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  1. #301
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    i fail, the people suing sony will fail
    as there is no basis for the lawsuit.

  2. #302
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    Quote Originally Posted by scottscorpion View Post
    i fail, the people suing sony will fail
    as there is no basis for the lawsuit.
    There are plenty of people that do think it has merit, so... the ruling is all that really matters.




  3. #303
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    when does the case begin...or finish

  4. #304
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    See, scott, no offense, but have you even read anything about what's going on? I mean, are you just following the comments here, or have you actually read the article the OP links to, the complaint, etc?

    Sony is set to respond August 25th, and September 1st....

    http://ia331218.us.archive.org/2/ite...94.docket.html




  5. #305
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    Quote Originally Posted by F34R View Post
    Since losing PSN isn't the basis of the lawsuit, again, you failed. No, no one pays to use this site. This site is 100% completely free to use.
    The basis of the lawsuit is lack of access to proprietary PSN service and proprietary future versions of Sony's OS.

    They are using this because they are given a choice between a feature that isn't even on an itemized list of things you can do with the PS3 at purchase and other features that are.

    This of course added to the fact that it wasn't advertised goes against what they are saying about it being "extremely valuable"and there is no bait and switch complaint if it wasn't listed as a feature and the sheer fact that even if it was people had over 3 years of use of it. So to prove it was planned from the start would be a very tough case. They are protected because they could say it was a reactionary move to the publicized geohot hacking.

    The idea that they are going for an unconscionable contract is even worse.

    In contract law an unconscionable contract is one that is unjust or extremely one-sided in favor of the person who has the superior bargaining power. An unconscionable contract is one that no person who is mentally competent would enter into and that no fair and honest person would accept. Courts find that unconscionable contracts usually result from the exploitation of consumers who are often poorly educated, impoverished, and unable to find the best price available in the competitive marketplace.

    Unconscionability is determined by examining the circumstances of the parties when the contract was made; these circumstances include, for example, the bargaining power, age, and mental capacity of the parties. The doctrine is applied only where it would be an affront to the integrity of the judicial system to enforce such contracts.
    Unconscionable conduct is also found in acts of Fraud and deceit, where the deliberate Misrepresentation of fact deprives someone of a valuable possession. Whenever someone takes unconscionable advantage of another person, the action may be treated as criminal fraud or the civil action of deceit.
    When the smoke clears on this one I really do feel that Sony is going to win and people should stop abusing the legal system until they have a real case.

    Sony might really be in trouble if the ever decide to remove f@h /s

  6. #306
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    Quote Originally Posted by F34R View Post
    See, scott, no offense, but have you even read anything about what's going on? I mean, are you just following the comments here, or have you actually read the article the OP links to, the complaint, etc?

    Sony is set to respond August 25th, and September 1st....

    http://ia331218.us.archive.org/2/ite...94.docket.html
    nope not read nothing into it.
    i did read sonys t+cs though and by agreeing to them you are more or less opting out of any state laws that cover the area.

  7. #307
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    Quote Originally Posted by scottscorpion View Post
    nope not read nothing into it.
    i did read sonys t+cs though and by agreeing to them you are more or less opting out of any state laws that cover the area.
    No, you don't more or less opt out of.... wow... never mind lol.




  8. #308
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    Quote Originally Posted by scottscorpion View Post
    nope not read nothing into it.
    i did read sonys t+cs though and by agreeing to them you are more or less opting out of any state laws that cover the area.
    That is categorically false and you SHOULD know that by now. Nothing and I mean NOTHING trumps local, state and federal laws of the given country in which you reside except for the constitution which IS the SUPREME law of the land.

    Nice try and thanks for playing.

  9. #309
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    Morg, you're wasting your time...




  10. #310
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    You don't pay to sign up and use PSN its only when you buy something witch is Captain Obvious...

  11. #311
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    Quote Originally Posted by scottscorpion View Post
    nope not read nothing into it.
    i did read sonys t+cs though and by agreeing to them you are more or less opting out of any state laws that cover the area.
    What makes you think that?

