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  1. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by ttech10 View Post
    I remember recently reading something about EA having Mercenaries 2 exclusive to the PS3 so you can cancel that one. R* has yet to say anything about GTA4 on PC. RAGE? When was that announced it would come out in '08? Devil May Cry 4... unlike with the 2 consoles Capcom has not said a release date for the PC with this one.

    Then you have all these "AAA exclusives", well 8. You even listed ones that are a new series and no one has even played yet. I could do the same with the PS3. Haze, Metal Gear Solid 4, Killzone 2, Resistance 2, Getaway, Eight Days, Gran Turismo 5, Final Fantasy XIII, Mercaneries 2 (listing because company still says PS3 exclusive), Infamous, SOCOM: Confrontation, Jak and Daxter... etc.

    So there's 12 good PS3 exclusives for next year, not to mention all the other exclusives that I didn't list because they're not as looked forward to. Add to that the ones that are also coming out on other systems and I'd say that it beats the PC list.

    Oh yea, and PS3 users won't have to spend more money to upgrade something in there PC so that they can play the game to its highest potential.

    I like PC gaming but I mean... the only game that I HAVE to buy on it is Crysis. I think more people care about the exclusives that come out on either the PS3 or 360 and probably the only exception to that is WoW.
    "Is Mercenaries 2 exclusive to the PS3?
    Mercs 2 will be available on the 360, PS2 and PC, in addition to the PS3."
    From official site.
    DMC4 is also annouced for PC, just like all the previous games. Do some research.

    Want to compare AAA exclusives?
    Starcraft 2
    Empire: Total War
    Spore (exclusive version)

    Sins of a solar Empire
    Dragon Age (Bioware RPG)
    Guild Wars 2
    Warhammer Online
    WoW: Lich King
    Far Cry 2
    Storm of War: Battle Of Britain

    10 AAA PC exclusives, and that's from just the list below by a quick check.
    Now PS3:

    GT5
    Killzone 2
    Metal Gear Solid 4
    Eight Days
    Infamous

    Just 5 confirmed AAA for PS3... tsk tsk.

    Haze? I'll bet all my money it won't be an exclusive and it'll come out on 360/PC a few months later. I think the game won't be great anyway.
    Getaway? The last 2 games had very average reviews, so why put it as AAA?
    Socom? none of their games were AAA to begin with, so I doubt they'll start now.
    FF13? Think 2009.
    Resistance 2? If resistance is AAA then I could add 5 or 6 more 'AAA' games to the PC.
    Jak and Daxter? no videos and no release dates yet.

    10 PC vs 5 PS3.....

  2. #127
    Frag_Gordon
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    RSX=240 mm2
    G70 (7800 GTX)=334 mm2 (110 nm)
    G71 (7900 GTX)=196 mm2
    G73 (7600 GS)=126 mm2

    Manufacturing process
    RSX 90 nm
    G70 110 nm
    G71 90 nm
    G73 90 nm

    Transistor count:
    RSX 300M+
    G70 300M
    G71 278M
    G73 177M

    Memory connection:
    RSX 128 bit GDDR3 (650-700 MHz) and 128 bit XDR (3,2 Ghz)
    G70 256 bit GDDR3 (600 MHz)
    G71 256 bit GDDR3 (800 Mhz)
    G73 128 bit GDDR3 (700 MHz)

    Memory bandwith:
    RSX 22,4 GB/s+35 GB/s=57,4 GB/s
    G70 38.4GB/s
    G71 51.2 GB/s
    G73 22.4GB/s

  3. #128
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    just going back over the old s***t

    "NVIDIA contacted us today after we published the "PlayStation 3 GPU Less Powerful than GeForce 7800" story based on a report found at The Inquirer. Derek Perez, NVIDIA's Director of Public Relations, was kind enough to provide us the actual paragraph from the September issue of PSM. Here is the information from the blurb in question:

    There's no doubting that NVIDIA's new 7800GTX is the ultimate in PC graphics technology. The card's G70 GPU, which is more than twice as powerful as two of NVIDIA's previous top-of-the-line 6800 boards, shares a lot of similar workings with the PS3's RSX chip - only it isn't as fast. Oh, and it retails for $599.
    The article actually says the GeForce 7800 GTX is not as fast as the RSX graphics processing unit that NVIDIA developed for the PlayStation 3.
    "

    also of amusing interest was the old unified shader argument

    "Unified v separate on the PC, and Nvidia’s stance
    Nvidia have previously stated in public that they do not believe that unified shader architectures are the way forward. Windows Graphics Foundation 2, the version of DirectX that will ship with Longhorn, will be designed around the idea that the graphics card will have unified vertex and pixel pipelines, but will not require that to be the case. Given that ATI is working with Microsoft now on unified parts on next-gen DirectX, whilst Nvidia is saying that it doesn’t think this is the best idea, does Richard think that Nvidia will suffer, in the long run, on the PC platform from not following Microsoft?

