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  1. #1
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    What the **** happened to gaming?

    It's almost 2 a.m. so this is going to be merely a draft of what I want to say, that I will publish to the wor-r-r-r-l-l-l-d.

    So I've been playing the older Final Fantasy games (saw this one coming right?) which I'd never played before until the past couple of weeks.

    And...I'm just...I can't explain this feeling. It's like, I was supposed to have experienced this a really really long time ago? It's almost like I was missing out on my childhood...it reminds me of my childhood even though I have never played these games before. It gave me the same feeling I used to get when I'd play an epic game back when I was little, you know...when it was just you, the game and the world it drowned you into.

    So I'm thinking it felt nostalgic to me because maybe THIS IS what gaming was all about from the beginning, don't you think?. Gaming was about taking you out of reality and putting you into a fantasy world and what other than a game called Final Fantasy.

    This is truly beyond Final Fantasy 7...which was my favorite game of all time. FF7 was the first RPG game I ever played...and it totally hooked me into the world of gaming. After that, I couldn't get enough of video games.

    I would compare every RPG to Final Fantasy 7 and every single one of them would pale in comparison by far. I have tried Grandia 2, Xenogears (trying this one again), and a bunch of other RPGs that I can't think of right now, even my second favorite of all time DQ8 pales in comparison.

    But that was only because I was not open to the previous Final Fantasy games. Because I thought 2D graphics were lame. Well, for RPGs anyway.

    What I never realized was that dialogue matters too much in an RPG game and that's exactly what Final Fantasy 4 is all about. and might I add the way every character is unique in its own way, specific abilities and such.

    I was slowly yet surely drifting away from gaming and I didn't understand why. I'd try a game and it just wouldn't hold me over...basically ever since the end of PSX era. And after playing Final Fantasy 4, I realized that it wasn't because I was getting too old, it was because most games are just not about dialogue. Even after having the ability to have voice overs...the written parts are still so poor.

    There's just something about this game that I can't explain but it just blew my mind and I don't know if I can bring myself to play another RPG again. This game has completely ruined any hope for me to get back into gaming. It's spoiled me completely. I was in the middle of playing FF7 (and having a lot of fun too) when I gave FF4 a try and I don't know if I'll ever play FF7 again.

    So my question is...what happened?

    This game has made me realized that I couldn't give a flying $#@! about new technology and 16 billion GigaBytes of RAM and 50 trillion polygons and controlling games with your feet.

    It's about the thought that people put into games that just will never happen again. and for that reason, after searching for the newest and the latest and the greatest...I might sit back and understand that the games I've always wanted to play, games that completely engross you and give you a sense of inspiration, have already come out and there's not much to look forward to, except a few good games here and there that will come and go, and I will still hold onto these games and think about them for a very long time.

    So, I'm going to enjoy FF4, $#@! every other FF game (except 5 and 6 which I will finish after this) and all other games for that matter. If a game that originally came out on Super Nintendo can do this to me...then what's the point of all this new technology when we're missing the talent?

    I'm waiting for the day when Square will remake 4 and 5 with CG graphics (for next-gen consoles) and the top voice actors from Japan, with original Japanese script and subtitles.

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    Ive had many late night conversations about where gaming is now. It's basically run buy money an the companies searching for it. They will do an say anything for a quick buck, even making crap sequels an rehashes. I could go on an on about this lol. I may have to grab an old FF off of the app store now

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    Which version of FF4 are you playing?

    As you can see from my avatar, FF4 is my favorite game of all time among a couple others. I've played through the game probably at least 20 times in my life. My favorite version is the DS version, although it is very difficult in some spots. It was the first FF and turn-based RPG for me when it came out on SNES as FF2 in America.

    Today, you have G4 telling you that you have to be constantly playing COD or Halo on Xbox Live and getting the latest map packs to even consider yourself as a hardcore gamer.

    BTW, Rydia is awesome!

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    tl;dr

    Nostalgia is such a powerful tool.
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    I feel nostalgic at times. It makes me hate new-age gaming. But then I play GT5 and all is well again.
    http://www.psu.com/forums/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=215813&dateline=13047  62730


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    The magic has gone from game making in much the same way it has from the film industry. The more mainstream gaming becomes (and is now a bigger industry than the film sector), the less heart and soul it has as more money is invested and risks and expectations are higher. Games are becoming as formulated as films imho. They are still fun and block buster games but experiences like FFVIII just aren't common place these days.

