OK - So, alot of Features announced...

[STLunat1K]

Why did you post this wall of text?

As soon as I read, "slow fall of the 360", I stopped reading. You lost all credibility there.

Seriously don't care about credibility and when i say slow fall of 360 i mean in excluisve games which would mean MS needs to start thinking about the 720. You should read the rest of what i said because it could happen.

[tmacfan4321]

Seriously don't care about credibility and when i say slow fall of 360 i mean in excluisve games which would mean MS needs to start thinking about the 720. You should read the rest of what i said because it could happen.

Credibility does matter when trying to prove a point. Without it, you get nowhere.

Saying that the 360 doesn't have exclusives past Gears 2 is just about as ignorant as saying that the only game coming out for the PS3 this year is Resistance 2.

You haven't seen any of the 360's exclusives for this year or the next, have you?

[sainraja]

negative? probabl, but that doesnt change the fact that it is the truth, does it?

We have seen gameplay videos of Resistance 2, MotorStorm 2 and Little Big Planet and Socom. Sony announced games coming out this year and showed gameplay videos. They do that....but I guess some of these titles aren't titles you are interested in?

well, i have put my observations, hvent i? and the seem to tally with what i say

You seem to think Sony does not have anything else to show later. There is still Leipzig and TGS. Leipzig for European developers (Sony does have development houses there) and TGS. If that is what you think, how can I change your opinion? I can't say anything about what Sony has later on for those conferences but I am not going to assume that they don't have anything based on my observations.

a PSN title remains just that, just as MS releaed some XBLA titles on disc with the arcade SKU, does that mean they are no longer XBLA? far from it

PSN titles aren't restricted by the things XBLA games are restricted by. PSN titles can be as big as some 360 retail games. Warhawk is a PS3/PSN title. SOCOM is a PS3/PSN title, it is still part of the PS3 library.

the 360 started with lost oddysey, burnout, GTA, NG2, and with too human, left4 dead, banjo, gears 2, infinate undiscovery, fable 2, viva pinata and a few other PC 360 exclusives, i think the ps3 has a weaker lineup, doesnt mater what perspective or angle you look at it from, it still comes up way short.

So both consoles had titles for this year, that's great. You think the PS3's weaker, I don't share your opinion.

and i agreed to that, didnt i, just said that they let forthcoming titles coming after these steal the thunder, why would they do that?

If you agreed to that, I am not sure why we are still arguing....but Sony is running their games division and Microsoft is running their's, you agree with the way Microsoft does things and I think what Sony does is fine.

am i? have i? can you substantiate your comments? i really dont think so

I can't change your opinion. You think the PS3's line-up is weaker. That is what you think.

This year, the PS3 had enough games to satisfy someone who has it....and it has enough exclusives to satisfy a new owner.

good for you. doesnt change facts, now does it?

again, the simple question i ask and you keep evading is why would anyone let something coming in the far future overshadow something coming int the near future? you seem to think i have an agenda, but why is the question i ask

I wasn't evading it. That's a good point but it wasn't something I was talking about in the first place. I thought you were disagreeing with me about Sony's E3 conference, about how they didn't show anything coming out this year which is why I kept arguing. I can't answer that for you but I have no problem with Sony showing titles coming out in the future. For example, I was excited to see the teaser trailer for God of War 3. that's one of my favorite games. I am happy to see announced.

[Soldier 95B]

same as XBLA games (even though PSN titles are in a whole different league IMO).

Why are they in a whole different league?

[STLunat1K]

Credibility does matter when trying to prove a point. Without it, you get nowhere.

Saying that the 360 doesn't have exclusives past Gears 2 is just about as ignorant as saying that the only game coming out for the PS3 this year is Resistance 2.

You haven't seen any of the 360's exclusives for this year or the next, have you?