    “I’d love to say yes… I’d love to say that Nvidia are going to be stuck when it comes to Longhorn. But actually I do think they will have a unified shader architecture by the time WGF2 comes around. This time around, they don’t have the architecture and we do, so they have to knock it and say it isn’t worthwhile. But in the future, they’ll market themselves out of this corner, claiming that they’ve cracked how to do it best. But RSX isn’t unified, and this is why I think PS3 will almost certainly be slower and less powerful.
    "


    looking at the G80

    For GeForce 8800 GT Tech Specs, please click here.

    NVIDIA® Unified Architecture
    Unified shader architecture
    GigaThread™ technology
    Full support for Microsoft® DirectX® 10
    Geometry shaders
    Geometry instancing
    Streamed output
    Shader Model 4.0
    Full 128-bit floating point precision through the entire rendering pipeline "

  4. #129
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    Who cares if the PC has a couple of more so called AAA titles than the PS3? There is a bigger chance I buy all those titles on the PS3 than the equal amount for my PC, even though the titles are cheaper for the PC. The only two PC titles I will buy are Starcraft 2 and WoW:WotLK (which shouldn't be included in the list since it is an expansion imho) but I probably end up buying 10 PS3 games next year.

    Comparing AAA titles between the PS3 and the Xbox 360 is more valid as I see it. I'm just a bit tired of buying computer games as most likely I end up wanting to buy new hardware as well because the new game won't run properly.

    Anyway, enough of the game comparison as this thread was about the GPU's, which in itself is irrelevant as well. Personally I don't care if the RSX isn't as good as the newer chipsets for the computers... I would never want the situation on the PC for my console anyway, that sort of defies the purpose of them. I rather have the lesser hardware which the developers can optimise the hell out of.

  5. #130
    AFSOCOM
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    Thinking about it the PS3 indirectly uses unified shader architecture through the Cell and RSX. So while, no, the RSX isn't a unified shader GPU. Developers can utilize the cell to do whatever they'd like in that sense. That's the beauty of the 2 working together.

  6. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by daggy View Post
    "Is Mercenaries 2 exclusive to the PS3?
    Mercs 2 will be available on the 360, PS2 and PC, in addition to the PS3."
    From official site.
    DMC4 is also annouced for PC, just like all the previous games. Do some research.

    Want to compare AAA exclusives?
    Starcraft 2
    Empire: Total War
    Spore (exclusive version)

    Sins of a solar Empire
    Dragon Age (Bioware RPG)
    Guild Wars 2
    Warhammer Online
    WoW: Lich King
    Far Cry 2
    Storm of War: Battle Of Britain

    10 AAA PC exclusives, and that's from just the list below by a quick check.
    Now PS3:

    GT5
    Killzone 2
    Metal Gear Solid 4
    Eight Days
    Infamous

    Just 5 confirmed AAA for PS3... tsk tsk.

    Haze? I'll bet all my money it won't be an exclusive and it'll come out on 360/PC a few months later. I think the game won't be great anyway.
    Getaway? The last 2 games had very average reviews, so why put it as AAA?
    Socom? none of their games were AAA to begin with, so I doubt they'll start now.
    FF13? Think 2009.
    Resistance 2? If resistance is AAA then I could add 5 or 6 more 'AAA' games to the PC.
    Jak and Daxter? no videos and no release dates yet.

    10 PC vs 5 PS3.....
    funny you say ONLY 5 ps3 exclusives for 2008.

    And oh, you act like those TEN pc exclusives are Triple A titles .



    Starcraft 2: Never played the first one but ive heard a lot, so yes this one will own.

    Empire total war:...?...please.

    Spore "exclusive version": tell me what do you mean by this?.

    Sins of a solar Empire: Sounds like a Very TRIPLE AAA title indeed..>.>.

    Dragon Age (Bioware RPG): Zoftmog!...Teh bioware makez thiz game!!. so it must mean its OWNAGE right?.

    Guild Wars 2: Guild wars sucked.

    Warhammer Online: SUCKS.

    WoW: Lich King: WoW....You know what, im fine with this, this is a AAA title too!, not just an expansion pack >.>.

    Far Cry 2: Yes, it will be ownage.

    Storm of War: Battle Of Britain: Please, dont mention some stupid arse game that you THINK might be good.



    And hey!, i can mention some games that are exclusive to the ps3 too!, and you probably never heard of em, doesnt mean they are going to be AAA titles.