    This is why I am personally in no rush for next gen. I would rather enjoy a phase where all the major devs have their engines sorted out and can worry more about content then trying to appease the graphic whoring masses. Ken Levine is the only one making a game with that old kind of magic imo, along with the chaps slaving away on The Last Guardian. Square, Capcom and others have lost the plot, and publishers like EA and Activision have been dumbing peoples standards down with repetitious cash cows which ask full price for little innovation and people have lapped it up. Online passes, DLC and lifeless formulated games, it's all just bi-product of mainstream acceptance of video gaming.

  8. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by FinalEvangelion View Post
    Which version of FF4 are you playing?

    As you can see from my avatar, FF4 is my favorite game of all time among a couple others. I've played through the game probably at least 20 times in my life. My favorite version is the DS version, although it is very difficult in some spots. It was the first FF and turn-based RPG for me when it came out on SNES as FF2 in America.

    Today, you have G4 telling you that you have to be constantly playing COD or Halo on Xbox Live and getting the latest map packs to even consider yourself as a hardcore gamer.

    BTW, Rydia is awesome!
    Hah. Just realized that your avatar is of Rydia's.

    I'm playing the original Japanese version that was later patched by the RPGe community. The game like it was meant to be played

    Quote Originally Posted by Mael Duin View Post
    tl;dr

    Nostalgia is such a powerful tool.
    Quote Originally Posted by HenryPSN View Post
    I feel nostalgic at times. It makes me hate new-age gaming. But then I play GT5 and all is well again.
    But it's not just nostalgia...the game is so damn good!
    Quote Originally Posted by ghost_rhayne View Post
    The magic has gone from game making in much the same way it has from the film industry. The more mainstream gaming becomes (and is now a bigger industry than the film sector), the less heart and soul it has as more money is invested and risks and expectations are higher. Games are becoming as formulated as films imho. They are still fun and block buster games but experiences like FFVIII just aren't common place these days.

    This is why I am personally in no rush for next gen. I would rather enjoy a phase where all the major devs have their engines sorted out and can worry more about content then trying to appease the graphic whoring masses. Ken Levine is the only one making a game with that old kind of magic imo, along with the chaps slaving away on The Last Guardian. Square, Capcom and others have lost the plot, and publishers like EA and Activision have been dumbing peoples standards down with repetitious cash cows which ask full price for little innovation and people have lapped it up. Online passes, DLC and lifeless formulated games, it's all just bi-product of mainstream acceptance of video gaming.
    I completely agree with you here. I truly believe there are a few games that still have that magic and two of those you've already mentioned (TLG and Infinite) but sadly that's about it this generation, isn't it?

    Utterly sad.

    I might go the handheld way next generation until those consoles are cheap enough and there are enough good games to warrant a purchase.

    Not a single decent JRPG this generation, how pathetic. (just imo though, i know some people have enjoyed Valkryie Chronicles)

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    Most games this gen go for the blockbuster feel (And worst of all, blockbuster length) which gives people excitement and a feeling of satisfaction for a few weeks afterwards. Old games DID have more magic in them especially RPG's. Many games could have been associated with books back in the day as opposed to movies as they can be now and that's where I believe the big change is
    if I am in the PS3 or 360 section I will NOT post about the competitor just to please people, if you want to know what I think about the competitor link me to a thread in the appropriate section

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    I was about to question the same thing that the OP brings up, then I popped in Gears 3. All my questions were answered.




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    Sounds more "what happened to Final Fantasy" rant than gaming in general.

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    When I started gaming it was on a B&W tv with one white line representing a bat and a white square representing a ball and a long white line representing a wall - and they called it 'Squash'. I swear I had as much fun playing that back then as I do with top titles nowadays. Of course games of that sort now wouldn't hold my attention but that's because of advancements in technology leading to different kinds of games.

    Anyone remember playing the original Monkey Island games. No speech, lots of music, tons of text to read through and the excruciating requirement to screen thrash with your mouse to find some pixelated object you need to pick up - but we loved it!