Well consider me ignorant because at E3, probably the biggest gaming convention held each year, which is televised to millions of people MS showed counted them 2 exclusives at there presentation which was GOW2 and Fable 2. The rest of the games were multiplatform games. Since the 360 is always been known for its hardcore crowd and basicly known as a FPS console because face it look at the freaking controller, it dosnt exactly scream RPG's so who gives a crap about Fable 2 and Final Fantasy 13. Im sorry but when i play a game i like to control my character and how they fight/shoot as oppose to pressing a button and all of a sudden magicly unicorns, fairy dust and 2 headed dragons start popping out everywhere to do the fighting for me. Back to my point which was MS failed to deliver anything to the majority of there audience which is the hardcore gamers. GOW2 is big but we expected that. Final Fantasy 13 was a surprise but we know how i feel about that and that's also a multiplat game. Halo wars, RTS's are cool if i have the option to plug a keboard and mouse in other than that i love my fingers to much to put them through that agony. The 360 is looking more like a multiplatform console than anything. Huff and Puff all you want but lets face it after E3 how many people are going to go home and take out there frustration from school and work in an intense game of....LIPS! WTF! Even if Bungie announces a new Halo game still you have 1 more game to add to a small list of exclusives that actually move the console in sales. 360 is known for Halo and anything halo, and GOW series. So lets see GOW1 was 2 years ago, Halo 3 last Sept. and this Nov. GOW2. Judging from this cycle of no brainers what do you think MS and the Wii60 is going to do next? What is Bungie going to announce?

[Rareware]

Well consider me ignorant because at E3, probably the biggest gaming convention held each year, which is televised to millions of people MS showed counted them 2 exclusives at there presentation which was GOW2 and Fable 2. The rest of the games were multiplatform games. Since the 360 is always been known for its hardcore crowd and basicly known as a FPS console because face it look at the freaking controller, it dosnt exactly scream RPG's so who gives a crap about Fable 2 and Final Fantasy 13. Im sorry but when i play a game i like to control my character and how they fight/shoot as oppose to pressing a button and all of a sudden magicly unicorns, fairy dust and 2 headed dragons start popping out everywhere to do the fighting for me. Back to my point which was MS failed to deliver anything to the majority of there audience which is the hardcore gamers. GOW2 is big but we expected that. Final Fantasy 13 was a surprise but we know how i feel about that and that's also a multiplat game. Halo wars, RTS's are cool if i have the option to plug a keboard and mouse in other than that i love my fingers to much to put them through that agony. The 360 is looking more like a multiplatform console than anything. Huff and Puff all you want but lets face it after E3 how many people are going to go home and take out there frustration from school and work in an intense game of....LIPS! WTF! Even if Bungie announces a new Halo game still you have 1 more game to add to a small list of exclusives that actually move the console in sales. 360 is known for Halo and anything halo, and GOW series. So lets see GOW1 was 2 years ago, Halo 3 last Sept. and this Nov. GOW2. Judging from this cycle of no brainers what do you think MS and the Wii60 is going to do next? What is Bungie going to announce?

WOW! I haven't seen this kind of anger and ignorance around here in a long time.

Tmacfan, just stop now and let this guy go. Let him believe what he wants to believe. You'll only end up getting yourself an infraction and this guy isn't worth it. He obviously hasn't followed the 360 at all and only knows what he learned at E3.

[Soldier 95B]

Well consider me ignorant ...MS showed counted them 2 exclusives at there presentation which was GOW2 and Fable 2.

You missed the MS presentation then and the demo kiosks. They showed AND demoed Too Human and Halo Wars (playble behind the show), Fable 2, Gears of War 2, Lips, 3 Fable XBLA titles, You're In the Movies, Scene It 2, Geometry Wars 2, Galaga Legions, Portal Still Alive, Viva Pinata 2, Banjo & Kazooie, Infinite Undiscovery, Last Remanant (timed). (did I miss any?)

All during the show, all exclusive, all (besides Halo Wars) coming this year.

[Rareware]

(did I miss any?)

Yes you did. Too Human.

That probably won't count because of all of the idiots over at GAF that don't know their arse from a hole in the ground.

[Soldier 95B]

Yes you did. Too Human.

That probably won't count because of all of the idiots over at GAF that don't know their arse from a hole in the ground.

