Shootings At Connecticut Elementary School

[admartian]

Absolutely terrible news.

I don't see how anyone else can see this as anything else. Terrible things happen in this world; death is inevitable, we all know that much.

But when tragic things DO happen; there's absolutely nothing wrong with empathising to those involved and affected.

Thoughts to all the families.

Prepare to get flamed by the American Gun Elite on these forums.

Seriously though, it's ironic that you don't witness these kind of things NEARLY as often in other parts of the world that HAVE stricter gun laws in place. Just saying...

Yep. As much as I am pro live and let live (own/do what you want so long as it doesn't hurt anybody or stop anybody from being themselves) and taking into account that no place is "perfect"; I don't see how you can't draw correlations of this event and past events to anything else.

[mynd]

My posts being constructive (they're certainly most consecutive than most of the posts in here) wasn't up for debate. You stated that I wasn't focusing on the causes for why this happened, when actually it was the focus of my posts. People do need to realize that it's the cause and not the tool that is the real issue here. All you're doing is emphasizing on the groundwork I laid.

You're initial post towards me and its altering thereafter are simply improper. Why you decided to target me when clearly we're on a similar page is beyond me.

Wasnt target at you specifically, just that you were the first to respond to what I considered a valid point, these are rehashed arguments. That you took exception to that comment is interesting in itself, as you say, you certainly ahead of the curve in terms of standard responses, although I still feel your not asking the next set of key questions.

[DarkVincent07]

Very very sad news. Condolences for all affected by this tragedy. Such a horrible thing to happen

[Wrath]

F3AR, I sincerely hope you're not serious about homeschooling your children from here on out because quite frankly, this would be the worst thing you could do.

As shocking as the incident has proven to be, it could literally happen anywhere and you will never be truly safe. Hell, some robbers might just decide to forcefully break into your property while you're busy with homeschooling...

This would be like saying that I will never set a foot into American soil again because of the tragic 9/11 events and the possible risk of terroristic activity. It just doesn't work that way and all you will achieve is socially isolating yourself (or your children for that matter).

[THUGGEDOUT]

Very sad and shocking news, really don't understand what the hell is going these days. I see they are saying that this guy was suffering from mental illness that was going untreated or something. In any case, thoughts go out to all those parents whose children's lives that were cut short.


Tap-a-hoe

[claud3]

The ban on guns will go on... Guns are an elementary part of American society and it's like losing an arm or a leg when taken away

It's a way of life and it will change when people Change... we can not pass judgement on one countries way of handling their gun laws, as no country in the world is free of gun crime at any point of their existence

[Mael Duin]

[squirrelbo1]

I think you are exagerating. I am pretty sure that such things can only happen in countries like America, in Switzerland such people wouldnt even have weapons.

has one of the highest gun ownerhip per capita in the world. Switzerland has loads of fucking guns.

If Conneticut had concealed carry then maybe this guy would have been taken out before he had a chance to kill anybody. Or if there was open carry he might not have done it at all when he sees in plain sight that there are armed citizens that are able to defend themselves with lethal force. Gun control only disarms law abiding citizens and this guy would have just chose another method in which to kill or would have bought a gun on the black market.

yeah all those kids and primary school teachers would be carrying guns...........

You still dont get it
When you want to hijack a plane is not like hijacking a car on a public parking where the only security available is the cars one. If you want to hijack an aircraft you have to bypass the whole airport security with weapons and hijacking devices. Its not the planes security that matters but the airports.

only post 9/11

Looks like american schools dont suffer only in security but also in education...
First you post something about Norway which has absolutely nothing to do with switzerland and now you say that improving pilot cabins is the best option? Lol no the best option is to establish an airport security which doesnt give access to planes so people hijack them...

if you cant get into the cockpit then you cant hijack the plane.

That's isn't possible. You are either for one or the other. Can't have both.

not sure how that works seeing as you guys have restrictions already on a state by state basis.

F3AR, I sincerely hope you're not serious about homeschooling your children from here on out because quite frankly, this would be the worst thing you could do.

As shocking as the incident has proven to be, it could literally happen anywhere and you will never be truly safe. Hell, some robbers might just decide to forcefully break into your property while you're busy with homeschooling...

