I actually remember one of my first jobs, I was helping (when asked!) a female manager put some clothes on high shelving - I was asked to hold the ladder.
With me standing with my foot on the bottom of the ladder to stop it from sliding she turns round and says 'Are you having a good look?' My response was a dry 'Don't flatter yourself' (because I wasn't!) to which she seemed to get quite angry. Odd.
Now, I'm not suggesting she wanted me to but to accuse me of somehow eyeing her up when she wasn't even facing me at the time to know was just not on.
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02-09-2012 #27Thanks to Kwesnoth for the sig!
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Men encourage it by giving attention and praise to the women who do it. I'm done with this discussion.
in your other post it was the woman accusing you of wearing loose pants and big shirts trying to encourage you to dress more revealing or tight to see more figure, not the man. The woman is the one putting on revealing clothes or whatever else, it's the woman encouraging the man to look at her. In this case it's the womans fault. Calling a man a pig because he looked at a woman that is encouraging the looks from men is the actual problem. The exact attitude you brought here is exactly what I am talking about.
The Black Wolf, I am not trying to ruffle the feathers from you, but it was that type of attitude you showed in the post above from what I am talking about.
Last edited by Bigdoggy; 02-09-2012 at 23:37.
Okay, you say women encourage it because 1) other women encourage me to dress different and 2) women encourage men to look at them, right?
Okay, so let's say you are right, not saying you are wrong or right, but I have not heard that a woman is the one who started all of this with designing clothes.
You do know that women would not have continued to wear revealing clothing had they not gotten good feedback, right? That's what I'm saying. You're saying women encourage men to look at them, but if men DID NOT look at them, they wouldn't do it.
It's like this, if someone is being a butthole in public, do you think they would continue if they got no attention?
I see it as sexual immorality, a sin that needs to be resisted. But, I am a christian. You talk to another girl and she will probably think differently.
I just know that back in high school the girls that dressed normally were called "$#@!s", "D word suckers" and etc. But the popular high school girls who started those rumors went commando and wore daisy dukes to school. The boys loved them. If you were a girl and you wanted a boy friend in high school and the popular girls portrayed the image, revealing clothing + going commando + other immoral behaviors = a boyfriend, wouldn't you look into it?
And Bigdoggy, my feathers are fine. A good discussion is a good discussion as long as there's no flaming or insults.
I say, show it so I can see it!
If a woman feels like men oggling over their body is offensive then they shouldn't dress like that, but that is their own opinion and responsibility. Other women, the whole world over are never go to think like this alike.
You said that it is in a man's DNA to look at a nice body, right? So what you are saying is it is natural for a man to oggle a woman when she is on display, is that right? But does that make it right? When a person is hungry and there's a whole lot of food on the table, it's natural to dig in, but is it right to overeat and end up throwing up?
I will give two views of this, one based on my spiritual or biblical view and the other just my normal view.
How I see it spiritually is that it is carnal or earthly for a man to oggle a woman on display. It's wrong and what you call DNA is really earthly like. It's just like it's natural to feel anger and hate toward another person, but it is of God to love your enemy. Man has to fight the temptation of sin.
My regular view is it is in man to do this, but isn't it natural for a man to feel like sleeping with a lot of women? Men have a drive to sleep with as many women as possible and they even have the sperm to do so. However, is it moral to sleep with every woman just because it's in your DNA or drive? I feel the same about this. Men have the drive to stare at a woman on display, but is that moral?
they're all attention $#@!s to some degree. FACT
Let's be honest: You sleep with anything that walks on two legs. Sometimes, you're not even that discriminating
Most typical young, and even some older, who like the attention when they flaunt their bodies will appreciate any man looking, but surely would only want to be come on to by a more attractive man... in most cases. If a woman is in this "most case" bracket then I feel they need to re-examine themselves. On occasion, but rarely in my experience, you'll find a very attractive girl with a man of a potential lower attractiveness, but they are with them because they have something about them, so that woman has her head screwed on right and doesn't just care about what's on the surface with their man. Whether or not the same can be said for the man is another matter, but I'd imagine that if the man is of a lower attractiveness than the woman then he would think he is a "Jack the lad" for having an attractive partner.
I hope I have addressed your concern here and not gone on another tangent. And as I just wrote the above paragraph in this post I feel that it may come across that I'm putting blame on women here. I do not intend to.
Some women love the attention that they get from attractive and not so attractive guys, but I do agree that there are some men, or most even, that want to do their best to sleep around all over the place; in this case I feel the man needs to re-examine themselves here. I don't live like that. I've not had a girlfriend, so I can freely imagine a scenario where I might be with a girl I see about, but it ends there. I don't believe in sleeping around willy-nilly. And even though the fact that I haven't had a girlfriend sucks arse, I somewhat feel that it's been a blessing in disguise to a certain degree, because I believe that when I get with someone I like I will be loyal to them, and would expect them to be the same. It's the way my life has now been molded, and I'd rather be like that than a man-$#@! who shags anything that moves.