    ​aka Sparc

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  13. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by F34R View Post
    I was about to question the same thing that the OP brings up, then I popped in Gears 3. All my questions were answered.
    lol
    Quote Originally Posted by keefy View Post
    Sounds more "what happened to Final Fantasy" rant than gaming in general.
    Good point but I believe this situation can be applied to almost any genre (other than FPS which I truly believe is getting better for obvious reasons - need physics and graphics for immersion level).

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    Quote Originally Posted by ghost_rhayne View Post
    The magic has gone from game making in much the same way it has from the film industry. The more mainstream gaming becomes (and is now a bigger industry than the film sector), the less heart and soul it has as more money is invested and risks and expectations are higher. Games are becoming as formulated as films imho. They are still fun and block buster games but experiences like FFVIII just aren't common place these days.

    This is why I am personally in no rush for next gen. I would rather enjoy a phase where all the major devs have their engines sorted out and can worry more about content then trying to appease the graphic whoring masses. Ken Levine is the only one making a game with that old kind of magic imo, along with the chaps slaving away on The Last Guardian. Square, Capcom and others have lost the plot, and publishers like EA and Activision have been dumbing peoples standards down with repetitious cash cows which ask full price for little innovation and people have lapped it up. Online passes, DLC and lifeless formulated games, it's all just bi-product of mainstream acceptance of video gaming.
    Great post !

    Mainstreaming has happened to gaming. Some aspects are good, most are bad from a creative point of view. I realised something really odd has hapened 3 weeks ago when I've spent 70Eur for all Fallout 3 and New Vegas DLCs, that didn't work. I have the last number on the BLES code different. It's my fault for not knowing / reading till the last line of the description but imo this shouldn't happen. Ps+ mind you. A big scam, I won't renew.
    Then the GOTY edition is just unplayable on the dlc's with constant freezings. The devs don't care. Well I say $#@! this $#@!.

    Games like Demon's Souls and Limbo put lots of devs to the shame corner.

    Bad news is there's no turning back.

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    Sure there are games that make you want to question why they even cost money due to all the problems with them, but then there are those that come along that reaffirm that some developers still have a passion for creating works of art and letting us play them; after we pay them of course.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Enthroll View Post
    Great post !

    Mainstreaming has happened to gaming. Some aspects are good, most are bad from a creative point of view. I realised something really odd has hapened 3 weeks ago when I've spent 70Eur for all Fallout 3 and New Vegas DLCs, that didn't work. I have the last number on the BLES code different. It's my fault for not knowing / reading till the last line of the description but imo this shouldn't happen. Ps+ mind you. A big scam, I won't renew.
    Then the GOTY edition is just unplayable on the dlc's with constant freezings. The devs don't care. Well I say $#@! this $#@!.

    Games like Demon's Souls and Limbo put lots of devs to the shame corner.

    Bad news is there's no turning back.
    All good points.

    Quote Originally Posted by F34R View Post
    Sure there are games that make you want to question why they even cost money due to all the problems with them, but then there are those that come along that reaffirm that some developers still have a passion for creating works of art and letting us play them; after we pay them of course.
    Well if you must know, I own the FF Anthology and Chronicles. I found out recently that there was a translation version (deemed the best one and I concur) that was only available through an SNES rom so I figured, why not.

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    Its all about shooters now, I'm very close to quitting gaming at this point but the PS Vita looks to have more original stuff going on.

    Please help our Final Fantasy Community get off the ground:
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    Quote Originally Posted by AaronSOLDIER View Post
    Its all about shooters now, I'm very close to quitting gaming at this point but the PS Vita looks to have more original stuff going on.
    I wouldn't mind shooters along the lines of Deus Ex (diversity of gameplay offered) and Resistance 3 ($#@!ing the norm, weapon wheel, health pickups) and Bioshock Infinite (just epic). Deus Ex in particular showed us that a FPS type game can be so much more than a cheesy war shooter. It's all this bull$#@! like Crysis, Blink, CoD, Bulletstorm etc that I tire of. I am hoping that XCOM and Syndicate have at least the spirit of Deus Ex, daring to step outside the box a little. But in general I agree that the FPS craze is like a cancer to the industry. It's a cheap cop out to make a game you know will work well without having to make any experimental gameplay mechanics.