This would be like saying that I will never set a foot into American soil again because of the tragic 9/11 events and the possible risk of terroristic activity. It just doesn't work that way and all you will achieve is socially isolating yourself (or your children for that matter).

good luck to whoever enters f34rs house



The debate here should not be about gun control, it should be about the fucked up nature of American society. Sorry guys your fucking crazy. There are plenty of countries that have similar levels if not higher of gun ownership and stuff like this just doesn't happen anywhere near as regularly. Half the battle is treating people who are disturbed, buts lets be honest the nature of your healthcare means people are not likely to fork out for all the tests and drugs and whatnot, and the rest is about education and trying to find the root of many of the issues.

[Cybertox]

@squirrelbo1

Switzerland has many weapons but in order to own one a lot of trainings and documents are required. Its not like every psycho can get easily a weapon like its in America. The rules of owning weapons here in Switzerland are very strict.

Airport security is a lot more important than the aircrafts security. The airport is the only one which gains access to aircrafts which terrorist would try to hijack, as far as terrorists dont decide to hijack places from american military airbases. If you can get access to the aircrafts by passing the airport security you can kill all the passengers or just blow the aircrafts up, a cockpit security wont even help in a such situation. I am also pretty sure that you can gain access to a cockpit a lot easier and it doesnt really matter which kind of a security system there is. If the cockpit door will get better security, hijackers will just blow the entrance door with c4 or any other explosives.

[Equinoqs]

I have been raging for the past day on the need for gun control NOW. No one's taking your guns away in America, but you can wait two weeks for a background check to make sure you aren't a felon or certifiably unstable. If you still say guns don't kill people, I say you are a fucking moron. If you still fear the government/Obama/liberals are coming to take away your guns, you are a fucking moron. I stopped reading the rest of this thread as soon as the asinine gun defenses began, so I don't really know how other board members feel on the issue.

**Removed by staff**

One thing I have not been able to do is give sympathies to the families of the victims because even thinking about the kids makes me think of the Christmas trees that have presents sitting under them right now that will never be opened and that will make me totally lose my shit.

[reasonable_doubt]

One thing I have not been able to do is give sympathies to the families of the victims because even thinking about the kids makes me think of the Christmas trees that have presents sitting under them right now that will never be opened and that will make me totally lose my shit.

like u might go crazy and shoot ppl...?

[Morganator]

I respectfully disagree with everything you just said morgan.

A mind that is sick cannot be educated to not kill.

Im going to bed, will continue this debate in the morning.

Sent from my SCH-I500 using Tapatalk 2

It's cool. I wouldn't expect anyone to actually agree with me. My stance on guns is actually pretty extreme since I advocate for responsibility of the individual instead of the state. I just don't see how more regulation will affect a more positive influence and outcome regarding crimes committed with the use of firearms. Criminals will be criminals and you really can't know about the crazies early enough to mitigate possible crimes they may or may not commit without infringing and/or denying and disparaging their rights as human beings. The best course of action in my opinion, is to deregulate, educate and arm the rest of the population. Doing what we have been doing only serves to make criminals of everyone.

[squirrelbo1]

@squirrelbo1

Switzerland has many weapons but in order to own one a lot of trainings and documents are required. Its not like every psycho can get easily a weapon like its in America. The rules of owning weapons here in Switzerland are very strict.

Airport security is a lot more important than the aircrafts security. The airport is the only one which gains access to aircrafts which terrorist would try to hijack, as far as terrorists dont decide to hijack places from american military airbases. If you can get access to the aircrafts by passing the airport security you can kill all the passengers or just blow the aircrafts up, a cockpit security wont even help in a such situation. I am also pretty sure that you can gain access to a cockpit a lot easier and it doesnt really matter which kind of a security system there is. If the cockpit door will get better security, hijackers will just blow the entrance door with c4 or any other explosives.

dont deny that they have strict laws.


im not denying thats not true, but half the reason 9/11 was so easy was because using tiny concealed knives they were able to overpower the crew and just open the cockpit door. That is simply not the case anymore. Also you have never been able to get explosives onto planes.

[F34R]

I respectfully disagree with everything you just said morgan.

A mind that is sick cannot be educated to not kill.

Im going to bed, will continue this debate in the morning.

Sent from my SCH-I500 using Tapatalk 2

Yeah, but you forget that if those teachers were armed, or if they had armed security in that school, this would have been much much different.

F3AR, I sincerely hope you're not serious about homeschooling your children from here on out because quite frankly, this would be the worst thing you could do.