    Can you be more specific about which parts lead you to believe that?

    I have never heard of a TOS or EULA superseding law. If Sony really did try that then the entire contract would be void and these people would have won their case.

  12. #312
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    Quote Originally Posted by F34R View Post
    Morg, you're wasting your time...
    Maybe. But I thought I'd give it try anyway.

  13. #313
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    I'm sure this lawsuit may be a worthwhile cause for some, and maybe it has a bunch of merit..but in this day and age, we live in that "I'll SUE you" frame of mind..where anyone can sue individuals/corporations/entities for things as minute as "my boss said 'Hello Guys' and being female, I take that as sexual harassment"...and up to such things as corporate BS as we see here. You can't tell me that when you think of SCE, you don't imagine a building with SONY written on the side, and a bunch of CEO's and chairmen sitting on gold chairs, with secretaries that do EVERYTHING from wipe to "favors" for them..no one imagines a father of 3, with all under age 5, barely making ends meet, working 12hr days just to stay afloat...no one thinks of that when they file these lawsuits..or if they do, then these baseless claims of "I felt some pain in my left shoulder when SONY removed the Other OS option" wouldn't be ground for civil {wastes of time}..i mean, lawsuits.

    Anyone who imagines a big-named company, like Wal-Mart, Sony, Home Depot, Lowes..any large corporation..all that comes to mind is some big-wig corporate honchos with money to burn, the ones driving a different Benz to work each day..

    The only reason suits like this exist is because someone wants to get something for nothing. In a scenario where this case is lost by Sony..and a billion-dollar judgment is granted, do you think the people who win the judgment are going to REINSTATE the Other OS feature? You think you'll see it back in the XMB menu a week after this case is finalized? I seriously doubt it. The folks who are filing this civil complaint will have a judgment, more than like a settled out of court type, and will walk away with whatever offer Sony attorneys think is reasonable...and never to be heard from again.
    And once they buy their home in Malibu, get their Benz for every day of the week, and are living the dream, they'll brag about how they "took the big man" for millions and will be no different than the image they had of Sony when they filed their suit in civil court. It's a mockery of the justice system..no one was done any injustice by this move from Sony..people just think they were because they are convinced that they don't like a company being able to say what CAN and CANNOT be done with said companies equipment. This is prime example of childish grownups with too much time on their hands who are basically saying "Sony made me do it and i dont wanna...waaaahhh waaahhh"
    No damages are done as a result of this.

    I mean, how dare a company think they can actually make EVERYONE pay for using software, and make everyone purchase their own copy of games/copyrighted media? How dare they..I mean..we all are entitled to get whatever we want free simply for being citizens of {country name here}

    I'm sure someone has some long, drawn out reason of why I'm just absolutely wrong with my statement..thats good. It's nice to see that the greed is fed by those who believe greed is the proper way to get somewhere. If this weren't based on greed, and this case was a victory against Sony, then the people who get the CHUNK of money would design their OWN system that runs linux, and provide free firmware support for years after the sale of the unit..correct? That's what we're all expecting here? Because, if this is won, we all know that the money will be used for R&D (that's research and development) for a system similar to the PS3, and those complaining will run out and buy one, completely satisfied by this case and it's result (in a theoretical scenario, of course)

    No, all of you KNOW good and well we won't see that. This is FUELED by greedy people who think because a company did something that more than 1 or 2 people aren't happy with that there's reason to sue. If it weren't a movement by greedy folks who want something changed because a few aren't happy, then we would not see a dollar settlement even involved..no..it would be a reversal of what Sony did. But no one is filing for that..because there's a dollar amount that will be satisfactory and will comfort the ones who are so "hurt"

    It's sad when you can put a dollar amount on something like a company revising it's own proprietary hardware. That in itself shows exactly the intention by these who run out and sue because they have gum stuck to their shoe...and sue the gum manufacturer for making chewing gum sticky.