Well, I wasn't aware that they showed it during the presentation. I know it was playable at the demo kiosks, as was Halo Wars. Did they actually show Too Human and Halo Wars on stage? I just want to be sure my post is accurate.

[Rareware]

Well, I wasn't aware that they showed it during the presentation. I know it was playable at the demo kiosks, as was Halo Wars. Did they actually show Too Human and Halo Wars on stage? I just want to be sure my post is accurate.

Not sure about that. I know it was demoed there though.

But let's face it, anyone who only relies on an E3 press conference and expects to know everything about the 360 isn't thinking straight.

[STLunat1K]

You missed the MS presentation then and the demo kiosks. They showed AND demoed Too Human and Halo Wars (playble behind the show), Fable 2, Gears of War 2, Lips, 3 Fable XBLA titles, You're In the Movies, Scene It 2, Geometry Wars 2, Galaga Legions, Portal Still Alive, Viva Pinata 2, Banjo & Kazooie, Infinite Undiscovery, Last Remanant (timed). (did I miss any?)

All during the show, all exclusive, all (besides Halo Wars) coming this year.

Once again proving my point that the big hitters are there to save the console GOW2 and Halo Wars and anything else related to halo, other than Too human everthing else is small talk. Bungies annoucement would not surprise me if it's halo related cause what are they going to show off next E3 without a halo or gow game, why do you think they canceled Bungies announcement?

[Rareware]

why do you think they canceled Bungies announcement?

Because they already owned the show. They didn't need to show anything else. If they needed to "svae the 360", they would have retained ther bungie announcement. DUH!

They wrapped up '07 with the best line-up, they will have as good as an '08 line-up of any of the big 3, if not better and '09 is looking awesome as well.

Your argument is an epic fail.

Looking at your post history, you have a long & sordid history of 360 bashing so what you say here is meaningless.

Time to go back under the the rock from which you climbed, troll.

[MATRIX 2]

I half agree, i think the 360 needed NETFLIX due to the HD and BLU RAY war going to BLU RAY but i feel MS needed to ensure it's customers that they still have games on the way, im sorry but GOW2 as good as it looks and Fable 2 are not going to satisfy 360 customers. Ive said it once and i'll say it again being a previous 360 owner, once HALO 3 was released and with GOW2 on the way, whats left before GOW3. We are still waiting on BUNGIE's big announcement which i think could mark the slow fall of the 360 if it's not what the people want to hear. Also now that BIOSHOCK is moved to multiplatform whats left? I don't think Mass Effect can take up the slack with a sequel nor can Too Human. Who's to say that these games wont turn out the same way BIOSHOCK did which is become a multiplat game. I mean what if and that's a BIG what if GOW series went multiplat with a PS3 version. Now before i catch hell for that comment remember this people MONEY IS THE ROOT OF ALL EVIL.....GREED! Now think if you were Cliff and you saw how much you made off of the 1st GOW on xbox 360, just think how much you would make if that game was made available for PS3 owners? You know he's thinking that or at least it's crossed his mind, and im willing to bet you that if BIOSHOCK does well on the PS3 you may see alot of exclusives jumping ship to multiplatform.

Paragraphs are your friend, remember that.

Epic already tried your idea with UT3, the result was poor sales. Shooters sell the most on the 360, there is no reason for GOW to go multiplatform. Any sales from a ps3 version would be negligible.

[STLunat1K]

You 360 people are freaking funny and in denial. You pick the most retarted stuff to talk about like "who say's it needs saving" or paragraphs are needed LOL! You guys kill me and the Bungie announcement thing, trust me they canceled it so they could build up hype for next years E3 cause they have nothing else to show. MS can't pull off an E3 without having those two games in the show.

[Silver&black_Attack]

You 360 people are freaking funny and in denial. You pick the most retarted stuff to talk about like "who say's it needs saving" or paragraphs are needed LOL! You guys kill me and the Bungie announcement thing, trust me they canceled it so they could build up hype for next years E3 cause they have nothing else to show. MS can't pull off an E3 without having those two games in the show.

