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View Poll Results: Do you believe I them?

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  • Yes I do

    10 31.25%
  • No way there's no such thing as ghost

    13 40.63%
  • Maybe...

    9 28.13%
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  1. #76
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    I won't lie, I do believe in ghosts due to personal experiences. However, I won't go into details, because talking about it still disturbs me this day. However, if you don't believe them or not, then I won't stop you. I know what I saw and I could care less what others think.

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  4. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by itachi73378 View Post
    Another reason why I'm glad I'm religious. Some people have such sad impressions of life and death.
    Is it sad, or realistic?

    I'm not sad in the slightest that I don't bring fiction into real life as a coping mechanism.

    Just noticed you quoted me further down. Just because the brain dies and can't be restored to full function does not mean that there's a soul or spirit.

    The answer is 'I don't know'. It's not 'I don't know so that means there's a spirit/soul'.

    It's interesting that you talk about unexplained things not being proven in another post. You're seeking evidence. Yet when we talk about spirit/soul you seem to need none to conclude there is one.

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    Last edited by *goo; 06-17-2012 at 07:12.

  5. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by *goo View Post
    Is it sad, or realistic?

    I'm not sad in the slightest that I don't bring fiction into real life as a coping mechanism.

    Just noticed you quoted me further down. Just because the brain dies and can't be restored to full function does not mean that there's a soul or spirit.

    The answer is 'I don't know'. It's not 'I don't know so that means there's a spirit/soul'.

    It's interesting that you talk about unexplained things not being proven in another post. You're seeking evidence. Yet when we talk about spirit/soul you seem to need none to conclude there is one.

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    I never said that if I think a soul exists then it should.
    I don't need evidence because I'm thoroughly convinced that this life and universe is far beyond human understanding and that death will provide me with those answers.

    I ask those questions to see what others think. And in your case its "I don't know". I don't claim that my personal beliefs are more correct than others. I just ask out of genuine curiosity. I often find myself pondering over such questions because so far no ones knows the answers to those.

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    So my question would be, what convinced you?

    You've said yourself that no-one knows so what makes you so sure? Or is it a 'take it on faith' scenario?


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    Quote Originally Posted by itachi73378 View Post
    Another reason why I'm glad I'm religious. Some people have such sad impressions of life and death.
    My impression of life is that there is no afterlife, knowing that I'm a good person in my only time alive and not for the sake of seeing some promised land when I die, to me, is not sad at all. I don't need anyone or anything to tell me how live my life or guide my morals.

    EDIT- In response to OP, no I don't believe in ghosts, spirits, demons, angels or the soul or most 'supernatural' things mentioned in this thread so far.

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    Quote Originally Posted by itachi73378 View Post
    Another reason why I'm glad I'm religious. Some people have such sad impressions of life and death.
    The only thing sad here is how narrow minded your view on it is. You act as if religion is your only comfort in life, and if you truly feel that way, then I feel for you.
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  9. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by smiggy View Post
    My impression of life is that there is no afterlife, knowing that I'm a good person in my only time alive and not for the sake of seeing some promised land when I die, to me, is not sad at all. I don't need anyone or anything to tell me how live my life or guide my morals.
    Let me ask a question here,Let's say that someone ( not necessary you ) don't believe in God or afterlife.He absolutely have no guide which tells him how to live his life or what's good or what's bad.Let's say this guy lives a very ordinary life,wife-kids,a lot of bills to pay,get sick like normal people.let's just say he is not the happiest person on earth.My question here is: What is the purpose of that life ?! when someone like that who is not very happy and suffers ordinary life problems why not just end his life and get it over with ?! what's keeping him going everyday knowing that tomorrow will be same as yesterday ?! knowing that there is absolutely no consequence what so ever for taking his own life ?!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Abdou23 View Post
    Let me ask a question here,Let's say that someone ( not necessary you ) don't believe in God or afterlife.He absolutely have no guide which tells him how to live his life or what's good or what's bad.Let's say this guy lives a very ordinary life,wife-kids,a lot of bills to pay,get sick like normal people.let's just say he is not the happiest person on earth.My question here is: What is the purpose of that life ?! when someone like that who is not very happy and suffers ordinary life problems why not just end his life and get it over with ?! what's keeping him going everyday knowing that tomorrow will be same as yesterday ?! knowing that there is absolutely no consequence what so ever for taking his own life ?!
    No consequence? You just said he has a wife and kids...

    As for the real question in there, what is the point? Why should there have to be a point? Why can I not just enjoy the time I have on this earth. If you're unhappy, believe it or not, you are not confined to being that way for the rest of your life.

