games out there, and the PS3 is home to many (LittleBigPlanet, Killzone 2, among others), but Among Thieves is so epic and so exhilarating to experience that we feel it reigns supreme on Sony’s black box. There may be people out there that don’t enjoy Among Thieves, and we can understand that this is probably for the more serious gamer, but without a doubt, we feel there is something for everyone to enjoy. Whether it’s the breathtaking graphics, killer story line, or intense and strategic action, Among Thieves has given Sony another reason to brag.

Final Score: 10

We Liked:
The stunning visuals that draw you into the complex and engrossing story.
The strategic and fast-paced combat.
The breathtaking experience that is created by a marriage of stellar gameplay, beautiful graphics, and exciting action.

We Disliked:
The occasional snag in controls.
Having to wait for Uncharted 3 (but, UC2 gives us plenty to do in the meantime).

Bottom Line:
With Among Thieves, Naughty Dog has shattered the gaming bar it created in 2007’s Drake’s Fortune. This is quite possibly the best game one the PS3, and one of the best created games ever.

[The_Only]

Brilliant, i'll get to this immediately after i've had breakfast.

Nice job Adam, at least we can have this up before the end of the week.

[The_Only]

Ok, i'm done editing this and will get it live once i've picked some good images for the review. I've also got a FC image done.

Great review overall Adam, especially considering you had to plough through the game in just one or two days. Only a couple of tweaks here and there, but again, good stuff.

[BustenRhymes7790]

Mike, after you put a review live, please go and look at every page of the live version to make sure the screenshots are in the right place, and aren't being pushed down by the "Summary" box at the top. I had to delete one screen and move another to make the Uncharted 2 review look ok.

[BustenRhymes7790]

And I'll tidy up the FC stuff for this as well.

Mike, the small image for the FC should generally be the game's logo.

[The_Only]

Ok, gotcha. Sorry about that, I was admittedly rushing the FC part since I just wanted to get this up. Believe it or not, though, there was alot of positive reaction to the review. Some people even credited us for getting it up late -- crazy, considering how hostile have been in the past regarding the timing of content.

[highazz_vegeta]

True, but the fact is that we've been churning out our reviews very late as of late. We'd get more hits and keep more respect if these were out on-time. I don't want people to start expecting our reviews to be late.

[BustenRhymes7790]

Reading this now and giving it a thorough second edit—I've already spotted a few issues (but nothing too major so far). Still, our Uncharted 2 review should be spotless.

[andres]

Nice one Adam. :D

[The_Only]

You know, i'm about 95% through this game, and I have to say that even though it's a superb game in its own right, I was slightly disappointed by it. There's something about it that didn't grab me as much as the first game, specifically, the locations.

I just found the Island of the original game far more appealing, as it's far more routed in mystery and intrigue than much of the locations of the sequel. For example, you spend a lot of Uncharted 2 in urban locations such as the city, trainyard, and onboard the train itself. Also, the copious amounts of generic military guys you fight really got stale after a while, as there seems to be more of them this time around, and it seems Naughty Dog still hasn't learned its lesson from the original game -- give us more variety in enemies. How about some indiginous wildlife?

Also, regarding the monestary and other 'ancient' locations, again, they just didn't appeal to me as much as the original game. They were far more expansive, yes, but I felt like you didn't have time to sink your teeth in to them and explore. I prefered the more tighter, corridor-type areas found in Uncharted: Drake's Fortune, where you got to explore catacombs, and the gun fights seemed far more spaced out and better paced.

If I were to try and sum things up, i'd say that the stage where you and Sully locate the corpses of Marco Polo's fellow voyagers really felt like the Uncharted I wanted to experience - the rest of the game felt totally different. This area, however, felt a lot like the original game.

Anyway, I felt I had to share that. As I said, it's still a great game, and the story and acting is superb, but the original game is still the best imo. Shambala is incredible but it comes FAR too late in the game. Had we explore more location such as this instead of creeping around museums and fighting helicopters in Modern Warfare-esque locales I expect this would have been my GotY.

[highazz_vegeta]

It certainly expanded on a direction I liked, but I like a lot. The lack of original locale expansion wasn't really an issue for me; the graphics were enough to tie me over. I mean, just the train mission alone -- travelling from the jungles to the snowy mountains while fighting baddies off a train is fun enough without the superb graphics. So yeah