The Official Apple Thread: Introducing the new, thinner, lighter...

[MATRIX 2]

falling behind in what manner? What is MS coming up with, that their guns are blazing?


Btw, here is the keynote:

http://www.apple.com/apple-events/september-2012/

Skip to 25:05 and watch the real racing 3 footage. Looks stellar!

Falling behind regarding hardware to android and windows phones and the UI to windows phones.

First the hardware:

http://www.theverge.com/2012/9/12/33...x-galaxy-nexus

The iphone used to offer cutting edge technology, but has lagged behind with the latest revision.

Screen resolution is inferior to current android and windows phone competition.

The camera is an improvement over the 4S (which was pretty good), but is unlikely to top what Nokia offers in their 920.

Apple still maintains a lead with their GPU (which gives you games like the one shown in the press conference today) but the competitors are catching up. The cpu's are essentially equal so there isn't much to say there.

Batterylife? According to the spec sheets it should be bested by the Galaxy SIII, Lumia 920 and the recently announced motorola droid razer maxx HD.

LTE phones have been available since early last year. And apple has only added it now. They also have decided to skip over NFC for the foreseeable future.

http://www.theverge.com/2012/9/12/33...-nfc-lightning

The only thing apple leads in from a hardware perspective is design, but people buy their phones to do things, not just stick up on a pedestal and admire from afar. And if you don't want your phone to show wear and tear you are likely to buy a case for it, which diminishes the design.



Sales? They got outdone by samsung in august:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/0...n_1855663.html

http://www.theverge.com/2012/9/6/329...iii-20-million

So Now we move on to software. While android has improved quite a bit over the past few months, they still have trouble with the integration of software to their cutting edge hardware.

This is where windows phone comes in. While ios is a very good OS, it gets stale rather quick. WP8 allows you to customize the OS to suit your preference. Instead of having grid after grid of static icons you can customize the home screen with your preferred applications which update in real time. And while apple has built up its own ecosystem it isn't in the position MS is to unite computers with mobile devices (smartphones/tablets) and the home theater (xbox) through their cloud services.

All of this is a very potent threat to apple. google and anybody else who has a hand in one of these areas.

[DarkVincent07]

I was hoping for a new iPod Classic... mine is getting old and dying and I want another. The click wheel is boss, so its the 160GB capacity

[MATRIX 2]

I was hoping for a new iPod Classic... mine is getting old and dying and I want another. The click wheel is boss, so its the 160GB capacity

Pretty sure it will be discontinued in another year or two.

[DarkVincent07]

Pretty sure it will be discontinued in another year or two.

Thats stupid... if mine breaks I want another large capacity iPod. Hopefully they know there is a small market there. I like to carry all my music with me damnit ><

[F34R]

Falling behind regarding hardware to android and windows phones and the UI to windows phones.

First the hardware:

http://www.theverge.com/2012/9/12/33...x-galaxy-nexus

The iphone used to offer cutting edge technology, but has lagged behind with the latest revision.

How is the iPhone 5 lagging? When was it about spec sheets being higher than others?

Screen resolution is inferior to current android and windows phone competition.

Competing against which phones? It's a better resolution than thousands of android phones.

The camera is an improvement over the 4S (which was pretty good), but is unlikely to top what Nokia offers in their 920.

Maybe, maybe not...

Apple still maintains a lead with their GPU (which gives you games like the one shown in the press conference today) but the competitors are catching up. The cpu's are essentially equal so there isn't much to say there.

Batterylife? According to the spec sheets it should be bested by the Galaxy SIII, Lumia 920 and the recently announced motorola droid razer maxx HD.

S3 battery life is crap most of the time. Period. Spec sheets are variable stats, that's about it. I can keep my iPhone 4 off charging for two days. Using the S3 the same usage time, etc., it wouldn't last all day at all. Comparing the battery times listed over the phones that these android manu's are doing is a bit laughable to say the least.

LTE phones have been available since early last year. And apple has only added it now. They also have decided to skip over NFC for the foreseeable future.

Don't see how them putting LTE in now, instead of earlier when the networks still haven't really launched that much coverage, is anything to use as a negative. NFC? Yea, that's a feature that is a must have lol.

http://www.theverge.com/2012/9/12/33...-nfc-lightning

The only thing apple leads in from a hardware perspective is design, but people buy their phones to do things, not just stick up on a pedestal and admire from afar. And if you don't want your phone to show wear and tear you are likely to buy a case for it, which diminishes the design.



Sales? They got outdone by samsung in august:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/0...n_1855663.html

http://www.theverge.com/2012/9/6/329...iii-20-million

Oh please... iPhone 4s was the best selling in those areas since Oct last year... now in AUGUST, just this one month, you want to tout S3 being a best seller?

