PDA

View Full Version : PS3 and the 360: The race to 65nm



$e73n
02-06-2007, 09:26
Interesting read, but i think that the sales will also be affected hevily by the games, i would personally pay more if one console had better games than its competition.



There have always been game consoles that competed directly against each other for sales, market share, and third-party support. Today, the battle is very much between Microsoft's Xbox 360 and Sony's PlayStation 3, with Nintendo opting to play a different kind of game with the Wii. As the 360 and PS3 are closely matched in terms of performance and the types of games they play, the winner may be the company that reduces the cost of their platform the fastest.

One of the best ways to reduce manufacturing costs of any high-end electronic devices is to use a die shrink, where a more fine-grained optical process allows more transistors to be packed into the same area. In the case of a game console, the same number of transistors can be delivered in a smaller area and with lower power dissipation, lowering the cost of manufacturing the console by lowering the cost per-chip and cutting down on the amount of active cooling needed.

For both the 360 and PS3, the big move is from a 90nm process to a 65nm one. Sony indicated in a recent press conference that the company had already started production of parts of the PS3 chipset on a 65nm process. Microsoft had previously announced, along with its manufacturing partner Chartered Semiconductor, that the Xbox CPU would be moving to 65nm Silicon-on-Insulator (SOI) technology in the first quarter of 2007, although there are rumors that this migration may not be complete until the second quarter.

How much could each company save by this migration? A report (http://www.digitimes.com/bits_chips/a20070202VL200.html) in the Chinese-language paper Commercial Times estimates that Microsoft could reduce the cost of the CPU, northbridge, and GPU on the 360 from about $200 to $150 with a 65nm migration. The research firm iSuppli estimated (http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20061116-8239.html) that the total bill-of-material (BOM) cost of the Premium Xbox 360 is down to about $323 from $525 at launch (http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20051123-5621.html), which would significantly help Microsoft's margins.
iSuppli puts the BOM cost of the premium PS3 at $840, which means Sony is losing as much as $240 on each unit. A similar component price reduction from the move to a 65nm process would lower this loss to under $200 per console.

If Sony completes the transition first, it will allow the company to execute the much-rumored (http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20070202-8759.html) price drop on the PS3, which can't come soon enough for Sony's flagship console. The PS3 sold well out of the gate but sales have tapered off as the non-early-adopting public waits for more compelling games and a lower sticker price. As for the 360, it has sold moderately well so far, with Microsoft estimating 10.4 million units delivered to retailers, but if Microsoft wants to maintain their lead over the PS3 they will likely have to drop their price as well. Microsoft has been coy about discussing any 360 price drops, although they did once say that consumers could expect one cut per year. (http://arstechnica.com/journals/thumbs.ars/2005/9/19/1284)

It is worth noting that Nintendo also benefited from process shrinks with the Wii, although their strategy was to take similar technology from the GameCube with more modest improvements (a higher clock speed, mostly) and gain the cost benefit of the die shrink right away. So far, their gamble has paid off, as Wiis continue to be in short supply.

LaOMaN
02-06-2007, 09:31
sony hardware company they know what there doing. ms will take a little bit more time

jackf
02-06-2007, 09:50
That $840 price tag that iSuppli quoted for the ps3 has already been claimed to be heavily bloated... but what ever. I think PS1/2 emulation in conjunction with a die shrink is what it will take for Sony to consider a price drop of a significant amount. if they do that i could see 100-150 off the 60GB PS3 by next spring. Emulation will take time to fine tune even after it is released so dont expect the hardware to be removed this year.

Pez_555
02-06-2007, 09:57
i just wish they would hurry up with the price drop and 65nm so i can buy another 360.

Gturismo1
02-06-2007, 11:10
I say we won't see a price drop until sales after the Euro Launch taper off. As long as Sony is selling them as fast as they can make them, where is the incentive for a price drop.

But when some major AAA titles start hitting around Fall/Winter 2007, that's when I see the console dropping in price. But to be competitive, it must be a significant price drop. So their homework right now should be streamlining manufacturing, developing killer titles, and working on anything and everything to get a price drop come the holidays this year.

If they can get the PS3 down to where the 360 will be after its price drop, this console war will get very interesting.

PS3 rocks
02-06-2007, 11:15
If Sony could drop the price by $50-$70 during holiday season 2007 then that could be very benificial for the PS3.

Gturismo1
02-06-2007, 11:20
If Sony could drop the price by $50-$70 during holiday season 2007 then that could be very benificial for the PS3.

Also, bundling a game could also help push sales...

seebs
02-06-2007, 11:37
The article is partially right about the Wii. Yes, the process is smaller than what they used in the Gamecube, but it was just to 90nm. They could go to 65nm in the future, and probably get a noticeable improvement in power usage. (Well, not so noticeable; it's obvious that it can't save them more than 19W.)

Jabjabs
02-06-2007, 13:16
Well that's true seebs there would be an advantage for it's stand by mode since it pulls about 10W when like this.

Grym
02-06-2007, 13:20
Also, bundling a game could also help push sales...

Yea, Resistance should be bundled. But I guess it would be Genji or Gundam. ;)

ruiner
02-06-2007, 13:39
I don't think reducing silicon area is going to help much power usage as 65nm processors leak comparatively much more than 90nm and there is also much more quality variation between individual chips. I wonder how M$ is going to tackle temperature problems with 65nm processor (other than installing bigger and noisier fan :)


The article is partially right about the Wii. Yes, the process is smaller than what they used in the Gamecube, but it was just to 90nm. They could go to 65nm in the future, and probably get a noticeable improvement in power usage. (Well, not so noticeable; it's obvious that it can't save them more than 19W.)