    'It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt.' - Abraham Lincoln

  14. #314
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    please post the exact law sony has broken?

    if you accepted Sony's T&C's you then are in a legally binding contract which is the law.

  15. #315
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    Quote Originally Posted by jonathanm1978 View Post
    The folks who are filing this civil complaint will have a judgment, more than like a settled out of court type, and will walk away with whatever offer Sony attorneys think is reasonable...and never to be heard from again.
    And once they buy their home in Malibu, get their Benz for every day of the week, and are living the dream, they'll brag about how they "took the big man" for millions and will be no different than the image they had of Sony when they filed their suit in civil court.

    *snip*

    I'm sure someone has some long, drawn out reason of why I'm just absolutely wrong with my statement..
    Actually I can pretty much sum it up in 8 words:

    "You don't understand how class action lawsuits work"


  16. #316
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    Quote Originally Posted by SnowHawk View Post
    please post the exact law sony has broken?

    if you accepted Sony's T&C's you then are in a legally binding contract which is the law.
    Read the complaint.




  17. #317
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kydosan View Post
    Actually I can pretty much sum it up in 8 words:

    "You don't understand how class action lawsuits work"


    And you can pretty much fail at trying to say that I don't understand legal battles. I've had a PACER account for years (Christ I hope you know what that is...FAIL if you don't) and I read and interpret various legal documents. If I don't understand them, I can always ask my wife, who just finished paralegal classes, even though her major is nothing to do with law.

    I totally understand class action suits....this suit doesn't contain the materials to be a class action. A suit like that means a large group of people bring a claim against a group of people, or company (defendants) (also known as a representative lawsuit).

    If Pfizer releases a drug that 1500 people take and they suddenly die from it, that's ground for a class action suit. The makers of Oxycontin - the pain killer for chronic to severe pain - are in a class action suit because if someone suddenly stops taking their drug, they will have a heart attack...
    Physical or personal DAMAGES arise, and the cause is something that the defendant is liable for...or the defendant is the cause of.

    Last I checked, there were no stories on the local news of a mass group of people who were suddenly going into congestive heart failure from lack of "Install Other OS" in their Ps3's.

    Exactly what damages does this group of people claim SONY is the cause of? What part of this suit is NOT fueled by greed..

    And please, in the answer, try not to use the term "they want" or "we want"....

    Over half the cases on the civil dockets are because (Plaintiff/complaintant) WANTS something from (Defendant / accused)..and usually in civil cases, it has a price tag on it...meaning their WANT can be ceased by a monetary gain.
    And there exists a LARGE difference in something that people WANT and something that people NEED.

    You NEED a TV to make your PS3 operate...file civil case suing SONY because the PS3 doesn't include a TV?

    You NEED electricity to make the PS3 function at all...Sue SONY because the power company turns off your electricity when you dont pay the bill..i mean, you'd have damages from that (spoiled food, no hot water, etc)

    Of course not...you dont hear of cases like that because they would OBVIOUSLY be stupid and without merit..and the person filing such a suit would be deemed a greedy bastich that only wanted something for nothing..

    Explain how damages are arising because of the lack of being able to have "Install Other OS" in the PS3. What damages are there? (And I mean serious damages, not some make believe like I just stated about power and the TV)

    I can already tell you that your answer is going to be related to a greedy conclusion..someone saw dollar signs and greed is fueling them to want something for nothing...

    What a country..where you can not even have a job, hurt your hand opening an aspirin bottle, and sue the company that made the bottle for damages and never have to work again in your life!! Now THAT is justice, right? Same here..I see a LOT of people here want JUSTICE from SONY for their wrong-doing..which I've yet to understand the wrong in..but oh well..there are enough greed-driven excuses for the plaintiffs in this one thread...


    'It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt.' - Abraham Lincoln

  18. #318
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    OK, but it's still a class action suit, read the filing - I'm pretty sure the lawyers who filed it had some understanding of what they were doing.

