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    Quote Originally Posted by GreatSpaceKoaster View Post
    To Vulgotha......

    First of all, I'm both conservative and libertarian. As for Republicans? Not all Republicans are conservative. We've had our share of non-conservative Republicans get into office. George W. Bush wasn't very conservative. He spent too much money. He also introduced a HUGE new entitlement when he signed the Medicare Part D bill.

    As for the military? You sound like the Ron Paul crowd. The stick your head in the sand crowd. The defense of our country is not a gravy train. Not when those involved can lose their lives for a war or conflict they may not always agree with. They just do their job despite the risk. The defense of the country's very existence was the cornerstone of why the federal government was formed. Not to hand out government freebies.

    The reason we spend so much money on our military is because in order to have the best chance at defending ourselves, we must invest in the best military as possible. Especially if we would have to go up against a country like China with 1.3 billion people vs. our 317 million. And getting the brightest people and ideas doesn't come cheap. Is there some military waste? Yes. But a true conservative will flush it out. A pork barrel wannabe conservative Republican will not.

    True conservatives believe in being as self-sufficient as possible. Not coming from the attitude of what's the next freebie I can come up with to hand out to people so they can become dependent on government. I mean, we have cities run by liberals that will pay for a city worker's sex change operation at taxpayer expense. Why am I paying for someone's elective surgery? They aren't gonna die as a result of not getting the surgery. They think they were born the wrong sex? Save up your own $#@!ing money to pay for it and stop leeching off the rest of us to get it for free. I don't mind helping the truly needy in our country. But all I've seen in this country is the entitlement mentality grow and grow as each year goes by.

    People start framing things as "rights" to get them paid for by somebody else. Just look at the birth control mandate in Obamacare. Birth control is cheap, not a medical necessity. Yet.... they want others to pay for it cuz free birth control to them is a "human right".

    As for a 3rd party? We have one in the Republican party.... it's called the Tea Party. The Tea Party is there so the Republican party gets back to being conservative instead of acting like Democrat-lites. A party that believes that a man that earns a dollar, should be able to keep as much of it as possible. Not devising ways of taking more and more of it away from him. A party that believes in keeping rights, not finding reasons to take them away.
    Generally speaking I regard our two party set up with extreme disdain. It is repugnant, and I view the key players in those parties with equal distaste.

    The Tea Party is anything but 'independent', its been hijacked and enslaved.

    Few things to address concerning the military.


    1. http://www.military.com/features/0,15240,246954,00.html <-- Enough said. Being a bureaucrat in a uniform should not entitle you to superior pay vs your private counter parts especially without any kind of higher education.

    2. China is a paper dragon if there ever was one.

    First, we're both nuclear powers and there has never been a hot war between two such nations (not even India and Pakistan who despise each other).

    Secondly, we are their biggest trading partner- it is not beneficial at all for either entity in this relationship to engage in hostilities.

    Third, the military situation is so out of balance that its laughable.

    The Chinese have zero force projection. As of this writing, they have a single 1970's refitted ukrainian aircraft carrier in their navy. They're building their own, but their military is so excruciatingly beneath ours that it begs the question where all this fear of China's military prowess originated from.

    From a naval and air power point of view, they are decimated. Their military technology is exceptionally far behind ours, and why wouldn't it be? I mean just look at how stupid this is:



    Just this isn't lost on anybody: Our military funding is literally over 3x what the Chinese and Russians spend combined. And they are the only 'adversaries' we face on the international stage in the conventional sense. Our military budget is clearly out of control and this is a huge part of why I broke away from mainstream "conservatism" and the Republican party. There is no way you can look at this and justify what we're doing, especially if you've been around our military institutions and have talked to many of the people in there (I have more than a dozen friends and associates from all branches and ranks, and lived outside Offutt AFB\Stratcom majority of my life). It's just a bloated, inefficient, mess of a gravy train.

    Most of the people in the military "aren't heroes", just average (and often enough, below average) people who are looking to keep themselves solvent, have pressure put on them to join (family heritage), and\or buy into the "hero" worship that we engage in.

    I'm not an anarchist, I believe that government should exist and that we most definitely need a military. But it's time to face the facts and accept that it has now developed a life all its own. The military industrial complex is very real.

    Further, the war of the next generation is here and we are ill equipped to face it. You want to see a very astitute way of handling insurgency and asymmetrical warfare? A very good embodiment can be seen in the (former) GRU Spetsnaz from Russia. We should have a more accurate and decentralized fighting force to deal with what we're facing now.