    THE ONLY GAMES in that list that stand a chance against PS3's Little big planet, MGS4 and Killzone 2 "just to mention a few"...ARE...Far cry2 and starcraft 2.

  7. #132
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    Quote Originally Posted by AFSOCOM View Post
    Thinking about it the PS3 indirectly uses unified shader architecture through the Cell and RSX. So while, no, the RSX isn't a unified shader GPU. Developers can utilize the cell to do whatever they'd like in that sense. That's the beauty of the 2 working together.
    No unified shader architecture, that's not how it works. I understand what you are saying, but it's incorrect. We can make points in that manner all day long and they will never be correct.
    "you are both the product and the architect of your environment"


  8. #133
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    can you explain to be how cell can make rsx use a unified shader architecture???

    regardless the point I was making wasn't whether one was better than the other but rather that the rsx = g70 chipset not g80. ie that rsx is roughly the equivilent of the 7800/7900 given it uses the same basic architecture.

    which is fine and as would be expected

  9. #134
    Bust Nak
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    Quote Originally Posted by psycho_rez View Post
    Empire total war:...?...please.
    ...
    ...
    THE ONLY GAMES in that list that stand a chance against PS3's Little big planet, MGS4 and Killzone 2 "just to mention a few"...ARE...Far cry2 and starcraft 2.
    Oooo, that's fighting talk! You can't just dismiss those games like that. How about if I say:
    killzone 2: killzone sucked.
    Little big planet:...?...please.
    etc...

  10. #135
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    Quote Originally Posted by psycho_rez View Post
    funny you say ONLY 5 ps3 exclusives for 2008.

    And oh, you act like those TEN pc exclusives are Triple A titles .



    Starcraft 2: Never played the first one but ive heard a lot, so yes this one will own.

    Empire total war:...?...please.

    Spore "exclusive version": tell me what do you mean by this?.

    Sins of a solar Empire: Sounds like a Very TRIPLE AAA title indeed..>.>.

    Dragon Age (Bioware RPG): Zoftmog!...Teh bioware makez thiz game!!. so it must mean its OWNAGE right?.

    Guild Wars 2: Guild wars sucked.

    Warhammer Online: SUCKS.

    WoW: Lich King: WoW....You know what, im fine with this, this is a AAA title too!, not just an expansion pack >.>.

    Far Cry 2: Yes, it will be ownage.

    Storm of War: Battle Of Britain: Please, dont mention some stupid arse game that you THINK might be good.



    And hey!, i can mention some games that are exclusive to the ps3 too!, and you probably never heard of em, doesnt mean they are going to be AAA titles.

    THE ONLY GAMES in that list that stand a chance against PS3's Little big planet, MGS4 and Killzone 2 "just to mention a few"...ARE...Far cry2 and starcraft 2.
    It just really shows that you know nothing about PC games:

    Empire: Total War -- the sequel of the award winning 'Rome:Total War', which was one of the best RTS in the last few years with 92% average on Metacritic.

    Spore -- It's coming also to DS and Mobile, but they're different versions.

    Sins of a solar Empire -- Very experienced developers behind this game, and trully amazing visuals that all graphic whores will enjoy, with a combat 'Homeworld'-like.

    Dragon Age -- Not so much that it's Bioware, but it's more that Dragon Age is the spiritual sequel of Baldur's Gate!!

    Guild Wars 2 -- preferences, if you didn't like it, it's because it's not your thing. I enjoyed the first Guild Wars actually, very deep gameplay.

    Warhammer Online -- Supposedly the WoW killer, and it comes from a well-known franchise.

    WoW: Lich King -- it might be an expansion pack, but it's an AAA expansion pack that has a bigger gameplay-life than most games and that will be one of the best-selling titles next year.

    Storm of War: Battle Of Britain -- tsk tsk, if you were an hardcore PC gamer you would've atleast heard about Maddox, the developers of the best Flight Sim of this decade (IL-2 Sturmovik, 91% Metacritic). It will beat the crap out of Warhawk and Ace Combat 6, trust my words.

    Oh yeah, I forgot PS3 has LBP too, so 10 PC vs 6 PS3 AAA exclusives. Just admit it, PC has more and bigger exclusives.

  11. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lefein View Post
    I've been trying to tell ya'll! Show me a PC game that has an animation system on par with Uncharted... exactly! It's always been apples and oranges and all those people telling you that the RSX is a 7800 are just trying to feel better about their console of choice. Don't always believe what you hear on the internet. Is the shader logic probably NV47 based? Probably, but calling RSX a 7800 because of that is tantamount to calling a Harley Davidson motorcycle "car" because it has wheels that spin!
    I hope your not saying that the PS3 is above PCs in graphical abilities in that first sentence?


    Im back.