    Seriously, read it, it will help you immeasurably in ths discussion to be informed of the basic facts.

  19. #319
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    really hope sony learn a lesson from this, really unacceptable imo. i mean they totuted it as a computer a couple of years ago + now theyve done this, really disappointing

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    if sony loses they will lose a **** load of cash..lesss exclusives !

    drunk sorry

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    Quote Originally Posted by F34R View Post
    See, scott, no offense, but have you even read anything about what's going on? I mean, are you just following the comments here, or have you actually read the article the OP links to, the complaint, etc?

    Sony is set to respond August 25th, and September 1st....

    http://ia331218.us.archive.org/2/ite...94.docket.html
    I think the third cause of action (unjust enrichenment) will get shot down pretty quickly. I can't think of one way that Sony made any money allowing or removing linux, actually I'd be sure they could prove they lost money in both cases.

  22. #322
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rekmon View Post
    I think the third cause of action (unjust enrichenment) will get shot down pretty quickly. I can't think of one way that Sony made any money allowing or removing linux, actually I'd be sure they could prove they lost money in both cases.
    I understand the crux of it is that people who would otherwise have gone for one of the cheaper consoles saw Linux as a factor in their decision to splash out on a PS3.

    I'm still hoping to see similar action in Europe - AFAIK they pushed Linux partly to dodge certain EU taxes so presumably they've exposed themselves in a big way over here by flicking the "it's just a game console now!" switch.

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    I really hope they lose because I want Linux on my Ps3. Sony dug their own hole, I hope they can't get out of it now.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kydosan View Post
    I understand the crux of it is that people who would otherwise have gone for one of the cheaper consoles saw Linux as a factor in their decision to splash out on a PS3.
    Doesn't matter if those people decided to buy a ps3 because of linux, it still didn't make Sony a penny. Remember they lost money on every linux capable console sold.

    I'm not saying that the lawsuit doesn't have any merit whatsoever, but that part of it is BS IMO.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kydosan View Post
    I'm still hoping to see similar action in Europe - AFAIK they pushed Linux partly to dodge certain EU taxes so presumably they've exposed themselves in a big way over here by flicking the "it's just a game console now!" switch.
    And if they have to pay those back taxes the cost of it will probably be passed on to consumers in some way.

  25. #325
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pirata Nervo View Post
    I really hope they lose because I want Linux on my Ps3. Sony dug their own hole, I hope they can't get out of it now.
    Yeah, SONY dug their own hole by giving something to people that they never should've given to begin with. HOW DARE they make their box TRY to be an open-source media server..it was ALL to help SONY ---wait, they didn't make anything from that (Open source, that does still mean free, right?)...

    Oh, but I'm greedy too, and I liked having that extra option in my XMB..its just UNFAIR that now I have one less menu item in my XMB and I WANT I WANT I WANT.

    How childish does this get before it is met with an actual common sense approach? Saying that you think SONY dug a hole, and you hope they can't get out of it is basically making a remark against ALL of us who PAY FOR GAMES. You want us to be passed the buck on whatever this WOULD cost SONY if they lost this suit, and I don't appreciate someone saying that what I pay $65 new isn't enough, that I should have to pay MORE for it because of something that doesn't affect me whatsoever.

    You may not think that's what you're basically saying, but when companies take a loss like that, they pass it to the customers, and I'm a customer every time I purchase a disc-based PS3 game...so WHY do I have to pay for Other OS support just because you, or anyone else disagrees with SONY's approach to removing that? I think I pay enough and I'm not overly excited about paying even more when I'm about to purchase my 2nd PS3 and have to buy the same game twice just so the wife and I can play the same game at same time...that's over 130 for a game that we both want.
    Statements like this are exactly what I was referring to when I said that greed was driving the reasoning in this case..because in the end we all know who will foot the bill for a lost lawsuit.


    'It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt.' - Abraham Lincoln

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