So Now we move on to software. While android has improved quite a bit over the past few months, they still have trouble with the integration of software to their cutting edge hardware.

Android software is so fragmented it's unbearable at times. Add in the carrier modifications, lack of updates, etc. Let's just leave it at that.

This is where windows phone comes in. While ios is a very good OS, it gets stale rather quick. WP8 allows you to customize the OS to suit your preference. Instead of having grid after grid of static icons you can customize the home screen with your preferred applications which update in real time. And while apple has built up its own ecosystem it isn't in the position MS is to unite computers with mobile devices (smartphones/tablets) and the home theater (xbox) through their cloud services.

Windows phones, to do what? What can you even do, application wise, that won't be present in any other smartphone... oh I know. Be supplied with a decent amount of content past Windows.

All of this is a very potent threat to apple. google and anybody else who has a hand in one of these areas.

After going from BB to Android, I never thought I'd go elsewhere. Once I got to know about how much these phones were lacking support software wise, I had to at least try iPhone. Best decision I've made. I tried to go back once the S3 was released, but it didn't take too long to realize it just hasn't gotten much better over three years going.

[dc89]

Somewhere up there, I can hear Steve screaming.


Back in 2006 I launched a blog where I pretended to be Apple CEO Steve Jobs. My alter ego, "Fake Steve," had a good run, but I shut
it down in January 2011 when it became apparent that Jobs was in poor health. Nevertheless, even now, I'm constantly wondering what Steve would think about whatever Apple is doing.


This week it's the iPhone 5. Everyone pretty much accepts that Apple will introduce it, and there have been so many leaks that everybody pretty much seems to know what it's going to be. Word is it will look a lot like the last two versions of the iPhone, except a bit thinner and a bit taller, with upgraded guts and a refreshed operating system.


If that's correct, I imagine Steve is not happy. First of all, he'd be furious about the leaks. Steve liked surprising people.

More important, is this really the best we can expect from an outfit that claims to be the most innovative company in the world? This is the sixth version of the iPhone, and the user interface still looks almost exactly like the original iPhone in 2007.


The hardware on the iPhone has been the same for two years, since the iPhone 4 and 4S were virtually identical.

Now, having had two years to plot and scheme, Apple's renowned designer Jonathan Ive has replaced the tiny 3.5in (8.9cm) screen with a slightly-less-tiny 4in (10.2cm) screen? Wow. Knock me over with a feather. What do you do with the rest of your time, Jony?


This is what happens when a company is too cheap to invest in research and development. Did you know that Apple spends far less on R&D than any of its rivals - a paltry 2% of revenues, versus 14% for Google and Microsoft?

No wonder the Android platform, where new models appear every week, now represents 68% of the smartphone market, up from 47% a year ago, while Apple slid to 17% over the same period.


In case you're bad at maths, let me work that out for you: Android's market share is now four times that of Apple. Four times!

Worse, despite all its bluster about innovation, Apple has become a copycat, and not even a good one. Why is Apple making the iPhone bigger? To keep up with the top Android phones.(Phones that, mind you, Apple fanboys ridiculed at first.)

The problem is that the new iPhone won't really give you much more screen real estate than the old one. Worse, it looks ridiculous.


Apple also has become a copycat in tablets. Jobs once said the iPad's 9.7in screen was the perfect size, and smaller tablets made no sense. Then the Android camp had success with 7in tablets like Amazon's Kindle Fire and Google's Nexus 7, and now Apple supposedly will announce its own smaller iPad in October. Talk about thinking different!


What else is there to complain about?

Um, Siri still doesn't work. The oft-rumoured Apple TV doesn't exist yet, presumably because media companies won't let Apple take over their business.

The latest batch of Apple ads were such embarrassing garbage that Apple had to take them down from YouTube. Apple's new guy in charge of retail launched a plan to lay off workers and boost profits, then had to walk it back when people pointed out that this was stupid.


The big $1bn (£650m) patent "victory" over Samsung made Apple look like a bully, and also raised awareness of how good Samsung's latest products are.


Last month, Samsung's Galaxy S3, with its huge 4.8in screen, outsold the iPhone 4S in the United States, the first time any smartphone has outsold the iPhone in the States.

Apple got where it was by taking bold risks. Now it has become a company that copies others and plays it safe.

A company that once was run by a product visionary now is run by a number-cruncher - chief executive Tim Cook, whose claim to fame involves running an efficient supply chain and beating ever lower prices out of Asian subcontractors and component suppliers.

To use a car analogy, six years ago the iPhone was like a sexy new flagship model from BMW or Porsche. Today it's a Toyota Camry. Safe, reliable, boring. The car your mom drives. The car that's so popular that its maker doesn't dare mess with the formula.