  11. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by Abdou23 View Post
    Let me ask a question here,Let's say that someone ( not necessary you ) don't believe in God or afterlife.He absolutely have no guide which tells him how to live his life or what's good or what's bad.Let's say this guy lives a very ordinary life,wife-kids,a lot of bills to pay,get sick like normal people.let's just say he is not the happiest person on earth.My question here is: What is the purpose of that life ?! when someone like that who is not very happy and suffers ordinary life problems why not just end his life and get it over with ?! what's keeping him going everyday knowing that tomorrow will be same as yesterday ?! knowing that there is absolutely no consequence what so ever for taking his own life ?!
    Purpose of life? It's what you make it.

    For me, what drives me is the people in my life. Family and friends. To me, spending time with those I love drives me through the dull boring grind of daily life (work, school, etc). I don't necessarily need a religion or belief system to make me enjoy life on this earth. Not saying it's a bad thing to believe either.

    Yeah, even if I don't believe in an afterlife doesn't mean I can't enjoy all those small moments in life with those I love such as family traditions, holidays, birthdays, get togethers, etc. When I'm nearing death I won't dwell on dying, I'll remember the good times. Life to me is about experiencing it with others. There are those I cherish dearly and they are what drive me to accomplish great things and to push myself beyond.

  12. #86
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  13. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by smiggy View Post
    No consequence? You just said he has a wife and kids...

    As for the real question in there, what is the point? Why should there have to be a point? Why can I not just enjoy the time I have on this earth. If you're unhappy, believe it or not, you are not confined to being that way for the rest of your life.
    When i said consequence i meant for that specific person after he dies ( judgement day or whatever you may call it ) not concequence for people who still alive.
    you are not confined to being that way for the rest of your life.
    This is what i'm exactly saying,if someone not happy with his life what stopping him from ending it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sir_Scud View Post
    Purpose of life? It's what you make it.

    For me, what drives me is the people in my life. Family and friends. To me, spending time with those I love drives me through the dull boring grind of daily life (work, school, etc). I don't necessarily need a religion or belief system to make me enjoy life on this earth. Not saying it's a bad thing to believe either.

    Yeah, even if I don't believe in an afterlife doesn't mean I can't enjoy all those small moments in life with those I love such as family traditions, holidays, birthdays, get togethers, etc. When I'm nearing death I won't dwell on dying, I'll remember the good times. Life to me is about experiencing it with others. There are those I cherish dearly and they are what drive me to accomplish great things and to push myself beyond.
    You telling me that the only purpose of your life is to enjoy occasions like holidays and get together ?! you live for those things only ?! what if for some reason they ceased to exist ?! I'm not saying religion makes you enjoy your life,but for religious people it gives their lives meaning,it explains why they even alive,what they should do and most importantly gives them hope.And i'm not talking about specific religion here.I'm saying people who believe in something give their lives meaning,people who don't believe in anything don't know why they even alive,and i just don't know why they keep going. Living a life just to enjoy some happy moments here and there among other unhappy moments is not a very convening reason really.But hey if you are happy that way.....

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    Quote Originally Posted by Abdou23 View Post
    This is what i'm exactly saying,if someone not happy with his life what stopping him from ending it.
    Why would he? There's endless possibilities in life, he can do just about anything he wants to make himself happy.

    Now let me ask you a question. If everything you do in life is to appease your God and reach your afterlife, why don't you just kill yourself and get there now?

  15. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by smiggy View Post
    Why would he? There's endless possibilities in life, he can do just about anything he wants to make himself happy.

    Now let me ask you a question. If everything you do in life is to appease your God and reach your afterlife, why don't you just kill yourself and get there now?
    1-In my religion people need to try and make as many good deeds as they could so they can go to heaven,if a person makes more sins than good he won't go to heaven.
    2- My religion forbids me from taking my own life ( or any human life )
    3-If you really took a look at some real life cases you will find people who are really unhappy with their lives and they can't do anything about it and a lot of people think about committing suicide than you think,but very few of them go through with it,other either kill other people or just continue living their sad lives.And from your prospective ( no afterlife or judgement ) the easier choice for unhappy person is to end his life.It's only logical.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Abdou23 View Post
    1-In my religion people need to try and make as many good deeds as they could so they can go to heaven,if a person makes more sins than good he won't go to heaven.
    2- My religion forbids me from taking my own life ( or any human life )
    3-If you really took a look at some real life cases you will find people who are really unhappy with their lives and they can't do anything about it and a lot of people think about committing suicide than you think,but very few of them go through with it,other either kill other people or just continue living their sad lives.And from your prospective ( no afterlife or judgement ) the easier choice for unhappy person is to end his life.It's only logical.
    What I'm reading here is your life is pointless. Everything you do is controlled and dictated to you, you have no freedom. What is the point of your life? Die and reach the afterlife.

    Your 3rd point isn't exclusive to those who don't believe in the afterlife, that applies to people of faith too.

  17. #91
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    Why is it only religion OR science? Why can't people believe in supernatural things AND share a scientific attitude in life?