Science has proven that it clinically helps a mans health by staring at breasts, Science!
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You can talk all about revealing clothing and men wanting women and such. However, it has not been brought into this discussion that women have only started to wear "revealing" clothing, well in western cultural, in the past 100 years. I think the "flappers" were the first ones with dresses above their ankles. It wasn't until the until much later that women were wearing the mini skirts. And now, there are shorter more revealing clothing that is being worn by lots of women.
So, we have this whole history of women wearing big huge dresses and corsets, and then the women's right's movement hits, and in less than one hundred years we have mini-skirts. Now, do i feel like a woman should dress how they want? Yes, because i get to dress how i want to. If i really wanted to walk around in a speedo all day, then by golly i should get to walk around in a flippin' speedo. Now, if i decide to pull over in a big city, get out and start stretching. Then, someone, for whatever reason, pulls out a camera and starts filming, why am i going to get mad? I am in a huge city!! I should expect people to watch, and gawk, and record it. Now, i am not saying that what that girl did was the same equivalent, but still... Woah, off my point... Anyways...
Women have wanted male attention, and men have given it to them for thousands of years, and it has only been in the last hundred that women have gotten it from revealing clothing. Not in that fact alone, I do understand, but it seems that this is the way that western cultural is going. What i don't understand is, why does this coincide with the women's rights? It seems like the more free a woman is, the less they should feel pressured into wearing something that think is degrading. When in fact, it should be the opposite. Like i said earlier though, they should be able to wear what they want. It doesn't matter what other women think, or what men think, if that is what they want to wear, then so be it, but like the OP said, don't get mad at a man for gawking at what you are flaunting. If you have the right to show it off in public, we sure have the right to look.
Wait wait wait. So a woman wearing revealing clothing is still a man's fault?
Is this attitude for real? It strikes me as all the rights, no responsibilities.
Women are free independent beings. Their choices are their own, if a woman craves attention and goes out of her way to get it, the issue is with her.
This attitude of making your own decisions then blaming someone else for them is ludicrous.
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Last edited by *goo; 02-10-2012 at 08:00.
A voyeur is in the bushes watching an exhibitionist showing themselves off. The police arrive! Who gets arrested?
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It think its funny that women are always displayed as the poor prey - constantly hunted by the horny brainless man.
I asked my GF once why women like men, because as a guy i just couldn't tell why anybody would want something else then a woman.
The answer was simple, "because we love $#@!s".
It's that simple, men like women - and WOMEN LIKE MEN - end of the story.
As for biblical that falls under prostitution. Also it does say that women shall not flaunt there bodies for all to see because it creates problems and that is indeed not the mans fault. like I said before, women are not in some secret society so a lot of women need to just throw that mindset in a hole and bury it, it's useless and has been for a long long time. Women also stare at men and it's not just men that stare at women either. The fact that there are strip clubs for women to look at men and those places are jam packed with women waving money at the guys. there is no difference in that type of behavior at all, none, zero. What women do is pad that and say "well, there is a difference between us staring at guys and guys staring at us" that's bull$#@! and everyone including the person saying that knows it as well.
Technically it's not your place to tell men when to not stare at a women or when to stare at a women and it's definitely not any other woman's business to try to tell guys what other women are thinking even though they don't know those women at all. This is no different then saying "women can do what they want, but if man gets involved it's not the woman's fault", that's bs. Since the time women got equal rights and even more so now in in the 80's, 90's and 2000's, all those excuses on why men are pigs are not going to work because there are no saints between male and female.
what a lot of women are doing is treating all women as if they are in this sacred group of women, that happened 30 years ago, it really isn't flying for people of today, only women but even some women now are against that behavior. Not only that, but it was the woman flaunting her body and having sex to get that job promotion or to get that job. That same woman CANNOT turn around and say men are pigs because she is equally an oinker.
You are also confusing a male sleeping with every woman Vs a male wanting sex and there is a difference. Yes, there are men that sleep with a lot of women, but at the same time there are a lot of women sleeping with multiple guys. Also, within that, not every single man in the world wants to have sex with as many women as he wants, a lot of men out there want to be with the person they love and "Vica Versa". Because in this type of case of male or female sleeping with others, this is the type of case where no side is better then the other. However, like I said before a woman flaunting her body for men to look at is NOT and I repeat NOT a mans fault in any way, that is on the woman and if you read the bible it also states that if you are going to speak in biblical terms.
Last edited by Bigdoggy; 02-10-2012 at 16:28.
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Prime example there, Ixion.
I take a picture whilst wearing a bikini - in a toilet, I upload it into a section of the internet that's fairly public. I get commented on. I don't like it. You're all perverts. Me, I'm offended.
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