Apple seems less interested in blowing people away than it is in milking profit out of the existing lineup. At this Cook is doing marvelously well.


Sales are booming and will top $150bn this year, with net profit margins of nearly 30%. That's incredible in any business, but qualifies as a miracle when you're selling consumer electronics hardware.


Apple has more than $100bn in cash. Its market value of $632bn makes it the biggest company in the world, bigger than any company in US history.

That's great for Apple's shareholders. But for customers, who cares? In terms of products, Apple has become the one thing it should never be. Apple has become boring.


Somewhere up there, I can hear Steve screaming.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-19557497

I agree with quite a bit of this actually. I know Apple can't reinvent the wheel every time. But I really think they have struggled to play catch up and differentiate itself from the Galaxy S3, which now, is arguably the better handset. And I never thought I'd be saying that.

[jonathanm1978]

Android, fragmented. Not sure what that really means, I used to have to run disk defrag on my Windows xp computer, is that the same? (I haven't run defrag on my phone, but it's only been running with a restart for 2 weeks now).

It would be easier to list what phones haven't been 720p since 01/01/2011 than which ones aren't besides the iPhone. But Apple still hasn't used that commonplace tech and the newest will interpolate images to less than 1:1.
I like a phone that just works out of the box, and with my 5th android purchase since 2009, I've yet to come across one that hasn't just worked. They all have done just fine and I could complain more about network coverage and apps not being updated fast enough, like Hulu. Android= Linux based and doesn't suffer from fragmentation though, but some folks talk like iPhone never has any problems. And with new suppliers for chips and displays, everyone just thinks this new iPhone iteration will just work without any problem, and I hope for the price they are right, but nobody knows for sure how this new stuff is going to play with different apps and it may bite them for doing what they have done in changing nearly all their suppliers. Sharp already ran into problems with the display, but they have two other suppliers for displays. Now what happens when one display doesn't play nice with something a person tries to do?
For a forum that talks so much about failure rates on consoles, nobody mentions the high failure rates of the past iPhones within the 14-day period. But neither does Apple.
Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2

[MjW]

^^ By fragmented they mean that the hardware varies a lot from phone to phone. Different spec-wise.


I've used an iPhone for 3 years now and spent a lot of money in apps over this period. Abandoning that much money and personalisation is not easy. It's unthinkable.
Apple has to do a really bad phone to make me change to an other OS. They really have to piss me off. And even the lack of LTE in Sweden is not enough atm.

[BoyBettaKnow]

^^ By fragmented they mean that the hardware varies a lot from phone to phone. Different spec-wise.


I've used an iPhone for 3 years now and spent a lot of money in apps over this period. Abandoning that much money and personalisation is not easy. It's unthinkable.
Apple has to do a really bad phone to make me change to an other OS. They really have to piss me off. And even the lack of LTE in Sweden is not enough atm.

One of the reasons I keep saying. I've spent far too much money through the app store to switch brands that easily.
For me to upgrade from a iPhone 4 makes it a worthy upgrade.


BBK. Tapatalking.

[F34R]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-19557497

I agree with quite a bit of this actually. I know Apple can't reinvent the wheel every time. But I really think they have struggled to play catch up and differentiate itself from the Galaxy S3, which now, is arguably the better handset. And I never thought I'd be saying that.

That "article" was pretty trashy. They aren't trying to play catch up, and they definitely didn't have any problem with the S3. Whether its a better handset is a decision made from person to person. That's why Samsung, HTC, etc, make different "spec'd" phones.

Android, fragmented. Not sure what that really means, I used to have to run disk defrag on my Windows xp computer, is that the same? (I haven't run defrag on my phone, but it's only been running with a restart for 2 weeks now).

It would be easier to list what phones haven't been 720p since 01/01/2011 than which ones aren't besides the iPhone. But Apple still hasn't used that commonplace tech and the newest will interpolate images to less than 1:1.
I like a phone that just works out of the box, and with my 5th android purchase since 2009, I've yet to come across one that hasn't just worked. They all have done just fine and I could complain more about network coverage and apps not being updated fast enough, like Hulu. Android= Linux based and doesn't suffer from fragmentation though, but some folks talk like iPhone never has any problems. And with new suppliers for chips and displays, everyone just thinks this new iPhone iteration will just work without any problem, and I hope for the price they are right, but nobody knows for sure how this new stuff is going to play with different apps and it may bite them for doing what they have done in changing nearly all their suppliers. Sharp already ran into problems with the display, but they have two other suppliers for displays. Now what happens when one display doesn't play nice with something a person tries to do?
For a forum that talks so much about failure rates on consoles, nobody mentions the high failure rates of the past iPhones within the 14-day period. But neither does Apple.
Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2

Fragmented, OS wise, hardware wise, app availability wise, carrier bloatware wise, and so on.