    Actually Dust 514 deserves an honorable mention. It is an FPS of course but it's context is just $#@!ing epic. When the FPS approach is a means to an awesome ends (like being mercenaries for a PC based game) then I also think its cool.
    Last edited by Ghost; 09-21-2011 at 12:40.

  19. #18
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    This thread reminds me of this:
    http://www.cracked.com/blog/5-ways-t...d-video-games/

    Especially #3.

    When's the last time you actually cared about what happened in a video game? Between the stiffly-acted cutscenes and bull$#@! recycled plots, you can't help but wonder what happened after the golden age of Role Playing Games in the 1990s and early 2000s.
    I got absolutely hooked on a series of Nintendo games called Dragon Warrior in the 1980s. Jump ahead to 1994, and regardless of the day you arrive, you'll find me camped out in front of a Final Fantasy III (or FF VI, for you purists) marathon that lasted five years. When we got a hand-me-down Playstation, the first thing I bought was Final Fantasy 7. In 2000, it was The Legend of Dragoon, or the more aptly named "Final Fantasy with an Extra Button."

    And what modern game can possibly match that amazing 20 minute-long ending cinematic for FFIII that wrapped up the storylines for each of the characters we'd come to know and love in the course of beating the game? And then again while beating it eight more times?
    Now, all of those deep, engrossing games are gone, replaced by "point and shoot" games for the kiddies who could care less about story and just want action, action, action, hitting the "skip" button half a second into each cut scene. If they're playing Mass Effect, maybe they keep watching to see the $#@!ing.

    "It's like you dicked down the whole town... even though you got dick to go 'round."
    But the Truth Is...
    Let's go back and watch one of those cut scenes from Final Fantasy III/VI:



    Huh. That seemed... way more powerful when I saw it as a teenager.
    And even weirder, I watch my kids play games now that barely have a story at all, yet they're transfixed. It's almost like they're seeing something I'm not. For instance, I let my kids mess around in a Grand Theft Auto game (supervised) and the first thing my son does is steal an ambulance. My youngest daughter then pretended to be injured and dialed him on her pretend cellphone. He drove the ambulance around town until she told him, "I'm there on that next block." He'd then pull over and pretend to pick her up... and drive her to the actual in-game hospital. The whole trip, he'd bark out things he'd heard on medical dramas and pretend to save her.

    "Be advised: incoming six year old female, acute myocardial infarction, BP steadily dropping..."
    Wait a second. Is it possible that those old games didn't do anything magical with their programming to create "immersion," and that, like my kids with GTA, I "immersed" myself in those games because I was playing them at a time before I was dead inside?
    I can play a zombie game now, and I just see a bunch of boring, repetitive enemies. My kids can't even be in the same room with me -- they find those games terrifying because they're imagining themselves in the game, fighting the zombies.

    "If I hear you scream 'mother$#@!' one more time, you're grounded."
    The older you get, the less elastic your imagination becomes, and the less able you are to fill in whatever gaps the game leaves in the narrative. It's why a toddler can open a birthday present and then immediately disregard the toy in favor of spending the next three hours playing with the box. If you see an adult doing that, suddenly it's time for an intervention.
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  20. #19
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    gaming is run nowadays to mostly cater to the $#@!in idiot teenagers who crave the same MP game over and over like a fad over skinny jeans or some lame $#@! like that. and the almighty buck speaks volumes when nobody can spot quality


    Let's be honest: You sleep with anything that walks on two legs. Sometimes, you're not even that discriminating

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    I agree with a lot of posts in this thread.

    Don't forget now video games are appealing to casual people. It's sad that you pay $60 for a game that's only 12 hours long and not even hard.

    There are some games and developers who still have that magic. Square Enix has it to some degree and so does Naughty Dog.

    It is indeed all about the benjamins.

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    Two ways I can respond to this.

    The more complex of the two is explaining how nostalgia isn't a good measure of greatness because your youth and imagination indirectly hypes everything up to a level of greatness that no man can achieve. A great example of this is sandboxes. Would you be able to play in a sandbox today with the same level of imagination and greatness that you could as a child? I couldn't. I'd have fun building $#@! out of sand but I wouldn't be able to pretend that the sand castle I made was a cape fortress preparing for an onslaught of the massive waves coming at it were hoards of enemy forces looking to eat away and destroy my creation. I wanted to protect it, I gave it a leader and gave it citizens. The castle had tiers and court yards. My parents probably saw me and thought "wow he's been playing with that lump of sand for over an hour now".