    We cannot fight a war with material, manpower and high technology like we used too. This worked for us in WW2, Korea and it started to wane a bit in Vietnam. But now? We cannot keep this up. It's pointless. Having a large, expensive, sophisticated standing army and shackling them under last generational warfare doctrine is only a gross expenditure of lives, resources and time. Why? Because we're not dealing with nation states anymore. We are dealing with cells of individuals of various nationalities waging discreet warfare which fund themselves through illicit (blackmarket) dealings and quiet funding from sympathetic\antagonistic powers. You can't simply "invade" that, nor can you just start drone striking ad nauseum. Especially if it is completely without the consent of the national body said individuals are residing in- this is a great way to multiply your enemies while achieving not a whole hell of a lot.

    Contrary to the perspective of the Fallout narrator, and more in alignment with Old Snake's view, war has certainly changed.

    Got a bit off tangent here. But let's address the "well the Chinese have an enormous population!" argument:

    The Chinese, for all their people, are facing down the barrel of old age. There are simply not enough young people or women, and this is a direct result of their 'one child policy'. An entire nation of aging and elderly, and no substantial younger generation to come after them.

    http://world.time.com/2013/11/21/chi...more-children/

    This has massive economic repercussions and, naturally, military ones as well.

    http://www.economist.com/node/18651512

    In summary, China is no threat to the United States and is certainly not a justification for our egregiously massive military spending.

    And don't even get me started on the nonsense behind 'moral warfare'... But that's an entirely different discussion. I am not sticking my head in the sand, nor am I some "peace loving hippie". I'm just pragmatic.

    I have no faith in (neo\theo)conservatism in the United States nor our political system. A drastic change of perspective is necessary.
    Last edited by Vulgotha; 01-15-2014 at 01:51.


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    It seems that a small portion of American's have this cloud of paranoia above there head about big nations wanting to start a war with them. China is a big trading partner with the US and it would be very silly of the Chinese to even contemplate "getting even" with the US in anyway. The US has lots of allies around the world way more than China, and have military bases in very keynote places. The US has not even got involved in Syria where there is a lot of conflict between government rebels and the Jihad, remember that there is still occupation in Iraq and Afghanistan and that war has not been won.
    Sent from my computer using keyboard.

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    To Vulgotha.....

    First of all... you explain how the Tea Party has been "been hijacked and enslaved"?!?!?

    As for the gravy train in the military? Maybe for some officers and if so, they should be frozen. But the average grunt isn't overpaid. And if there is any government gravy train I'm willing to even remotely tolerate, it's the military and ONLY the military!

    As for China? Doesn't matter if they are our biggest trading partner. They have big trading relationships with countries around the China sea. And based on their increasingly hostile actions in the China Sea with those very trading partners, they don't seem to be too worried about the relationships with them.

    Giving me defense dollars spent on Chinese defense Vs. the USA is deceiving. Where do you think a defense dollar goes farther.... paying Chinese level salaries or American level salaries? If you adjust for that, the Chinese defense budget is in reality higher then the numbers comparison would otherwise show.

    You are also talking about how China is a paper tiger? They have been dramatically increasing their military budgets....especially in the last 10 years. They are 2nd biggest military spenders in the world.

    They have been setting the ground work for a future conflict with their spending habits....

    Drones...including stealth ones...

    http://www.ibtimes.com/rise-chinas-d...n-asia-1535718

    Stealth Fighters...


    http://www.wantchinatimes.com/news-s...00088&cid=1101

    China planning 110,000-ton 'super aircraft carrier' to rival US naval power......

    http://rt.com/news/china-super-aircraft-carrier-634/

    An aircraft carrier killer missile.....

    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...iller-missile/

    Submarines that are undetectable.....

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...red-faced.html

    Hypersonic Nuclear missiles....

    http://www.scmp.com/news/china/artic...issile-carrier

    And I haven't even gotten to the stuff Russia has done and has plans of doing......


    http://thetruthwins.com/archives/new...em-black-holes


    So China might not be "there" ....YET. But they are coming and they are gonna keep spending more and more. And if we listen to people like you, we are eventually gonna have are asses handed to us asking...."but but but I thought the Chinese were paper tigers?"

    And Russia is gunning for us too. Their military budgets are expanding as well.