[irish-sid]

After going from BB to Android, I never thought I'd go elsewhere. Once I got to know about how much these phones were lacking support software wise, I had to at least try iPhone. Best decision I've made. I tried to go back once the S3 was released, but it didn't take too long to realize it just hasn't gotten much better over three years going.

You are talking out you hole now. I had the impression you were a level headed guy, this is just nonsense.

^^ By fragmented they mean that the hardware varies a lot from phone to phone. Different spec-wise.


I've used an iPhone for 3 years now and spent a lot of money in apps over this period. Abandoning that much money and personalisation is not easy. It's unthinkable.
Apple has to do a really bad phone to make me change to an other OS. They really have to piss me off. And even the lack of LTE in Sweden is not enough atm.

So the iPhone is now fragmented? It always had been. They actively sell older models that don't get all the goodness of the latest ios. That's fragmentation. The new dock connector... fragmentation. Like bringing your 'new' iPhone 5 to your mates, but can't plug it into his dock... fragmentation.
Screen size...

That "article" was pretty trashy. They aren't trying to play catch up, and they definitely didn't have any problem with the S3. Whether its a better handset is a decision made from person to person. That's why Samsung, HTC, etc, make different "spec'd" phones.

Fragmented, OS wise, hardware wise, app availability wise, carrier bloatware wise, and so on.

This is where i leave this thread. These are the words of a fanboy that can't be talked to. No matter what i say you'll just repeat the same stuff over.

[F34R]

You are talking out you hole now. I had the impression you were a level headed guy, this is just nonsense.



So the iPhone is now fragmented? It always had been. They actively sell older models that don't get all the goodness of the latest ios. That's fragmentation. The new dock connector... fragmentation. Like bringing your 'new' iPhone 5 to your mates, but can't plug it into his dock... fragmentation.
Screen size...



This is where i leave this thread. These are the words of a fanboy that can't be talked to. No matter what i say you'll just repeat the same stuff over.

Thanks for leaving the thread. If you're just going to condescend people without bringing any discussion in those replies, it's better off that you don't "contribute". If you want to make the replies as personal insults, etc., just PM me. The thread doesn't need that type of behavior.

As far as saying the "same thing" etc., that's just wrong. It'd be kinda like saying that the S3 is a new design from Samsung, ya know; different processor, ram, updated OS, updated hardware. Kinda seems a lot like the "not updated" iPhone 5.

[uofmtiger]

One of the reasons I keep saying. I've spent far too much money through the app store to switch brands that easily.
For me to upgrade from a iPhone 4 makes it a worthy upgrade.


BBK. Tapatalking.

Yep, it would take a phone that is A LOT better for my needs to get me to switch at this point. Also, replacing things like iTunes match, PhotoStream, and Airplay would make the choice to switch even harder.

[Pez_555]

That "article" was pretty trashy. They aren't trying to play catch up, and they definitely didn't have any problem with the S3. Whether its a better handset is a decision made from person to person. That's why Samsung, HTC, etc, make different "spec'd" phones.

Fragmented, OS wise, hardware wise, app availability wise, carrier bloatware wise, and so on.

completely agree. Competition is what drives this industry and whilst i still prefer iPhone, i am loving the look of the Lumia. Just wish they had more screen real estate (i hate bezel).

The S3 only beat the 4S in sales because the 5 was launching a month later.....the 5 will overtake the S3.

[MATRIX 2]

How is the iPhone 5 lagging? When was it about spec sheets being higher than others?

The iphone used to be cutting edge all around. Typically offered the best camera, most responsive touchscreen, fastest cpu/gpu, best batterylife, ect. Everything else lagged behind in at least one way. And until this year with the launch of the lumia phones, windows phone wasn't even a factor. And we all know what android was like in the pre 4.0 days. But now, apple doesn't offer the best camera, or touchscreen, or the best batterylife or the highest end hardware. They still have their design, but I addressed the issues regarding that earlier. And iOS is essentially still the same as it was back in 2007. It has many more features now, but navigation and layout haven't really changed. It works, but is very simple and becomes boring rather quickly.

And last I checked, apple was all about the specs, they just used their own words/marketing lingo to suit their advertising style (emphasizing the whole experience), rather than hard specs.

Competing against which phones? It's a better resolution than thousands of android phones.

Those "thousands" of phones are irrelevant. We look at its competition as of Sept. 12, 2012. The one X, SIII, New razer phones, and Lumia 920 all outdo the 5 regarding resolution. And it is likely the same can be said regarding screen quality for a few of them as well. And it is likely that samsung and HTC will announce the next generation of their android phones in a few months putting apple even further behind.