Maybe your in the wrong section, it's obvious you have a bias against the 360, i don't think many will take your bias opinions very seriously.

[STLunat1K]

Because they already owned the show. They didn't need to show anything else. If they needed to "svae the 360", they would have retained ther bungie announcement. DUH!

They wrapped up '07 with the best line-up, they will have as good as an '08 line-up of any of the big 3, if not better and '09 is looking awesome as well.

Your argument is an epic fail.

Looking at your post history, you have a long & sordid history of 360 bashing so what you say here is meaningless.

Time to go back under the the rock from which you climbed, troll.

Did you really just call me a troll? Wow how old are you? I guess it is true, 360 really is turning into another Wii even there owners are starting to talk like little kids.

[Sparc]

Well consider me ignorant because at E3, probably the biggest gaming convention held each year, which is televised to millions of people MS showed counted them 2 exclusives at there presentation which was GOW2 and Fable 2. The rest of the games were multiplatform games. Since the 360 is always been known for its hardcore crowd and basicly known as a FPS console because face it look at the freaking controller, it dosnt exactly scream RPG's so who gives a crap about Fable 2 and Final Fantasy 13. Im sorry but when i play a game i like to control my character and how they fight/shoot as oppose to pressing a button and all of a sudden magicly unicorns, fairy dust and 2 headed dragons start popping out everywhere to do the fighting for me. Back to my point which was MS failed to deliver anything to the majority of there audience which is the hardcore gamers. GOW2 is big but we expected that. Final Fantasy 13 was a surprise but we know how i feel about that and that's also a multiplat game. Halo wars, RTS's are cool if i have the option to plug a keboard and mouse in other than that i love my fingers to much to put them through that agony. The 360 is looking more like a multiplatform console than anything. Huff and Puff all you want but lets face it after E3 how many people are going to go home and take out there frustration from school and work in an intense game of....LIPS! WTF! Even if Bungie announces a new Halo game still you have 1 more game to add to a small list of exclusives that actually move the console in sales. 360 is known for Halo and anything halo, and GOW series. So lets see GOW1 was 2 years ago, Halo 3 last Sept. and this Nov. GOW2. Judging from this cycle of no brainers what do you think MS and the Wii60 is going to do next? What is Bungie going to announce?

Goodness...what a load of drivel. You do realise that's time you can never get back? You should think about that next time.

I'm not entirely sure whether you are posting in here to make yourself feel better about your purchase or whether you're just bored and thought you'd pop into this side of the forum and post tripe, but either has resulted in quite a big turd being lain in this forum.

RTS games can and do work on the console. I've been playing RTS's for years and years. At one time it was the ONLY genre I played. So I was a hardcore PC RTS fan (anybody remember Cavedog? Let's have a moment's silence at the end of this post for them). I wasn't convinced the RTS would work on the console but LOTR (the first RTS for a console) showed me that despite it not being perfect it was a lot better than I thought it could be. C&C went further and really made a nice control system and if you watch the video on Halo Wars I think that even you would be pushed to say it "doesn't work" - not that I'd expect you to admit of course. It takes a big man to admit when he's wrong.

Now....about that moment's silence...

[REFLEX]

Anyone trolling will have to deal with the wrath ..... warnings have been given and consider this the warning.

[tmacfan4321]

Did you really just call me a troll? Wow how old are you? I guess it is true, 360 really is turning into another Wii even there owners are starting to talk like little kids.

They called you a troll because that is exactly what you are. Anyone who defies logic and reasoning with their posts just for the sake of an argument, is a troll.

You are blatantly starting arguments that will only end in infractions. Then after you say that you are not a troll, you call 360 owners little kids for calling you out on it.

Logic rules this section, not trolling.

[radgamer420]

yup, white knight, getaway,wardevil, heavy rain, the team ico project? man, that list is endless, they have more announced and unreleased titles than both and ninty habe had at any time in this generation

FYI The Getaway was cancelled so you might want to scratch that one off. Anyway as for the topic I think both systems will have great games to play this Fall and xmas. I'm going to be very broke.