  12. #137
    -=*7*=-
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hexadecimal View Post
    Everyone remembers this slide:


    Video cards in PC's are limited by the bus connecting them, a PCI-Express bus has a maximum bandwidth of 8GB/sec read and 8GB/sec write

    The bus between Cell and RSX in the PS3 is 15GB/sec read and 20GB/sec write
    This slide does not say exactly what the RSX is and it certainly doesn't say it's any one of the PC cards Nvidia has put out (76xx,78xx, 7950 or even 8800 GPU's). If you want to take this ignorant supposition further, even the 8800 could be said to be nv47 based and you'd be right, because it is all part of the Nvidia Family!

    RSX just being nv47 based doesn't mean jack...t! How many cores are there, could it have more cores or more or other processors on it? Could it perhaps have streaming processors as the nv82 and nv92? These are the basic distinctions that separate the Nvidia generations of graphics processors. The only thing new in GPU's is Unified Shader Model with not only more processors, but actual STREAMING PROCESSORS (though a GPU can be called a streaming platform itself, it doesn't need streaming processors for that)!

    A sure means of testing this all out, is to compare the rendering abilities of the PS3 to a PC with an Nvidia 8800 GPU, along with say the Xbox 360 with Xenos. Then we have something to go by. It can't be the actual displaying of a scene either, as these should all be similar to one another (a scene being a timed sequence of events, animations, sound and pictures). The performance difference of platforms can only be judged by the loading time of the same exact scene, with all the same complex texture rendering, sound and animations. Along with other aspects involved in the rendering and displaying of a game scene on each platform.

    For our purposes, ProFX Engine runs texture rendering graphics, and Epic's UE3 Engine is being used for animations and audio in this "Bayou Demo" Benchmark. This is about as close as we are ever going to get comparing hardware performance specs to give us our answer as to just what, is possibly under the hood of the RSX/Cell run PS3 Platform!

    Now I'm pretty well fed up with Sony's, Nvidia's and many of you on this forum, insisting on linking the RSX to being a nv47 chip only. Without any modifications or more likely additions. Everyone is denying some facts and believing false information that makes the RSX out to be simply an unaltered nv47 chip. These companies have falsely kept the truth tied up in multiple contradictions, even in their own information releases (and that chart above). With us PS3 fans groping at justifying buying a PS3 while being attacked in here from all sides defending it. While these corporations let us all get slammed for having recogized what you people are afraid to face about all of these Corporations.

    Because, if the truth was known, these companies like Microsoft, Nvidia and Sony would have a hard time selling you their Operating Systems and PC hardware designed around planned obsolescence. When the fact remains the PS3 is a closed box design that is not modular or upgradeable. Except by software and firmware released to reveal hidden or disabled features (similiar to MS telling us Xbox 360 was only capable of 720P and didn't have a scaler in it). But the power and computing potential certainly are upgradable on either of these consoles and this is the only reason neither Sony nor Nvidia have announced exactly what the RSX is, to the World!

    With a little logical exercise in deductive reasoning, we can come to a reasonable conclusion as to if we (so called fools by you people) bought a gimped last generation, over priced, PC GPU in the OVER PRICED, MONSTER COST to build PS3 (that you people claim Sony was fool to build). Especially if it costs what isuppli said it does (a whole 30% more than the Cell BE itself)!

    I'll tell you what, if I am a hardware manufacturer, I'm sure as h*ll not going to pay more than triple the cost of an nv47 7800 chip and over a third more than my main CPU Processor chip to build it. We have companies like Sony that are only too happy to let us wallow in the ignorance of these known facts. Simple logic and reasoning should lead us to understand that the RSX is NOT simply an NV47 based chip, but has lots of other goodies still hidden, when properly related to actual Benchmark Performance!

    Here's the first reason that proves this point. NONE of these PC nv47 based Nvidia GPU's have "Streaming Processors" (we know how many and the type of processors each of the 7800 series GPU's have, but not the RSX). What we do know is the 8800 series does have streaming processors and this along with Unified Shader Model, is the biggest difference between the generations. It's why a PC with an 8800 GPU has been benchmarked with half the loading time of the Xbox 360! As both a 7800 and Zenos are fairly comparable. Right? ....and the Xenos should even be better than the 7800 nv47 chip at loading up ProFX's "Bayou" Demo. Right? Load time for a Core Duo PC w/Nvidia 8800 = 5 seconds on these benchmarks. Benchmark for loading same demo on a similar machine with the 7800 GPU 12 seconds. Time for Xbox 360 to load "Bayou Demo" ??? Just 10 seconds and that's without any of streaming processors in the Zenos GPU, but still being based on Unified Shader Model.