S3 battery life is crap most of the time. Period. Spec sheets are variable stats, that's about it. I can keep my iPhone 4 off charging for two days. Using the S3 the same usage time, etc., it wouldn't last all day at all. Comparing the battery times listed over the phones that these android manu's are doing is a bit laughable to say the least.

I bet you likely had LTE enabled which would significantly cut into the batterylife. And the SIII may be debatable, but the new motorola razer will have the longest endurance and it seems the lumia 920 will also offer comparable if not better batterylife than the 5 as well.

Don't see how them putting LTE in now, instead of earlier when the networks still haven't really launched that much coverage, is anything to use as a negative. NFC? Yea, that's a feature that is a must have lol.

Because apple used to offer cutting edge features in performance. They could have offered LTE on the 4S, even if it was only available to a limited amount of their market/customers, but they decided to hold off for nearly a year until the next refresh.

And I wouldn't be surprised if apple integrates NFC into the 5s. Sometimes you get the feeling that apple holds back on certain things just to make it easier for them to impress with the next revision.

Oh please... iPhone 4s was the best selling in those areas since Oct last year... now in AUGUST, just this one month, you want to tout S3 being a best seller?

Considering the sales pace of the SIII and that it is being sold for $99 on certain carriers/retailers I wouldn't be surprised if sales increase in the next few months due to the value offered by it, and people electing to not buy the iphone 5 in favor of another smartphone.

Android software is so fragmented it's unbearable at times. Add in the carrier modifications, lack of updates, etc. Let's just leave it at that.

Not sure what the point of this statement was since I essentially said the same thing.

Windows phones, to do what? What can you even do, application wise, that won't be present in any other smartphone... oh I know. Be supplied with a decent amount of content past Windows.

You are truly narrowminded if that is the best you can come up with. For one you actually get a fluid OS (unlike android) that is available on multiple form factors. Surely you can't say with a straight face that a one phone fits all approach is better than having multiple choices.

Secondly, expanding on the hardware side, its pretty clear that the 920 outdoes the iphone 5:

http://www.zdnet.com/seven-reasons-t...20-7000003950/

But back to your windows comment, how is that a bad thing?

They are linking windows, office, xbox and windows phone 8 together. Since windows 8 and WP8 share a kernel, that makes cross development of programs/apps much easier and quicker that before. I wouldn't be surprised if the next xbox OS is also based on the Windows 8 kernel. And all of this will be linked together through Microsoft's windows live services ensuring that your data/info is available across various platforms and is up to date.

That's a more compelling ecosystem than any other being offered.

After going from BB to Android, I never thought I'd go elsewhere. Once I got to know about how much these phones were lacking support software wise, I had to at least try iPhone. Best decision I've made. I tried to go back once the S3 was released, but it didn't take too long to realize it just hasn't gotten much better over three years going.

You said it yourself, you have tried BB, android and ios. If you want a complete picture, you need to try the 4th option, WP8.

[BoyBettaKnow]

I wouldn't say the iPhones ever had the best battery life or camera that's for sure. They still have the best touchscreen interface and mobile OS, IMO. I don't really care for the customisation on the iPhone, it works pretty much perfectly out of the box. Add that with a jailbreak and SBS Settings and it's all I'll ever need


BBK. Tapatalking.

[F34R]

The iphone used to be cutting edge all around. Typically offered the best camera, most responsive touchscreen, fastest cpu/gpu, best batterylife, ect. Everything else lagged behind in at least one way. And until this year with the launch of the lumia phones, windows phone wasn't even a factor. And we all know what android was like in the pre 4.0 days. But now, apple doesn't offer the best camera, or touchscreen, or the best batterylife or the highest end hardware. They still have their design, but I addressed the issues regarding that earlier. And iOS is essentially still the same as it was back in 2007. It has many more features now, but navigation and layout haven't really changed. It works, but is very simple and becomes boring rather quickly.

Android phones are competing against each other. That's why you see them the way they are right now. The only phone I've have was a BB Tour, that came to where my iPhone is in regards to battery life. What's the speed of the US based S3? What's the speed of the A6? How do you determine that apple doesn't have these hardware specs better than the Android phones? What's boring about it? Using it? The best part of this is that if the phone isn't for you, then there are other phones to buy that will fit your needs. I wish the iPhone was configurable like the S3, for sure. However, it hasn't diminished how the iPhone 4 works for me. f the S3 was as fluid and stable between battery life, apps, and usage, compared to the iPhone, I'd have it still.

And last I checked, apple was all about the specs, they just used their own words/marketing lingo to suit their advertising style (emphasizing the whole experience), rather than hard specs.

That's probably because their customers aren't relying on announcing specs. They are more concerned about the experience. That's what I'd guess. It's not about promoting CPU speed, ram, etc. The android phones have to because they are competing with X amount of other Android phones by other companies.