[mynd]

He doesn't have to mention it. It is a game that people were aware of and I am surprised to see you just learned about Banjo this year. Rare showed a trailer of the game before. This was early last year I believe.

We have "known about" a lot of games, but knowing something is going to happen and actually seeing an offical game title and gameplay is something completely different. Rare showed nothing but a possible teaser last year.

I am not focusing on what some people said about Microsoft's line-up. It's stupid for anyone to think that Microsoft isn't going to release anything this year....but it is equally as stupid to suggest or say that about Sony's line-up.

Well, the thread isnt really about "whats coming", it's about "what's been announced".
Title for title, MS has announced more games coming in the past 7 months, that are actually arriving before Xmas.

It is the year of the PS3 in the sense, that things for the console are coming together this year. Home is coming this year, 2.4 happened this year....it has a solid line-up this year. It has an identity of its own....so it is the year of the PS3. That is not to say it can't be for the others.

There is long time to go in the year. Lots of things can happen.
Take for example the following worse case scenario for Sony...
-LBP get delayed till early next year
-360 drops to $299 permanently
-Fable 2 becomes game of the year
-Gears 2 outsells Resistence 2 5:1
-Motostorm 2 causes the new 80gb models to crash

Ya know, none of this is likely but it is possible, it could all go pear shaped for either company, indeed it has already in some sense for Sony, I mean if you listed stuff that's gone wrong this year form the "dream" run, it's already bad, no KZ2 before Xmas, Home delayed, GTA crashing, thats not exactly stuff Sony are happy about.
To pronounce any year as before it is out is perhaps overly dramatic, still people buy into hype....

I guess I am defending Sony's line up a little to much when the comment I was responding to was I guess defending 360's line-up against people saying otherwise....but I didn't see it as that because I was focusing just on this topic...not what people were saying in other threads...

I think it is fair to say that both systems have enough titles coming this year.

It is a great time to be a gamer on any system. But to bemoan that MS didn't announce titles for next year is ridiculous.

Frankly I have an inkling of what is coming exclusive, and my suspicions go something like this:

Alan Wake
APB exclusive
Bioshock II (6 months exclusive)
Mass Effect II
Forza 3,( timed for release at same time at GT5)
Halo 4
KOTR exclusive
Killer Instinct
Splinter Cell
Dungeon Siege III

Do they really need to announce Bioshock 2, Forza 3, and Mass Effect 2, not really, it's about as superfluous as it gets.
Still some people seem to think it would have done them good to do it.

Hell they even held of the Halo 4 announcement.

[Rareware]

And there are some yet to be announced games as well. I know Killer Instinct is in there somewhere.

MS only announces games as needed. Right now, they don't need to. I think it makes this whole speculation thing fun.

APB is going to be HUGE. I am also looking forward to Dungeon Hero.

[skulpt]

While I totally respect both sides of the argument, I think people need to think about something.

1) Microsoft Game Studios have lost some studios under their wing

2) Sony has been adding studios under their wing

3) Great 3rd party developers of past exclusives that have been standouts on the 360 are ending up more and more on the PS3 as install base sales start to make more sense.

So you basically have this. Oblivion makers aren't doing the exclusive release anymore with their next project Fallout. Bioshock is heading to the PS3, and most likely Bioshock 2 is as well.

The 360 was flooded with GREAT exclusives in 2006 and 2007, but a big reason was it was pointless releasing the game on the PS3 where the install base (as well as understanding of the hardware) was not in place. So now you're having some studios saying "No MS, we will make enough money on the PS3 to counter your exclusive offer." I mean do you think if MS could have secured Fallout entirely, they wouldn't have taken advantage of that? The devs know now that they can make more off of the PS3 alone than what MS could offer.

The PS3 has reached the point where MS has to offer more to secure an exclusive deal. So you're left a bit more with the need for strong first party titles, and Sony really seems to be gobbling up a lot of studios lately, and MS has been letting some go.

So while I can agree that there are some GREAT 360 exclusives coming out, I also think that some of you are forgetting that MS has lost some ground, and at the same time, Sony has picked some up.