    You guys are ridiculous.



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  19. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by smiggy View Post
    What I'm reading here is your life is pointless. Everything you do is controlled and dictated to you, you have no freedom. What is the point of your life? Die and reach the afterlife.

    Your 3rd point isn't exclusive to those who don't believe in the afterlife, that applies to people of faith too.
    Now you are arguing for the sake of it.How is trying to do more good deeds than sins is pointless ?! and are you telling me to die and reach the afterlife? you think my life is controlled because there are things that i can or can't do, but you didn't stop and think whether my religion is right in forbidding and demanding those things.Let me give you some examples here:
    Forbids:
    *killing
    *robbing
    *gambling:waste of money and sometimes leads to destroy relations.
    *lying
    *bribe
    *treason
    *Hypocrisy
    *False testimony
    *Injustice or injustice judge
    * adultery
    *Disobedience to parents
    *insulting others
    *smoking ( or anything that leads to the destruction of human body or sanity )

    Just to name a few.

    Demands - Encourages:
    *praying
    *giving money to the poor.
    *helping relatives or neighbours in need ( with money or anything you can help with )
    *obeying parents
    *all people are equals no matter race-colour or gender( no such thing as slavery )
    *Respecting other religions and beliefs and not forcing other people to join.
    *Visiting family members on regular basis ( priority to people in sickness )
    *helping orphans with money or any other way you can ( optional )

    Also to name a few.

    Now i don't want you to look at these as religion stuff.Just look at them as guidelines for your own life.Now tell me if everyone in your city - country followed these guidelines will society be better or worse? tell me that a person who follows such guidelines ( plus more ) have a controlled pointless life.
    Last edited by Abdou23; 06-17-2012 at 10:54.

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  20. #93
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    I believe in ghosts...i had an 'incident' with my wife a long time ago that defied explanation...my wife, and the other people at the train station had the same experience...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Abdou23 View Post
    That's why it's called ( Belief ) if there was some scientific evidence of God or the afterlife all people on earth would have the same religion,worship same God and all go to heaven.Then the concept of reward and punishment would be irrelevant.I'm not saying God doesn't want everyone on earth to believe in him,i'm saying it just won't be called Believing anymore.

    Actually from my experience it gives one a huge comfort to know his loved ones may go to heaven and they will reunite once again.In my religion certain death situations means guaranteed heaven for that person.It gives death more meaning.
    And you don't require sufficient evidence to believe in such things like religions, which have huge consequences for your life (and probably those around you). Yet I bet you still demand evidence for trivial things.

    It's funny you mention reward and punishment. Do you need this in order to be a good person? I try to be good for its own sake, not because I fear punishment and desire rewards in an unproven afterlife.

    As for everyone going to heaven for believing in the correct god - have you ever considered that a person's religious beliefs, in the majority of cases, are dictated by the culture in which they were raised? So a person born into the wrong culture would be prevented from going to heaven. How can this sound anything but ridiculous?

    Quote Originally Posted by itachi73378 View Post
    Another reason why I'm glad I'm religious. Some people have such sad impressions of life and death.
    I consider life to be beautiful as it is, thank you very much.

    Quote Originally Posted by itachi73378 View Post

    I don't think that ANY human on this earth will ever die hoping to be in eternal darkness. In our final moments when we know that we can't fight anymore and our lives are coming to an end, even the worst of us will die with some sort of hope/wish. It may be different for all of us but NO ONE will like to think that it is the final end.
    Hopes and wishes are of little consequence to truth.

    Quote Originally Posted by Abdou23 View Post
    Let me ask a question here,Let's say that someone ( not necessary you ) don't believe in God or afterlife.He absolutely have no guide which tells him how to live his life or what's good or what's bad.Let's say this guy lives a very ordinary life,wife-kids,a lot of bills to pay,get sick like normal people.let's just say he is not the happiest person on earth.My question here is: What is the purpose of that life ?! when someone like that who is not very happy and suffers ordinary life problems why not just end his life and get it over with ?! what's keeping him going everyday knowing that tomorrow will be same as yesterday ?! knowing that there is absolutely no consequence what so ever for taking his own life ?!
    What is the purpose of a tornado? Not everything need a purpose to exist. We can assign purposes, however, and we don't need religion to do that for us. I'd consider the advancement of science as a great purpose, for example.

    Quote Originally Posted by Abdou23 View Post
    Now you are arguing for the sake of it.How is trying to do more good deeds than sins is pointless ?! and are you telling me to die and reach the afterlife? you think my life is controlled because there are things that i can or can't do, but you didn't stop and think whether my religion is right in forbidding and demanding those things.Let me give you some examples here:
    Forbids:
    *killing
    *robbing
    *gambling:waste of money and sometimes leads to destroy relations.
    *lying
    *bribe
    *treason
    *Hypocrisy
    *False testimony
    *Injustice or injustice judge
    * adultery
    *Disobedience to parents
    *insulting others
    *smoking ( or anything that leads to the destruction of human body or sanity )

    Just to name a few.