    So what happened? You're growing up, and you're slowly losing your childlike imagination. It's a powerful tool that, sadly, is near impossible to gain back in it's full capacity. There's a few reasons for this but going into why would be slightly off topic. The point I'm getting at here is your brain no longer fills the gaps that the creators have left. When I was 5 or 6 the game was the catalyst, not the tool. My imagination was the tool.You don't see the world in it it's entirety anymore. You see what you're shown. You no longer imagine a vast field outside the town, or the alleys and pathways not shown to you. You see what's on screen and want more, because you always remember there being more. As we get older we see more things for face value; therefore, you will see flaws in both the narrative and the design.

    I can promise you that kids who played mario galaxy as their first mario, twilight princess as their first zelda, or FFXIII as their first final fantasy will be asking the same question when they're entering their late teens/early twenties. My only hope is that someone, 10 or 15 years from now, will be able to explain this with more accuracy than I. Maybe then us gamers will become more ready to accept the fact that we're not kids any more.

    The other way I can explain it is the cynical approach of denial. The industry matured and is about profits first. While I believe this has some to do with the poorly percieved quality of RPG games, I do not believe that to be the root issue by any means. I feel like this excuse/explanation is mostly denial against growing up.

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    Of course there are alot of casual games these days but there are also alot of "diamonds in the rough".
    Look at all the great and / or unique game(series) we got this gen - Bioshock, DeusEX HR, Demon's Souls, MGS 4, Uncharted, GOW, Valkyria Chronicles, Castlevania, Bayonetta, Assassins Creed, Infamous, Resistance, Killzone, Mass Effect, Dead Space and heaps of games i forgot...

    I also have alot more games for PS3 then for PS2 already, and the collection is growing faster and faster.
    So long story short, gaming still rocks... imo more then ever.

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    Tyrien got it. Would rep if I could.
    Remember how your grandfather or any old man/woman speaks how something was so much better when they were young, while you might disagree with it? This thread sounds exactly like that.
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  26. #24
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    To try and give one, two or even three separate reasons as to why gaming seems to have gone 'downhill' would be terribly reductionist as it is a very complex issue. I would say, as many others have in this thread, that it is to do with the fact that gaming has become a much, much more popular hobby. With this, of course, comes corporate greed and a chance for people to make a lot more money. Previously, games were created for a niche market in which the proportion of discerning customers to tasteless morons was (probably) much higher. Now people are willing to buy the same crap year after year, the same game just with a different title or set in a world filled with zombies rather than aliens, and do not seem to care. All this does is provide the gaming industry with a great reason to continue churning out the same $#@! over and over again.

    Having said that, there are always some games that come out every generation that make you remember why you loved gaming so much in the first place. I just completed Demon's Souls and I thought it was a thoroughly excellent game that well deserved the praise it got. I tend to avoid games which seem like they might disappoint. Although, I have never understood the hype surrounding Assassin's Creed games (and yes, I have played them all). Admittedly, it is cool to play an assassin and some of the gameplay elements are truly excellent. The story, however, is $#@!ing retarded imo. This is just one example.

    Tyrien raised an interesting point but I am not sure whether it has much to do with your 'revelation'. Especially since this is the first time you've played FF4 and thus I'm not entirely sure how the argument that your imagination is waning yet still seems perfectly serviceable when it comes to a classic 2D title quite makes sense.
    Last edited by Wolf616; 09-21-2011 at 14:26.

  27. #25
    I've always had this conversation with my friend, we've questioned ourselves whether we are too old now, but the thing is, when I go back to playing older games, I still have a lot of fun compared to this generations game. I feel like this gen is full of non innovative games. Game companies are barely being anything crazy to the table and then milking it whether or not the sales are good. Theres no challenge to the games also, an example me and my friend brought up was RE with the puzzle solving and the fixed camera angle not knowing where exactly the zombies were, compared to the newer RE where it was brainless run and gun. I didnt need co op in my games, I had my friend with me sharing the experience and solving the puzzles.
    Last edited by rycexboi; 09-21-2011 at 14:51.

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