    So while you can dismiss the need to keep a top notch military, the notion hasn't been lost on the Russians and the Chinese. For those countries that claim they have no ill intent, they suuuuuure are ratcheting up their military capabilities.

    As for the population numbers of China? They will work it out. I don't see any chance of us coming close to them in anybody's lifetime. They will be a formidable country to deal with and will have the sheer numbers.


    To MacP...

    $#@! capitalism more socialism the better
    As long as you keep your leeches on that side of the pond, enjoy all the Socialism you want. Keep it the hell out of the USA!

    Also... I believe in a flat tax. You complain about tax loopholes? I say... get rid of all tax breaks for companies, the rich, the middle class and the poor. Nobody should get them.....PERIOD!

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    Quote Originally Posted by GreatSpaceKoaster View Post
    To Vulgotha.....

    First of all... you explain how the Tea Party has been "been hijacked and enslaved"?!?!?

    As for the gravy train in the military? Maybe for some officers and if so, they should be frozen. But the average grunt isn't overpaid. And if there is any government gravy train I'm willing to even remotely tolerate, it's the military and ONLY the military!

    As for China? Doesn't matter if they are our biggest trading partner. They have big trading relationships with countries around the China sea. And based on their increasingly hostile actions in the China Sea with those very trading partners, they don't seem to be too worried about the relationships with them.

    Giving me defense dollars spent on Chinese defense Vs. the USA is deceiving. Where do you think a defense dollar goes farther.... paying Chinese level salaries or American level salaries? If you adjust for that, the Chinese defense budget is in reality higher then the numbers comparison would otherwise show.

    You are also talking about how China is a paper tiger? They have been dramatically increasing their military budgets....especially in the last 10 years. They are 2nd biggest military spenders in the world.

    They have been setting the ground work for a future conflict with their spending habits....

    Drones...including stealth ones...

    http://www.ibtimes.com/rise-chinas-d...n-asia-1535718

    Stealth Fighters...


    http://www.wantchinatimes.com/news-s...00088&cid=1101

    China planning 110,000-ton 'super aircraft carrier' to rival US naval power......

    http://rt.com/news/china-super-aircraft-carrier-634/

    An aircraft carrier killer missile.....

    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...iller-missile/

    Submarines that are undetectable.....

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...red-faced.html

    Hypersonic Nuclear missiles....

    http://www.scmp.com/news/china/artic...issile-carrier

    And I haven't even gotten to the stuff Russia has done and has plans of doing......


    http://thetruthwins.com/archives/new...em-black-holes


    So China might not be "there" ....YET. But they are coming and they are gonna keep spending more and more. And if we listen to people like you, we are eventually gonna have are asses handed to us asking...."but but but I thought the Chinese were paper tigers?"

    And Russia is gunning for us too. Their military budgets are expanding as well.

    So while you can dismiss the need to keep a top notch military, the notion hasn't been lost on the Russians and the Chinese. For those countries that claim they have no ill intent, they suuuuuure are ratcheting up their military capabilities.

    As for the population numbers of China? They will work it out. I don't see any chance of us coming close to them in anybody's lifetime. They will be a formidable country to deal with and will have the sheer numbers.


    To MacP...



    As long as you keep your leeches on that side of the pond, enjoy all the Socialism you want. Keep it the hell out of the USA!

    Also... I believe in a flat tax. You complain about tax loopholes? I say... get rid of all tax breaks for companies, the rich, the middle class and the poor. Nobody should get them.....PERIOD!
    With all due respect, I really do think you have absolutely no idea what is going on concerning the Russians and Chinese. I think you're buying way into whatever comes out of the mouth pieces of mainstream conservatism. They have a vested interest in fear mongering, because it ensures continued cash flow to the military and contractors.

    Also, the budget numbers in that graph were adjusted to reflect appropriate proportions afaik so that argument doesn't fly. The Chinese genuinely invest less than 1/6th the resources we do into their military.

    Further, their military is an untested quantity. What large wars have they waged in the past decades? What engagements? Where have they fielded and tested their military doctrine and tech? The answer is simple: They haven't.

    The last real significant engagement they were in was the Korean War. They're inexperienced.

    The Russians? They've passed a few crucibles in recent time as they've come to grips with major insurgency and the Chechen war(s). But they're still no threat to us.

    You're also missing the point with the population problem- numbers don't matter. Proportions do. They will have alot more old people and men than young people and women. Who is going to pay and take care of the elderly? Who is going to fill their spots in the economy?

