General Politics Thread

[Sub-stance1]

Here is what the president actually said.



Nice try though. Meanwhile, Romney is continuing to show he isn't ready to be president by making a fool of himself in front of other nations.

[DayWalker]

Just remember, "if you have a business, you didn't build that, somebody else made that happen"...

Source: Barack Obama

oh come on wes... this is almost as bad as when you got all hot and bothered about Common visiting the White House!

99 days to go... POTUS still looking good:
http://fivethirtyeight.com/

More importantly only 99 days of terrible commercials left

[weskurtz81]

oh come on wes... this is almost as bad as when you got all hot and bothered about Common visiting the White House!

99 days to go... POTUS still looking good:
http://fivethirtyeight.com/

More importantly only 99 days of terrible commercials left

What? No way man! While there is truth to the statement that people were helped along the way, he's completely reversing the role of what government SHOULD be! Private industry BUILDS the roads and bridges... not the government. All the government does is provide the funding which they TAKE from private industry/consumers!

And, unless when he said "If you have a business, you didn't build that" he meant "If you have a business, you didn't build the roads and bridges"... the comment was completely insane! It's possible that's what he meant, but the statement was very vague. And, like I said before, private industry DID build the roads and bridges.

At any rate, yeah, we all work together towards a common goal, but it's the governments role to facilitate in an efficient manner, from his comments it sounds like he's saying without the government your puny little business wouldn't even exist... in essence saying the government is more vital than the business. That's just backwards.

[btbam]

What the president basically said that even with your business etc. whatever it is. That government played a role in that via road schools or whatever you want. Its such a fucking moot point. Oh yea, we had a hand in your success because your using our roads? who paid for those roads? Taxpayers. Plain and simple. Who paid for schools? Taxpayers. I do agree with Wes on 1 point. The statement was very vague. You can argue intent and meaning all you want, but what it sounds like, is your fucked without government, you cant succeed without government....that is false.

[DayWalker]

you hear what you want to hear.

[weskurtz81]

you hear what you want to hear.

That's a convenient response. Actually, if he doesn't mean something a certain way, he should say it that way. The first time I heard it, when he seems to pause between the roads and bridges part and then move on to the business part, it had nothing to do with me "wanting" to hear anything, it had everything to do with the way it came across.

[DayWalker]

That's a convenient response. Actually, if he doesn't mean something a certain way, he should say it that way. The first time I heard it, when he seems to pause between the roads and bridges part and then move on to the business part, it had nothing to do with me "wanting" to hear anything, it had everything to do with the way it came across.

I heard the same speech and knew exactly what he was saying. The spin has been entertaining though...

in other news...

"Hey Utah, I'm not saying you're boring, but the only reason you exist is to keep Nevada from giving Colorado herpes" -Jon Stewart LMAO!!!

[weskurtz81]

I heard the same speech and knew exactly what he was saying. The spin has been entertaining though...

in other news...

So, you are saying people interpret things different because they WANT to.... OK.

[DayWalker]

So, you are saying people interpret things different because they WANT to.... OK.

yes? this is hardly a groundbreaking theory... people interpret, or cherry pick information that reinforces their own views.

you and yours want to believe that Obama is "bad"... so when Faux spins something that reinforces your belief... you jump on it.

[weskurtz81]

yes? this is hardly a groundbreaking theory... people interpret, or cherry pick information that reinforces their own views.

you and yours want to believe that Obama is "bad"... so when Faux spins something that reinforces your belief... you jump on it.

Yeah, no kidding, confirmation bias DOES exist, but to simply say "well, you heard it that way because you want to" is nonsense. I could just as easily say you heard it the way you did because it reinforces your views that Obama is whatever you think he is.

Everyone interprets information differently, and confirmation bias is but only one small reason why that happens... there are a whole host of other reasons it could/does happen as well. So, don't "cherry pick" the one reason that supports your views on what I do/don't think about Obama.

Give me a break...

My response to your comment on people hearing what they want was meant to convey that you think it's THE reason, not a POSSIBLE reason.

[Bigdoggy]

people interpret things different if the thing being interpreted isn't clear. if something isn't clear that is usually when people hear something else or see something else in the comment or debate.

[Vulgotha]

people interpret things different if the thing being interpreted isn't clear. if something isn't clear that is usually when people hear something else or see something else in the comment or debate.

Disagree. Even removing any subjectivity from the definition of 'clarity' in a given situation, people would still find ways to fight over it, argue and skew it. Through willful ignorance and obstinacy.