    But with the PS3 using an unoptimized ProFX Engine, it benchmarked at 1.2 Seconds. Beating out the PC with an 8800 GPU by over 4 TIMES and the Xbox 360 by over 8 TIMES!

    Sebastien Deguy (CEO of Allegorithmic, makers of both MapZone and ProFX Rendering Engine), has said that his ProFX Engine (when properly optimized) "should run impressively fast" and proof of this should be demonstrated by this year's end. Well can't get any faster than the Real Time Loading of Games!

    Now (near the end of the year), we have the PS3 running games like "Ratchet n Clank" and "Uncharted" loading scenes in REAL TIME, without any load screens and the animations, procedurally generated textures in "Uncharted" are running LIVE and Dynamically rendered with them all correlating in time. Water to wetness, wind to tree movement in a animated, living, breathing environment! Not only can a PC with Core Duo and "7800" GPU not do this, but neither could a PS3 with a 7800 GPU do this! NOR!!! ...could an Xbox 360 with it's 10 second load time on "Bayou Demo" alone. Or even your God All Mighty Duo Core PC (for 6 months claim to fame) with an Nvidia 8800 GPU!

    (only card in a PC that can touch this is the as yet released nv92 based PC/GPU's and AMD's Spider platform with a Quad Core CPU and Quad GPU cards in a PC. All of these will still have some kind of load screen in standard non-streamed games - non MMORPG type, in other words) PS3's incomparable, Asynchronous, 9 core Cell processor is what can bring games alive even beyond the pre-rendered textures and canned animations of "Crysis"!

    Want Proof??? You got it! This is a screen shot I took last June 20th 2007 and it is completely un-doctored in any way. I have the original with the creation date on it, in the same place as when it was stored on my PC, unmodified!

    Note: This screenshot capture of the Benchmarks and the shot of ProFx's 4D page (designating Sony and the PS3 as the only platform connected to ProFX's 4D - Future). It mysteriously disappeared the next week. As the guards in MGS would say, "huh?!? But as you see here, that empty ProFX 4D Tab at their web site now, at one time had Sony Middleware icon on it. NOT Microsoft Middleware or Epic's UE3 Middleware, but Sony Middleware!

    That 4D Page tab now is empty! WTF??? LOL and What did Kutaragi say? "The FUTURE is NOW on PS3", along with "PS3 is 4D" and "PS3 is LIVE". Which obviously (unless your either ignorant, dumb or blind) means it loads in REAL TIME!
    http://www.profxengine.com/?PAGE=FUTURE



    The Benchmark Page that mysteriously changed with the deletion of the PS3 Benchmark:
    http://www.profxengine.com/?PAGE=GALLERY.DEMOS.bayou


    ....and for those of you that really are near blind or don't use Firefox with picture Zoom extension, here's a better more readable pic of it!



    These Benchmarks basically throw any and all arguments right out the door and present more than adequate proof that the RSX has been improperly labeled and any specs presented here are indeed founded on undeniable misnomers, exaggerations and mis-representations by Corporations along with the Media. All to sell you a new PC and the hardware that goes in it, year after year after year!!!

    Note: Some here question how the RSX (includes 4 64MB modules on die) could be said to cost more than 8800 GPU's nv82 silicon and comparing die size doesn't work either in defining it. As the nv47 90nm die is Larger than the 90nm RSX or the 90nm nv82. The fact is that the RSX under that cap is slated to or is already at 65nm process, itself. The fact of the matter is, this was a complaint concerning the nv47 chip structure. Is that it was rather large and it could not be shrunk to 65nm process (interconnects, etc). So now all together, just say it! ....I promise it won't hurt... "The RSX must not be an nv47 based chip with that generation's rather large interconnects and processors. Because it has the addition of smaller *Streaming Proccessors* along with some kind of new smaller, higher bandwidth, interconnects for these streaming procs"!

    ***If you need a link to "Costs Analysis" of PS3, or to Sebastien Deguy's statements concerning the performance of the PS3, let me know! Also, Nvidia has as yet defined exactly what the nv92 is exactly. We do know that the cost of the top of the line 8800 chip is high and both

  13. #138
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bust Nak View Post
    Oooo, that's fighting talk! You can't just dismiss those games like that. How about if I say:
    killzone 2: killzone sucked.
    Little big planet:...?...please.
    etc...
    Umm..killzone 1 did suck, im not denying that, its just that he mentioned games that dont have half the hype any one of the ps3 games have.

  14. #139
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    Quote Originally Posted by daggy View Post
    It just really shows that you know nothing about PC games:

    Empire: Total War -- the sequel of the award winning 'Rome:Total War', which was one of the best RTS in the last few years with 92% average on Metacritic.

    Spore -- It's coming also to DS and Mobile, but they're different versions.