    And the US is the single biggest economy on the planet. If the Chinese lose us as a customer they'd be shooting their own foot, especially considering they own a not inconsiderable portion of our national debt. They are invested in us.

    I have no major complaints with a flat, fair or sales tax. I think any of them are arguably superior to our current mess, cons and all, and would justify adopting.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Vulgotha View Post
    With all due respect, I really do think you have absolutely no idea what is going on concerning the Russians and Chinese. I think you're buying way into whatever comes out of the mouth pieces of mainstream conservatism. They have a vested interest in fear mongering, because it ensures continued cash flow to the military and contractors.

    Also, the budget numbers in that graph were adjusted to reflect appropriate proportions afaik so that argument doesn't fly. The Chinese genuinely invest less than 1/6th the resources we do into their military.

    Further, their military is an untested quantity. What large wars have they waged in the past decades? What engagements? Where have they fielded and tested their military doctrine and tech? The answer is simple: They haven't.

    The last real significant engagement they were in was the Korean War. They're inexperienced.

    The Russians? They've passed a few crucibles in recent time as they've come to grips with major insurgency and the Chechen war(s). But they're still no threat to us.

    You're also missing the point with the population problem- numbers don't matter. Proportions do. They will have alot more old people and men than young people and women. Who is going to pay and take care of the elderly? Who is going to fill their spots in the economy?

    And the US is the single biggest economy on the planet. If the Chinese lose us as a customer they'd be shooting their own foot, especially considering they own a not inconsiderable portion of our national debt. They are invested in us.

    I have no major complaints with a flat, fair or sales tax. I think any of them are arguably superior to our current mess, cons and all, and would justify adopting.
    Fear is a great tactic, it has worked over centuries. Great point, I can't like or rep so wanted to speak out.

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    Sub-Stance 1- hence why I stated that everybody is equal but not necessarily equal in talent or intellect. A person that grows up in the projects and turns out to be the next Einstein can most certainly be able to rise above their current conditions. A person who is rich and a $#@!ing idiot can most certainly drop from their pedestal. Not exactly what portion you think is bull$#@!, if its the first part that's classic constitutionalism and maybe you should read it. If you're talking about the second part then yes I'll admit that's 100% opinionated.

    Vulgotha- reading your statement I think its fair to assume that you think conservatists are all fear mongering beauracrats. But what exactly is a liberal nowadays?

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    Quote Originally Posted by KnotGamer901 View Post
    Sub-Stance 1- hence why I stated that everybody is equal but not necessarily equal in talent or intellect. A person that grows up in the projects and turns out to be the next Einstein can most certainly be able to rise above their current conditions. A person who is rich and a $#@!ing idiot can most certainly drop from their pedestal. Not exactly what portion you think is bull$#@!, if its the first part that's classic constitutionalism and maybe you should read it. If you're talking about the second part then yes I'll admit that's 100% opinionated.
    no i don't agree with that. opportunity and privilege do matter.

    and if you're generalizing that the reason why people can't rise out of the projects (poverty) is because they're just not intelligent enough then you're going against science.

    Vulgotha- reading your statement I think its fair to assume that you think conservatists are all fear mongering beauracrats. But what exactly is a liberal nowadays?

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    that's why libertarians are better.

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    Quote Originally Posted by KnotGamer901 View Post
    Sub-Stance 1- hence why I stated that everybody is equal but not necessarily equal in talent or intellect. A person that grows up in the projects and turns out to be the next Einstein can most certainly be able to rise above their current conditions. A person who is rich and a $#@!ing idiot can most certainly drop from their pedestal. Not exactly what portion you think is bull$#@!, if its the first part that's classic constitutionalism and maybe you should read it. If you're talking about the second part then yes I'll admit that's 100% opinionated.

    Vulgotha- reading your statement I think its fair to assume that you think conservatists are all fear mongering beauracrats. But what exactly is a liberal nowadays?

    Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk
    Over emotional idealists who have their heads in the clouds. Individuals who, paradoxically in spite of their open social positions, try to rule society with an iron fist. This is illustrated in California for example, which is replete with a variety of asinine rules.

    They're not so dissimilar from theocons. Those who seek to regulate society for the 'better' of all, whether you agree with them or not. They claim to have the moral high ground and will seek to impose their (religious) fervor on all those around them.