Those "thousands" of phones are irrelevant. We look at its competition as of Sept. 12, 2012. The one X, SIII, New razer phones, and Lumia 920 all outdo the 5 regarding resolution. And it is likely the same can be said regarding screen quality for a few of them as well. And it is likely that samsung and HTC will announce the next generation of their android phones in a few months putting apple even further behind.

that's all assumptions as far as screen quality goes at this point.

I bet you likely had LTE enabled which would significantly cut into the batterylife. And the SIII may be debatable, but the new motorola razer will have the longest endurance and it seems the lumia 920 will also offer comparable if not better batterylife than the 5 as well.

Nope. LTE isn't even in this area, so I disabled it. Yes, the Maxx will might have the best battery life due to the 3300mAh, or not due to the hd screen with its yellow tinge and pixels apparently showing up. /smh


Because apple used to offer cutting edge features in performance. They could have offered LTE on the 4S, even if it was only available to a limited amount of their market/customers, but they decided to hold off for nearly a year until the next refresh.

And I wouldn't be surprised if apple integrates NFC into the 5s. Sometimes you get the feeling that apple holds back on certain things just to make it easier for them to impress with the next revision.

I honestly don't see the reason to include LTE in phones when the network coverage was really small. The NFC, They'll integrate it when it becomes something that is used in a lot of places. OR, they'll keep expanding on the integrated app they showed in the keynote. Where can you use NFC? I

Considering the sales pace of the SIII and that it is being sold for $99 on certain carriers/retailers I wouldn't be surprised if sales increase in the next few months due to the value offered by it, and people electing to not buy the iphone 5 in favor of another smartphone.

That's something we'll definitely be able to address in a month or so, if not sooner.


Not sure what the point of this statement was since I essentially said the same thing.



You are truly narrowminded if that is the best you can come up with. For one you actually get a fluid OS (unlike android) that is available on multiple form factors. Surely you can't say with a straight face that a one phone fits all approach is better than having multiple choices.

I'm not narrow minded. I'm realistic. Let me know when there are apps out that are worth it, that compete with the Android/iOS content. I don't need to use my phone as a computer. Those that do, might like that kind of supported platform, minus the use of other apps/games platform.

Secondly, expanding on the hardware side, its pretty clear that the 920 outdoes the iphone 5:

http://www.zdnet.com/seven-reasons-t...20-7000003950/

It's pretty clear by using a Windows Phone article that guesses at a lot lol. He's an avid Windows phone user.. good slanted article I guess.

But back to your windows comment, how is that a bad thing?

Applications and support from the developers. This has been something Windows phones have been in last place compared to anything. I don't have much enthusiasm that Microsoft is going to do much better in this area.

They are linking windows, office, xbox and windows phone 8 together. Since windows 8 and WP8 share a kernel, that makes cross development of programs/apps much easier and quicker that before. I wouldn't be surprised if the next xbox OS is also based on the Windows 8 kernel. And all of this will be linked together through Microsoft's windows live services ensuring that your data/info is available across various platforms and is up to date.

That's a more compelling ecosystem than any other being offered.

Compelling in what way? I need to get the apps and product support I want/need to use. I don't want to be restricted into a world of Windows.


You said it yourself, you have tried BB, android and ios. If you want a complete picture, you need to try the 4th option, WP8.

I'd love to try it. Unfortunately, I'm not ready to pay $600+ for a phone to try it. That's based on a lot of years that Windows "based" phones have just been really insufficient for me.

[SchaffinOSX]

So, I need to hear some arguments here. There are two pretty big purchases I'll be making fairly soon: I'm due for an AT&T upgrade come next month, and as college nears closer, I have to start thinking about the kind of laptop I'd like to get. As someone who has had his iMac since 2008 and has spent a good deal of money buying apps for the iPhone, I'm wary to switch over to a PC or another brand of cell-phone.

That said, I'm hearing more and more arguments (mostly from my peers) concerning why I should be leaving Apple behind and opting for computers like Lenovo or Alienware and phones more like the Galaxy SIII. When it comes to phones, I'm pretty dead set on getting the iPhone 5; I love my iPhone 4, as it's been immensely reliable and I've liked everything I've seen of the iPhone 5. When it comes to purchasing a new computer, though, I'm less convinced. There's no arguing that for less money, one can purchase a PC laptop with better specifications than a Macbook, but is that all that matters?

Of course, I've loved every operating system since Leopard, and understand virtually every aspect of how to use a Mac. PC's, on the other hand, are somewhat foreign to me; I use them frequently at school and used to before my iMac, but neither of those things have given me enough time to really "learn" the OS.

What I'm asking is this: Is spending the extra money on a Macbook Pro worth it, or is the more practical and worthwhile thing to do to switch over to PC?