We can't forget the loss of PS3 exclusives in DMC, GTA, and FF13. But I do think this argument I see on both sides is NOT 100% correct that MS is in trouble, or not 100% correct that MS is the same as always either.

MS will have some great exclusives to offer, didn't have to show them at E3, but they are NOT the same company of a year ago that had exclusives by install base default, and also had Bungie and BC under their wing.

It seems like there is zero middle ground on these boards. I guess people get polarized more as some flame enough to get people pis$ed.

LOL

[mynd]

While I totally respect both sides of the argument, I think people need to think about something.

1) Microsoft Game Studios have lost some studios under their wing

True, they have lost Bioware, how this impacts on their current relationship is yet to be seen, but MS is not adverse to paying for timed exclusives, I fully expect Mass Effect II to be in the same league.

I do not know of any other companies they have lost, Bioshock II will be a timed exclusive, I'd put MS's money on it

2) Sony has been adding studios under their wing

I was unaware of nay new purchases, what has Sony purchased recently, I might have missed something.

3) Great 3rd party developers of past exclusives that have been standouts on the 360 are ending up more and more on the PS3 as install base sales start to make more sense.

Well, consider Tretton has just announced that they will not focus on 3rd part devs, expect games still to be developed and lead on the 360. This still plays into "6 month exclusive" titles.

So you basically have this. Oblivion makers aren't doing the exclusive release anymore with their next project Fallout. Bioshock is heading to the PS3, and most likely Bioshock 2 is as well.

Again, Bioshock will be ported by a diferent team, while Bioshock 2 will be developed, and later ported. 2K has already said they dont have a huge team to do multiple platforms. I think Biosshock 2 will still be a timed excluisve.
Fallout 3 is not really a shock, Oblivsion was the first game to get the PS3 port treatment.

The 360 was flooded with GREAT exclusives in 2006 and 2007, but a big reason was it was pointless releasing the game on the PS3 where the install base (as well as understanding of the hardware) was not in place. So now you're having some studios saying "No MS, we will make enough money on the PS3 to counter your exclusive offer." I mean do you think if MS could have secured Fallout entirely, they wouldn't have taken advantage of that? The devs know now that they can make more off of the PS3 alone than what MS could offer.

You need only pay enough for a timed exclusive, it does enough damage. There is still a large leap for some of these companies.

The PS3 has reached the point where MS has to offer more to secure an exclusive deal. So you're left a bit more with the need for strong first party titles, and Sony really seems to be gobbling up a lot of studios lately, and MS has been letting some go.

So while I can agree that there are some GREAT 360 exclusives coming out, I also think that some of you are forgetting that MS has lost some ground, and at the same time, Sony has picked some up.

I really don't see it like that, well not yet at least, when we see Bioshock 2, and Mass Effect 2 announced day and date, then I would agree with you. Yeah it's posisble, but it isnt exactly panic stations at MS just yet.

We can't forget the loss of PS3 exclusives in DMC, GTA, and FF13. But I do think this argument I see on both sides is NOT 100% correct that MS is in trouble, or not 100% correct that MS is the same as always either.

Exactly

MS will have some great exclusives to offer, didn't have to show them at E3, but they are NOT the same company of a year ago that had exclusives by install base default, and also had Bungie and BC under their wing.

It seems like there is zero middle ground on these boards. I guess people get polarized more as some flame enough to get people pis.

LOL

Well, it is a PS3 forums site

But I still think it's compelling to lead development on the 360, and many companies are leaving PS3 ports up to another team, delaying the resulting PS3 product. It does not hurt them to do this, and it's understandable the 3rd party devs want to make as much money as possible.

Valve and ID for example, both pretty much don't want to deal with the PS3.
While you will see the large (Ubisoft/EA) companies deal in terms of simultaneous releases. The true gems tend to come from smaller companies. It's generally the publisher that will later push them into a port.

[Rareware]

Remember that MS has an exclusive right to publish all Bungie games and gets right of first refusal so they are more like a 2nd party dev. Bungie's games are going nowhere but to the 360 for the next couple of years.