    Sins of a solar Empire -- Very experienced developers behind this game, and trully amazing visuals that all graphic whores will enjoy, with a combat 'Homeworld'-like.

    Dragon Age -- Not so much that it's Bioware, but it's more that Dragon Age is the spiritual sequel of Baldur's Gate!!

    Guild Wars 2 -- preferences, if you didn't like it, it's because it's not your thing. I enjoyed the first Guild Wars actually, very deep gameplay.

    Warhammer Online -- Supposedly the WoW killer, and it comes from a well-known franchise.

    WoW: Lich King -- it might be an expansion pack, but it's an AAA expansion pack that has a bigger gameplay-life than most games and that will be one of the best-selling titles next year.

    Storm of War: Battle Of Britain -- tsk tsk, if you were an hardcore PC gamer you would've atleast heard about Maddox, the developers of the best Flight Sim of this decade (IL-2 Sturmovik, 91% Metacritic). It will beat the crap out of Warhawk and Ace Combat 6, trust my words.

    Oh yeah, I forgot PS3 has LBP too, so 10 PC vs 6 PS3 AAA exclusives. Just admit it, PC has more and bigger exclusives.
    You dont get me, those games might be good games, And i might have overreacted about some of those games, for that i apologize.

    But Out of all those games that you mentioned, only Two of them have enough hype to match Ps3's Killzone 2's and such.

    not a lot of people exactly heard about storm of war...or even empire: total wars, or sins of solar empire, i mean come on, Not many will suddenly convert to PC gaming because of games like that.., you cant compare a not very well known pc game to a well known ps3 game.

    I can mention a ****load of not known ps3 exclusives too, , but it doesnt mean they actually will be any good....

  15. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by psycho_rez View Post
    You dont get me, those games might be good games, And i might have overreacted about some of those games, for that i apologize.

    But Out of all those games that you mentioned, only Two of them have enough hype to match Ps3's Killzone 2's and such.

    not a lot of people exactly heard about storm of war...or even empire: total wars, or sins of solar empire, i mean come on, Not many will suddenly convert to PC gaming because of games like that.., you cant compare a not very well known pc game to a well known ps3 game.

    I can mention a ****load of not known ps3 exclusives too, , but it doesnt mean they actually will be any good....
    Quote Originally Posted by psycho_rez View Post
    Umm..killzone 1 did suck, im not denying that, its just that he mentioned games that dont have half the hype any one of the ps3 games have.
    All the games I mentioned are from AAA backgrounds (with exception of Warhammer Online). The Empire game you totally disregarded (with the ...?...) is the sequel of 92% Rome: Total War (you never heard of this game?).

    I don't care about hype. I don't care if the game is hyped or not. I just mentioned games that will most likely be AAA. Hype has no bearing on the quality of the game. That is also why I mentioned LBP for PS3, we all know LBP will probably have a tough time selling.

    Quality of the game makes it AAA. Not Budget, nor Hype.

  16. #141
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    -=*7*=- you are a **** and you sound like one.

    yes rsx and cell might do some great stuff, heck in benchmarking it might even be fantastic however the facts are

    that on ALL cross platform titles the PC will outperform the ps3 on res and fps

    that rsx is a last gen video card

    that ps3 is still - regardless - the most powerfull console - but sadly is not as powerful as a pc costing 6x the price

  17. #142
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    These comparisions are just stupid.
    If you like it and you can afforward it.
    That's all it matters.

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    @ _=7=_ HAHHAHAH thats great, its nice to actually see someone around here who knows WTF is up

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    lintama you probably also believe that the jews started the 2nd world war because some one stated some figures.

    @ _=7=_ doesn't know ****

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    Quote Originally Posted by MEMEROOT View Post
    lintama you probably also believe that the jews started the 2nd world war because some one stated some figures.

    @ _=7=_ doesn't know ****

    What the hell does that have to do with anything at all relating to this thread?

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    Quote Originally Posted by -=*7*=- View Post
    This slide does not say exactly what the RSX is and it certainly doesn't say it's any one of the PC cards Nvidia has put out (76xx,78xx, 7950 or even 8800 GPU's). If you want to take this ignorant supposition further, even the 8800 could be said to be nv47 based and you'd be right, because it is all part of the Nvidia Family!

    RSX just being nv47 based doesn't mean jack...t! How many cores are there, could it have more cores or more or other processors on it? Could it perhaps have streaming processors as the nv82 and nv92? These are the basic distinctions that separate the Nvidia generations of graphics processors. The only thing new in GPU's is Unified Shader Model with not only more processors, but actual STREAMING PROCESSORS (though a GPU can be called a streaming platform itself, it doesn't need streaming processors for that)!