[F34R]

So, I need to hear some arguments here. There are two pretty big purchases I'll be making fairly soon: I'm due for an AT&T upgrade come next month, and as college nears closer, I have to start thinking about the kind of laptop I'd like to get. As someone who has had his iMac since 2008 and has spent a good deal of money buying apps for the iPhone, I'm wary to switch over to a PC or another brand of cell-phone.

That said, I'm hearing more and more arguments (mostly from my peers) concerning why I should be leaving Apple behind and opting for computers like Lenovo or Alienware and phones more like the Galaxy SIII. When it comes to phones, I'm pretty dead set on getting the iPhone 5; I love my iPhone 4, as it's been immensely reliable and I've liked everything I've seen of the iPhone 5. When it comes to purchasing a new computer, though, I'm less convinced. There's no arguing that for less money, one can purchase a PC laptop with better specifications than a Macbook, but is that all that matters?

Of course, I've loved every operating system since Leopard, and understand virtually every aspect of how to use a Mac. PC's, on the other hand, are somewhat foreign to me; I use them frequently at school and used to before my iMac, but neither of those things have given me enough time to really "learn" the OS.

What I'm asking is this: Is spending the extra money on a Macbook Pro worth it, or is the more practical and worthwhile thing to do to switch over to PC?

You spend the money on what is more useful for you. Anyone else here will give their opinions that are based on their own likes, dislikes, experiences, etc. What's most important is that you use a product that fits your needs the best.

[Naxi]

[F34R]

I watched that earlier and laughed pretty good on it. I think they could do that with any phone lol.

[Lethal_NFS]

I am installing iOS 6 on my iPhone 4S right now. If you guys want to get the final build of iOS 6, you can download it in the link below for whichever device you have.

http://lifehacker.com/5942469/upgrad...os-6-right-now

[MATRIX 2]

Android phones are competing against each other. That's why you see them the way they are right now. The only phone I've have was a BB Tour, that came to where my iPhone is in regards to battery life. What's the speed of the US based S3? What's the speed of the A6? How do you determine that apple doesn't have these hardware specs better than the Android phones? What's boring about it? Using it? The best part of this is that if the phone isn't for you, then there are other phones to buy that will fit your needs. I wish the iPhone was configurable like the S3, for sure. However, it hasn't diminished how the iPhone 4 works for me. f the S3 was as fluid and stable between battery life, apps, and usage, compared to the iPhone, I'd have it still.

Sure, but when you have multiple phones (like the SIII, One X, nexus, ect.) that are essentially the same spec wise, you have to turn to other more subjective metrics to pick one over the other. We can look at the architecture the A6 is based on to extrapolate how it will fare against chips used in current phones like the SIII, one X, 920, ect. Yes, ios is boring. Its just grid after grid with a limited feature set that only gets major updates ~once per year.

When there are certain features in android that have been around for a while that are missing in ios, it really makes you wonder what exactly apple is doing.

Some examples of what I'm talking about are mentioned in this video series:

That's probably because their customers aren't relying on announcing specs. They are more concerned about the experience. That's what I'd guess. It's not about promoting CPU speed, ram, etc. The android phones have to because they are competing with X amount of other Android phones by other companies.

That's the thing though. Apple does compete on specs, but they used words/lingo instead to mask them. For example, retina. They use that term so they don't associate with a specific resolution or even ppi (depending on device). It better suits their more subliminal/manipulative style of marketing. Apple could be more upfront about this, but then again if they can get away with it....

that's all assumptions as far as screen quality goes at this point.

Not really. We have the data on the One X and SIII screens. And going by apples spec sheet the only major change in their ips display is the screen gamut. Brightness and contrast numbers still have the same published values as the 4/4s.

Nope. LTE isn't even in this area, so I disabled it. Yes, the Maxx will might have the best battery life due to the 3300mAh, or not due to the hd screen with its yellow tinge and pixels apparently showing up. /smh

How can you say that if the maxx doesn't even ship till the end of the year.

I honestly don't see the reason to include LTE in phones when the network coverage was really small. The NFC, They'll integrate it when it becomes something that is used in a lot of places. OR, they'll keep expanding on the integrated app they showed in the keynote. Where can you use NFC? I

Because it doesn't make sense to not even have it as an option for those who do have access to it. If you lived in an area where it wasn't available, you could just turn it off and not worry about it. As for NFC, while deployment in the US is limited, its in use in a lot of areas in Europe (for various purposes) among other continents/regions/countries.

I'm not narrow minded. I'm realistic. Let me know when there are apps out that are worth it, that compete with the Android/iOS content. I don't need to use my phone as a computer. Those that do, might like that kind of supported platform, minus the use of other apps/games platform.