    Demands - Encourages:
    *praying
    *giving money to the poor.
    *helping relatives or neighbours in need ( with money or anything you can help with )
    *obeying parents
    *all people are equals no matter race-colour or gender( no such thing as slavery )
    *Respecting other religions and beliefs and not forcing other people to join.
    *Visiting family members on regular basis ( priority to people in sickness )
    *helping orphans with money or any other way you can ( optional )

    Also to name a few.

    Now i don't want you to look at these as religion stuff.Just look at them as guidelines for your own life.Now tell me if everyone in your city - country followed these guidelines will society be better or worse? tell me that a person who follows such guidelines ( plus more ) have a controlled pointless life.
    Most of those guidelines are good ones to live by, but one does not need religion to live by such guidelines, and many religious people themselves don't live by those guidelines (particularly the killing one). Being religious does not make you a good person; being a good person makes you a good person. And let's not forget, there are some rather dangerous teachings asserted by some religions that you have conveniently left out (the suppression of women, for example).

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    I believe we are all born with a sense of morality, its not hard to work out the difference between right and wrong. Religion doesn't magically give us perfect moral reasoning, some people out there devote religious people can have a corrupt sense of morality and commit many dark evils without a single care.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Valefor View Post
    Most of those guidelines are good ones to live by, but one does not need religion to live by such guidelines, and many religious people themselves don't live by those guidelines (particularly the killing one). Being religious does not make you a good person; being a good person makes you a good person. And let's not forget, there are some rather dangerous teachings asserted by some religions that you have conveniently left out (the suppression of women, for example).
    Other points you mentioned we could argue about for years and each one would still be convinced with his own beliefs. But i just wanted to comment on this.I was clarifying for someone that religion isn't controlling my life in any bad way or forcing me to do or not do stuff that i don't want.He said that he wanted to live free life with no God telling him how to live it.That means he wants to be free to kill or rob someone or destroy his health by using drugs for instance.But he still doesn't do it,and a lot of people may think about doing theses stuff or worse but don't,and you know why? not because they are all good people ( not 90% of the time ) but because they will go to prison for it.So you may not live by religion guidelines but you sure live by society guidelines. Cave men didn't have religion or society.You telling me they were good civilized people ? no survival of the fittest or killing each other over food ? What i'm saying is you don't become a good person on your own you need guideline to tell you what's good and what's bad.And society's guidelines originally came from religions then people made few tweaks to it. Following my religion guidelines makes a better person and i believe if all people followed them we will be living in Utopia.Bad thing is,not all people will follow.

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    Ghosts are just stupid, always a logical explanation for a "ghost" siting. (Wind, creaking doors..etc)

    I also never got the fear of ghosts, sure if they existed they might freak you out a bit...but I doubt they could physically harm you.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Abdou23 View Post
    Other points you mentioned we could argue about for years and each one would still be convinced with his own beliefs. But i just wanted to comment on this.I was clarifying for someone that religion isn't controlling my life in any bad way or forcing me to do or not do stuff that i don't want.He said that he wanted to live free life with no God telling him how to live it.That means he wants to be free to kill or rob someone or destroy his health by using drugs for instance.But he still doesn't do it,and a lot of people may think about doing theses stuff or worse but don't,and you know why? not because they are all good people ( not 90% of the time ) but because they will go to prison for it.So you may not live by religion guidelines but you sure live by society guidelines. Cave men didn't have religion or society.You telling me they were good civilized people ? no survival of the fittest or killing each other over food ? What i'm saying is you don't become a good person on your own you need guideline to tell you what's good and what's bad.And society's guidelines originally came from religions then people made few tweaks to it. Following my religion guidelines makes a better person and i believe if all people followed them we will be living in Utopia.Bad thing is,not all people will follow.
    Utopia? It would not be a utopia for women, or any other group religions see as lesser people. Look around the world at theocracies, and you can see how deficient those societies are when controlled on religious grounds. Then take a look at the secular world, and you will see a large difference when it comes to human rights and living standards.

    And again, you are conveniently leaving out the horrendous teachings of religion, by cherry picking the nice parts. Ask yourself, how can people discard the evil teachings of religious books, if that very book is the only place from which they gain their morality? It's because morals can be gained from a variety of places, such as moral philosophy, and science (new understanding allows us to adapt the guidelines by which we live). Religions do not have the monopoly on morality, and in the present, religions are often lagging behind.

    Make no mistake, in the future, people will look back - just as you have with cave men - and wonder why many people of this age lacked the morality to accept others as equals, regardless of, for example, their sexual orientation or gender.

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