    Their stance on 2nd amendment rights is deplorable and for that reason alone, if nothing else, I detest them. We agree on many social issues like gay rights (but differ in implementation, because I despise government whereas they venerate it) but differ on others, like gun rights.

    I understand where they're coming from on the issue of environmental conservation, but I question their implementation and the practicality of it all.

    In summation, please do not mistake my ardent criticism from my erstwhile kin as a sign of tacit approval for the ideology of american liberalism. It isn't.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Sufi View Post
    no i don't agree with that. opportunity and privilege do matter.

    and if you're generalizing that the reason why people can't rise out of the projects (poverty) is because they're just not intelligent enough then you're going against science.



    that's why libertarians are better.
    No I am not saying just intellect. It can be anything. The main example I can give is sport i.e. basketball, football, etc. If a person is given a gift or talent for something and they choose to embrace and hone that talent, the possibilities are endless for them. Whether its making millions of dollars in the NBA or NFL, inventing a popular item, rewriting accepted scientific theories, or becoming an MD. There are plenty of people that are successful that aren't geniuses. I assume I should've clarified that. An example I can give to support this is a very simple one: a child grows up with an alcoholic father. The child grows up embracing the practice of temperance and therefore discrediting the absurdity of alcoholism being "genetic." The debate of whether privileges matter to how successful a person will become has been around for a long time. I believe it has no bearing on the privileges a person has; rather the determination and conviction that person has to either succumb to the world around them or break the cycle and change it.

    Vulgotha- my mistake. Thank you for clarifying.

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    Quote Originally Posted by KnotGamer901 View Post
    No I am not saying just intellect. It can be anything. The main example I can give is sport i.e. basketball, football, etc. If a person is given a gift or talent for something and they choose to embrace and hone that talent, the possibilities are endless for them. Whether its making millions of dollars in the NBA or NFL, inventing a popular item, rewriting accepted scientific theories, or becoming an MD. There are plenty of people that are successful that aren't geniuses. I assume I should've clarified that. An example I can give to support this is a very simple one: a child grows up with an alcoholic father. The child grows up embracing the practice of temperance and therefore discrediting the absurdity of alcoholism being "genetic." The debate of whether privileges matter to how successful a person will become has been around for a long time. I believe it has no bearing on the privileges a person has; rather the determination and conviction that person has to either succumb to the world around them or break the cycle and change it.

    Vulgotha- my mistake. Thank you for clarifying.

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    what you're saying is that you need enough determination and focus to become whatever you want to become. ok. let me drop you off to certain countries in africa or south america and see how far you get.

    the point i'm making here is that you're expecting one group that have the opportunities and the privileges and then unfairly comparing them to another group that don't. there will always be people that will have more determination and conviction than others but expecting an entire group of population to do that while ignoring the hurdles they have to go through, is not going to give you a good idea of how a group of population is.

    in fact, all scientific studies have concluded so far that it's the situation that makes these people who they are, not their race.
    Last edited by Omar; 01-15-2014 at 19:04.

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    Quote Originally Posted by KnotGamer901 View Post
    No I am not saying just intellect. It can be anything. The main example I can give is sport i.e. basketball, football, etc. If a person is given a gift or talent for something and they choose to embrace and hone that talent, the possibilities are endless for them. Whether its making millions of dollars in the NBA or NFL, inventing a popular item, rewriting accepted scientific theories, or becoming an MD. There are plenty of people that are successful that aren't geniuses. I assume I should've clarified that. An example I can give to support this is a very simple one: a child grows up with an alcoholic father. The child grows up embracing the practice of temperance and therefore discrediting the absurdity of alcoholism being "genetic." The debate of whether privileges matter to how successful a person will become has been around for a long time. I believe it has no bearing on the privileges a person has; rather the determination and conviction that person has to either succumb to the world around them or break the cycle and change it.

    Vulgotha- my mistake. Thank you for clarifying.

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    =p no worries mate


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    @Knot. so let me give a little example. Asians are the highest bracket in this nation. Now if i were to use the same logic you have, i would call Whites, Latinos and Blacks inferior to Asians. but the truth is that most of the people that make it here from the Asian countries are the best and the fittest so it would be unfair to claim what i've said. not saying you're claiming that Blacks are inferior to Whites or other races but you're definitely generalizing an entire group without understanding the full context.