That being said, I think the more objective interpretation of what the president meant is exactly what Wes and btbam maintain. He's basically saying "you owe no small part of your private success to us (government)."

It's similar to the whole "chicken or the egg" debate. Who helped who first? The government or private citizens\taxpayers? Except that ultimately you conclude that everything was footed and paid for by the private sector one way or another. Factually there is no other answer.

[btbam]

Free birth control went into effect this week...ladies

[Bigdoggy]

Disagree. Even removing any subjectivity from the definition of 'clarity' in a given situation, people would still find ways to fight over it, argue and skew it. Through willful ignorance and obstinacy.

That being said, I think the more objective interpretation of what the president meant is exactly what Wes and btbam maintain. He's basically saying "you owe no small part of your private success to us (government)."

It's similar to the whole "chicken or the egg" debate. Who helped who first? The government or private citizens\taxpayers? Except that ultimately you conclude that everything was footed and paid for by the private sector one way or another. Factually there is no other answer.

I concluded absolutely nothing so I have no idea where you got that from. as well I do agree with part of your disagreement but not all of it. the other part is people just not paying attention. So you have comments that aren't clear and you have people not paying attention. but Obamas response was perfectly clear and how people spun that around is beyond me.

people need to stop filling in the blanks on "well, he meant to say this__________." which is bullshit, he meant to say what he said. Either that or he should fire the person writing his little speeches.

I found his speech more along the lines of jealousy towards business owners or just simple uneducation on his research or whoever else did his research for him.

[btbam]

This Romeny tax thing is getting stupid. Romney needs to put up or shut up and release his returns. Not releasing them now looks like he is trying to hide something, if he is the American people deserve to know about it. Harry Reid should also shut up...man is a traitor. Won't even put bills up to vote in the senate that the house has passed and then says he has a "reliable source" that says romney didn't pay taxes. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. "Anonymous sources" are bullshit! He needs to divulge his source ASAP (if there is one) and Romney should release his tax returns 10 years at least.

[-Kwesnoth-]

Free birth control went into effect this week...ladies

Nothing is free.

[btbam]

it was just a joke....but yes i know someone is footing the bill somehow.

[DayWalker]

Nothing is free.

your mom was. BOOM!


seriously tho... is it actually "free"... or is just not as expensive as it would be without coverage.

ie- when Kwesnoth needs another regiment of penicillin... ehem... it cost much less with coverage than it does without...

[-Kwesnoth-]

your mom was. BOOM!

Oooo, dats cold man.

[DayWalker]

not to mention that I have to imagine that the cost of providing birth control is far out weighed by the cost of a pregnancy... especially an unwanted one... by a teenager/person who can't provide for it...

[-Kwesnoth-]

not to mention that I have to imagine that the cost of providing birth control is far out weighed by the cost of a pregnancy... especially an unwanted one... by a teenager/person who can't provide for it...

Doesn't matter. There should be no government provided birth control. Its forcing people that are against it to pay for it.

And if girls don't want to get pregnant at a young age, everyone knows the solution.

[DayWalker]

And if girls don't want to get pregnant at a young age, everyone knows the solution.

anal?

surely you don't mean abstinence... cuz thats a pipe dream

[weskurtz81]

your mom was. BOOM!


seriously tho... is it actually "free"... or is just not as expensive as it would be without coverage.

ie- when Kwesnoth needs another regiment of penicillin... ehem... it cost much less with coverage than it does without...

Is it actually free? Nope, not really. If insurance covers it @ 100% then the price of insurance will go up. If people are consuming more birth control, the price of birth control will probably go up as well.

So, we will be paying for it one way or another, but this way we will be forced to pay for it whether we like it or not.

Edit: In other news, the TSA just unionized! Big labor flexing it's muscles, private sector unions have been decreasing for the last few decades but public sector unions have been increasing, all that money they pay into the elections has been paying off!

On top of that, since Congress voted down the Cyber Security bill, Obama is considering just bypassing Congress and implementing it with an Executive order. Like I said before, who needs checks and balances when you have a supreme leader that can just do what HE THINKS is right!? All hail the King!

[-Kwesnoth-]

anal?

surely you don't mean abstinence... cuz thats a pipe dream

Abstinence. If a person can't do that. Then its their problem they got pregnant. Not the taxpayers.

[MATRIX 2]

Abstinence. If a person can't do that. Then its their problem they got pregnant. Not the taxpayers.

Guess we need Jonah Hill to shoot peoples dicks off.

NSFW