    A sure means of testing this all out, is to compare the rendering abilities of the PS3 to a PC with an Nvidia 8800 GPU, along with say the Xbox 360 with Xenos. Then we have something to go by. It can't be the actual displaying of a scene either, as these should all be similar to one another (a scene being a timed sequence of events, animations, sound and pictures). The performance difference of platforms can only be judged by the loading time of the same exact scene, with all the same complex texture rendering, sound and animations. Along with other aspects involved in the rendering and displaying of a game scene on each platform.

    For our purposes, ProFX Engine runs texture rendering graphics, and Epic's UE3 Engine is being used for animations and audio in this "Bayou Demo" Benchmark. This is about as close as we are ever going to get comparing hardware performance specs to give us our answer as to just what, is possibly under the hood of the RSX/Cell run PS3 Platform!

    Now I'm pretty well fed up with Sony's, Nvidia's and many of you on this forum, insisting on linking the RSX to being a nv47 chip only. Without any modifications or more likely additions. Everyone is denying some facts and believing false information that makes the RSX out to be simply an unaltered nv47 chip. These companies have falsely kept the truth tied up in multiple contradictions, even in their own information releases (and that chart above). With us PS3 fans groping at justifying buying a PS3 while being attacked in here from all sides defending it. While these corporations let us all get slammed for having recogized what you people are afraid to face about all of these Corporations.

    Because, if the truth was known, these companies like Microsoft, Nvidia and Sony would have a hard time selling you their Operating Systems and PC hardware designed around planned obsolescence. When the fact remains the PS3 is a closed box design that is not modular or upgradeable. Except by software and firmware released to reveal hidden or disabled features (similiar to MS telling us Xbox 360 was only capable of 720P and didn't have a scaler in it). But the power and computing potential certainly are upgradable on either of these consoles and this is the only reason neither Sony nor Nvidia have announced exactly what the RSX is, to the World!

    With a little logical exercise in deductive reasoning, we can come to a reasonable conclusion as to if we (so called fools by you people) bought a gimped last generation, over priced, PC GPU in the OVER PRICED, MONSTER COST to build PS3 (that you people claim Sony was fool to build). Especially if it costs what isuppli said it does (a whole 30% more than the Cell BE itself)!

    I'll tell you what, if I am a hardware manufacturer, I'm sure as h*ll not going to pay more than triple the cost of an nv47 7800 chip and over a third more than my main CPU Processor chip to build it. We have companies like Sony that are only too happy to let us wallow in the ignorance of these known facts. Simple logic and reasoning should lead us to understand that the RSX is NOT simply an NV47 based chip, but has lots of other goodies still hidden, when properly related to actual Benchmark Performance!

    Here's the first reason that proves this point. NONE of these PC nv47 based Nvidia GPU's have "Streaming Processors" (we know how many and the type of processors each of the 7800 series GPU's have, but not the RSX). What we do know is the 8800 series does have streaming processors and this along with Unified Shader Model, is the biggest difference between the generations. It's why a PC with an 8800 GPU has been benchmarked with half the loading time of the Xbox 360! As both a 7800 and Zenos are fairly comparable. Right? ....and the Xenos should even be better than the 7800 nv47 chip at loading up ProFX's "Bayou" Demo. Right? Load time for a Core Duo PC w/Nvidia 8800 = 5 seconds on these benchmarks. Benchmark for loading same demo on a similar machine with the 7800 GPU 12 seconds. Time for Xbox 360 to load "Bayou Demo" ??? Just 10 seconds and that's without any of streaming processors in the Zenos GPU, but still being based on Unified Shader Model.

    But with the PS3 using an unoptimized ProFX Engine, it benchmarked at 1.2 Seconds. Beating out the PC with an 8800 GPU by over 4 TIMES and the Xbox 360 by over 8 TIMES!

    Sebastien Deguy (CEO of Allegorithmic, makers of both MapZone and ProFX Rendering Engine), has said that his ProFX Engine (when properly optimized) "should run impressively fast" and proof of this should be demonstrated by this year's end. Well can't get any faster than the Real Time Loading of Games!

    Now (near the end of the year), we have the PS3 running games like "Ratchet n Clank" and "Uncharted" loading scenes in REAL TIME, without any load screens and the animations, procedurally generated textures in "Uncharted" are running LIVE and Dynamically rendered with them all correlating in time. Water to wetness, wind to tree movement in a animated, living, breathing environment! Not only can a PC with Core Duo and "7800" GPU not do this, but neither could a PS3 with a 7800 GPU do this! NOR!!! ...could an Xbox 360 with it's 10 second load time on "Bayou Demo" alone. Or even your God All Mighty Duo Core PC (for 6 months claim to fame) with an Nvidia 8800 GPU!