Well for one, there are certain features that are built into the OS, which removes the need for the app. Secondly do you have any specific apps in mind. From what I've seen, there are good apps for nearly ever category in the WP marketplace. As far as quality is concerned, properly done WP apps are better integrated into WP than the same apps are in ios/android.

It's pretty clear by using a Windows Phone article that guesses at a lot lol. He's an avid Windows phone user.. good slanted article I guess.

The specs are what they are, no getting around that.

Applications and support from the developers. This has been something Windows phones have been in last place compared to anything. I don't have much enthusiasm that Microsoft is going to do much better in this area.

Like I said, WP8 and Windows 8 share a kernel. Considering the big push MS will have for W8 and Windows RT app development, it is not unreasonable to see developers porting these apps to WP8. As for any remaining android/ios apps I see capitalism driving those developers. Considering the existing userbase and the likely influx of new customers/users this holiday season, I don't see it being an issue for much longer. Hell, I'll even predict this issue to be essentially nonexistent by the end of next year. And I'm neglecting to mention any alternative incentives that may be offered by MS for developers to make WP8 apps.

Compelling in what way? I need to get the apps and product support I want/need to use. I don't want to be restricted into a world of Windows.

You have neglected to discuss specifics. And I doubt you will ever be restricted to a world of windows (not that it matters since the rest of the world will bow to MS like they have to apple).

I'd love to try it. Unfortunately, I'm not ready to pay $600+ for a phone to try it. That's based on a lot of years that Windows "based" phones have just been really insufficient for me.

Who said all windows phones will cost $600+ unlocked?

And judging current windows phones based off of past models is like judging the iphone based on the apple newton.

Now is the perfect time to switch, before you become too entrenched in one ecosystem. (I'd imaging you wouldn't be switching phones for several years after paying the full price)

I wouldn't say the iPhones ever had the best battery life or camera that's for sure. They still have the best touchscreen interface and mobile OS, IMO. I don't really care for the customisation on the iPhone, it works pretty much perfectly out of the box. Add that with a jailbreak and SBS Settings and it's all I'll ever need


BBK. Tapatalking.

Perhaps not the best overall, but at the top in each respective category. Especially considering the overall package.

So, I need to hear some arguments here. There are two pretty big purchases I'll be making fairly soon: I'm due for an AT&T upgrade come next month, and as college nears closer, I have to start thinking about the kind of laptop I'd like to get. As someone who has had his iMac since 2008 and has spent a good deal of money buying apps for the iPhone, I'm wary to switch over to a PC or another brand of cell-phone.

That said, I'm hearing more and more arguments (mostly from my peers) concerning why I should be leaving Apple behind and opting for computers like Lenovo or Alienware and phones more like the Galaxy SIII. When it comes to phones, I'm pretty dead set on getting the iPhone 5; I love my iPhone 4, as it's been immensely reliable and I've liked everything I've seen of the iPhone 5. When it comes to purchasing a new computer, though, I'm less convinced. There's no arguing that for less money, one can purchase a PC laptop with better specifications than a Macbook, but is that all that matters?

Of course, I've loved every operating system since Leopard, and understand virtually every aspect of how to use a Mac. PC's, on the other hand, are somewhat foreign to me; I use them frequently at school and used to before my iMac, but neither of those things have given me enough time to really "learn" the OS.

What I'm asking is this: Is spending the extra money on a Macbook Pro worth it, or is the more practical and worthwhile thing to do to switch over to PC?

Do you want to live in a world where you remain in the comfort zone, or are you willing to change things up with new and different experiences?

As I said to f34r, you may be set on an iphone 5, but I wouldn't discount taking a look at the new WP8 phones before making your commitment firm and further entrenching yourself in a particular smartphone ecosystem.

As for computers, as far as hardware is concerned: Buy a business class laptop, they are worth the additional cost over consumer grade hardware. It's not worth gong through the BS typically affecting consumer laptops.

Even then, you still have many more options that what apple tends to offer, its up to you to decide what your needs are and then base a purchase off of that. And there are a lot of interesting laptop/tablet designs that are going to be releases with the launch of Windows 8.

As far as the OS is concerned, it really isn't that difficult. And considering the start menu changes in Windows 8 you lack of knowledge of the Windows os could actually be beneficial.

As for spending the extra money? In the end it comes down to the OS. IF you are bound to OSX then you really don't have a choice in the matter. But if you are able to uses windows without any major issues than you do have a choice and it comes down to what else can you get for the same or less amount of money.

I will say this, factor in the cost of a warranty (with accidental damage protection) into the costs of your computer. I've seen too much shit go down in college where it doesn't make sense to forgo it.

[MjW]

How many apps are in the windows marketplace anyway?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

[BoyBettaKnow]

Has anyone from the UK on O2 been able to pre-order? I called them up and they say you have to register 'interest' online and then they email you, i've had nothing from them yet.