    Just as Asians tend to score higher in schools, internationally. it has to do with their cultural values and circumstances than their race. e.g. i know for a fact that if you don't do really well growing up in Pakistan, you have no future. it forces the parents to be totalitarians and push their kids into getting better grades and get higher education. never mind Pakistan, I've just described the entire eastern part of the globe. and they have less opportunities to go to schools than we do here. so again, it's all dependent on the circumstance.

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    Yea Sufi I can see your points. However, concerning dropping me off in south Africa or a country as such, being successful in the world doesn't necessarily mean its legal.
    Honestly, I think Asians are superior to whites, especially Americans. I mean, I love my country and the ORIGINAL ideals it was founded upon, but the culture that Asians grow up in is so much more demanding and competitive that they beat out Americans in nearly everything. Grades, careers, and everything.
    You and I are friends bro, and we're both professionally educated. I can see and understand every single point you state, I just don't agree with them. I believe in my oponions, but I can understand yours.

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  19. #4965
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    living in two countries in my life, i can assure that while there are some things that i noticed to be superior in my culture, there are some things i see in this culture to be superior. that's pretty normal. Asians are pushed to their max and that's expected but they also sacrifice a lot of creativity and their cultures do not enforce creativity/invention (except the oriental asians i guess) but generally it's the western ideals that force you to think critically. so i don't think either parts of the world are superior. they're just different.

  20. #4966
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    Yea I see what you mean. Since you have more exposure than me, I probably should be taking notes from you bro lol

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    let me give you an example: the first day of my school, my english teacher (a very pretty one) asked me what i liked, e.g. color, food, music etc. and i couldn't answer her.

    now i know myself inside out and i continue to learn about myself, in fact, i continue to learn about others. that started since i came here. in some way, individuality isn't a good thing but there is a balance in there that everyone should achieve.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GreatSpaceKoaster View Post

    To MacP...



    As long as you keep your leeches on that side of the pond, enjoy all the Socialism you want. Keep it the hell out of the USA!

    Also... I believe in a flat tax. You complain about tax loopholes? I say... get rid of all tax breaks for companies, the rich, the middle class and the poor. Nobody should get them.....PERIOD!
    Actually you can make money out of Socialism your narrow mindness has got it all wrong. It is for people who are at work who are entitled to a fare wage I mean the 21st century and we're still paying people 6 an hour it is all about control and the government in the US has got you all under the thumb you are so patriotic about your national companies that they are robbing you blind.

    What I'm trying to say is the there is no such things as a recession because all the private companies have the money in socialism there is high tax so everybody has there fair share it is still capitalism but it is on fairer terms something you Americans never understand because you think because you vote conservative you'll get a free xbox and Bill Gates will come to your house for dinner.
    Sent from my computer using keyboard.

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    Europeans get it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MacP View Post
    Actually you can make money out of Socialism your narrow mindness has got it all wrong. It is for people who are at work who are entitled to a fare wage I mean the 21st century and we're still paying people 6 an hour it is all about control and the government in the US has got you all under the thumb you are so patriotic about your national companies that they are robbing you blind.

    What I'm trying to say is the there is no such things as a recession because all the private companies have the money in socialism there is high tax so everybody has there fair share it is still capitalism but it is on fairer terms something you Americans never understand because you think because you vote conservative you'll get a free xbox and Bill Gates will come to your house for dinner.
    Pretty sure it is the opposite.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MATRIX 2 View Post
    Pretty sure it is the opposite.
    No because there are more things to life than computers
    Sent from my computer using keyboard.

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    Vulgotha has come so far

    By Theft
    I am stunned that some people appear to love their Playstation(1,2,3) or Xbox(360) more than I love the Denver Broncos.
    Trust me, it's sad

  28. #4973
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    Quote Originally Posted by DayWalker View Post
    Vulgotha has come so far
    I knew you'd say something.

    Fiscally I'm as conservative as ever, and I despise government just like always. I'm just more consistent and coherent with my positions now than before

    Still, the transition was painful. There's still a bit of a 'void' between my father and I now, which used to be filled with us talking about political stuff.
    Last edited by Vulgotha; 01-17-2014 at 23:36.


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    sorry to hear that. (father stuff)

    By Theft
    I am stunned that some people appear to love their Playstation(1,2,3) or Xbox(360) more than I love the Denver Broncos.
    Trust me, it's sad

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    sorry to hear that. (father stuff)

    By Theft
    I am stunned that some people appear to love their Playstation(1,2,3) or Xbox(360) more than I love the Denver Broncos.
    Trust me, it's sad

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