    (only card in a PC that can touch this is the as yet released nv92 based PC/GPU's and AMD's Spider platform with a Quad Core CPU and Quad GPU cards in a PC. All of these will still have some kind of load screen in standard non-streamed games - non MMORPG type, in other words) PS3's incomparable, Asynchronous, 9 core Cell processor is what can bring games alive even beyond the pre-rendered textures and canned animations of "Crysis"!

    Want Proof??? You got it! This is a screen shot I took last June 20th 2007 and it is completely un-doctored in any way. I have the original with the creation date on it, in the same place as when it was stored on my PC, unmodified!

    Note: This screenshot capture of the Benchmarks and the shot of ProFx's 4D page (designating Sony and the PS3 as the only platform connected to ProFX's 4D - Future). It mysteriously disappeared the next week. As the guards in MGS would say, "huh?!? But as you see here, that empty ProFX 4D Tab at their web site now, at one time had Sony Middleware icon on it. NOT Microsoft Middleware or Epic's UE3 Middleware, but Sony Middleware!

    That 4D Page tab now is empty! WTF??? LOL and What did Kutaragi say? "The FUTURE is NOW on PS3", along with "PS3 is 4D" and "PS3 is LIVE". Which obviously (unless your either ignorant, dumb or blind) means it loads in REAL TIME!
    A few quick questions for you. How long was RSX in development? Wasn't the PS3 originally going to use Cell to render without a "GPU" in the unit?
    "you are both the product and the architect of your environment"


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    Aside from the Jew comment, your really have a low uunderstanding of architecture and how CPU/GPU parallel processing as one unit has any benifits, its sad really.

  23. #148
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    Wouldn't Epic have the best experince so far in knowing whether a PS3 is as capable of a high end PC, with UT3 being a meaty cross platform title?

    WHy don't we have any epic employees on this darn site. Where the hell do they hang out
    If it was up to me, I'd let you go; but the Gods have a temper, and they've been drinking all day


  24. #149
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    Quote Originally Posted by weskurtz81 View Post
    A few quick questions for you. How long was RSX in development? Wasn't the PS3 originally going to use Cell to render without a "GPU" in the unit?
    I dont mean to answer for the guy for I am unsure how long the RSX was in development ,and yes, origionally the RSX was not in the equation and SONY was goingt o put in a a different Cell BE, however, due to time, they decided they could as easily make yp for the slower version of Cell with a GPU that would do some sub routines for the BE, it will fill pallets, pump poy's, etc.etc., its bascially a very specialized chipset, design with the BE in mind only, we will never see anything like it in a commercial setting, it would be uncompatable with anything on the market. Thats why this argument is so ridiculously funny, you can't compare it with anything, its a one time only deal. Design ONLY as a buffering device for a BE setting, its brilliant really.

    For example GT5rologue has 16 cars on screen at one time each consting of 200,000 polygons, now at 200,000x16 @ 60FPS = 192 MILLION POLYS PER SECOND AT 1080p, not counting the tracks, clouds, physics, and 7.1 True HD sound, that is an IMMENSE amount of computing power,, please, name one PC game that does that.

  25. #150
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    -=*7*=- That would easily have to be one of the worst examples of mashing tech jargon together and biggest demonstration of lack of knowledge on how these things actually work that I've seen in the last year, easily. Example...

    But with the PS3 using an unoptimized ProFX Engine, it benchmarked at 1.2 Seconds. Beating out the PC with an 8800 GPU by over 4 TIMES and the Xbox 360 by over 8 TIMES!
    ProFX load times measure CPU speed not GPU.

    few quick questions for you. How long was RSX in development? Wasn't the PS3 originally going to use Cell to render without a "GPU" in the unit?
    It was contracted in 2003 but we don't really have an idea of the production time line, we could guess that it was any where between 1 to 3 years. That said coming in at only a little over $30 million in development from Sony I would be guessing more towards the 1 year mark if even that. Just for comparison sake just ot show how little that really is, the GPU in Xbox 1 cost $300 Million and Xenos in 360 cost $500 million that said the latter MS did get to keep all IP of the chipset.

    For example GT5rologue has 16 cars on screen at one time each consting of 200,000 polygons, now at 200,000x16 @ 60FPS = 192 MILLION POLYS PER SECOND AT 1080p, not counting the tracks, clouds, physics, and 7.1 True HD sound, that is an IMMENSE amount of computing power,, please, name one PC game that does that.
    Do remember to factor in LOD as well, it would be no where near that 192M mark in game that said it's still easily the most impressive racer out there by a long shot. Comparing it to PC racers though is very difficult because there isn't much of a market for them on PC and thus there is not much to go from for comparisons sake, also on PC racers have usually not gotten the attention technology wise like FPS game do.

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