As shocking as the incident has proven to be, it could literally happen anywhere and you will never be truly safe. Hell, some robbers might just decide to forcefully break into your property while you're busy with homeschooling...

This would be like saying that I will never set a foot into American soil again because of the tragic 9/11 events and the possible risk of terroristic activity. It just doesn't work that way and all you will achieve is socially isolating yourself (or your children for that matter).

Worst thing? I don't think so at all. I'd rather it happen right here at home, or anywhere else I'm with my kids. They'd be met with my rage, and my weapons.. that I carry with me in the house, and everywhere I go, especially with my kids. Bring it. That day will be the last day they have to try and hurt others.

Two mentally ill men attacked children in school today. One in Connecticut, one in China. In Connecticut, 20 children are dead. In China, no children are dead. A reasonable person might immediately ask what was different in the two situations, and draw a lesson from it.

Conservatives who continue to ignore the very real gun problem are suffering from the same thing which cost them the election. You choose to live in a world of rhetoric, instead of reality. And between the two, reality wins. You can continue to ignore the problem. Pretend it doesn't exist. Try to rationalize it away with rhetoric about your right to bear arms.

Here's a dose of reality.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datab...hip-world-list

Japan had 11 gun homicides. Ireland, 21. Sweden, 37. Switzerland, 57. Norway, 2.

United States, 9,146.

Anyone care to take a guess which country has near the highest numbers of citizen gun possession, while simultaneously having some of the laxest laws to control them?

Your rhetoric is not solving this very real problem. It's time to live in reality, and deal with this problem, instead of wishing it away with useless jingoistic nonsense. Enough is enough. It's time to revise our laws.

Look at the numbers by percentages lol. Look at the countries that have strict laws, and have the higher than the US gun murders lol. Yeah, there's reality pal.

[claud3]

can we honestly say anything will change... We can hate on the fact guns are easily obtained in the states all we want and gun control is needed...

But it will not stop this or anything else happening like this again

[F34R]

can we honestly say anything will change... We can hate on the fact guns are easily obtained in the states all we want and gun control is needed...

But it will not stop this or anything else happening like this again

The reality of it is that for people to legally own a gun, it's not necessarily easy to get. There are steps you have to go through. Whereas those that aren't allowed to own a gun, can get the much easier. Then put on the plate that where these people want to go to kill others, there isn't anyone armed to stop them. All the schools where I live have an armed officer on duty an hour before school starts, and they end their shift an hour after school lets out. That has been like that since the school shooting in my wife's' class in 1995. We haven't had an incident like this again. We've had a lot of kids caught with weapons at school before they were able to use them.

I'm hoping that they put another in each school after this incident, or at least, step up the ability to let someone in the school just because they are a familiar person.

[DeviousOne]

I'm not going to really get into any of the previous post about gun control and america shit but people have lost site children lives were lost. Gun control is an whole other debate.

My 2 cents if you want a gun you need to pass an annual mental competency test and wait 2 weeks for a background check. I don't feel background checks do much because in most cases people like this don't have a record.

If people chose to live there life in fear and not go to america and other places so be it that's a personal choice. I chose not to live in fear and will go anywhere I damn please

[F34R]

I'm not going to really get into any of the previous post about gun control and america shit but people have lost site children lives were lost. Gun control is an whole other debate.

My 2 cents if you want a gun you need to pass an annual mental competency test and wait 2 weeks for a background check. I don't feel background checks do much because in most cases people like this don't have a record.

If people chose to live there life in fear and not go to america and other places so be it that's a personal choice. I chose not to live in fear and will go anywhere I damn please

Again with the gun control for people... the only real option to keep people from hurting others with guns is removing ever gun out of this country, permanently. These 2 week waiting periods, only disarm legal people. It doesn't keep those that either can't own a gun, or don't even want to go through waiting, etc., from getting guns.

Remember, this guy didn't even own a gun, or least didn't own any of the guns in this tragedy. Hell, he wasn't at the age legally to buy these guns. So, which of these periods or checks would have stopped this?

No, I don't think ANYONE here has lost site that children lost their lives.

[claud3]

The reality of it is that for people to legally own a gun, it's not necessarily easy to get. There are steps you have to go through. Whereas those that aren't allowed to own a gun, can get the much easier. Then put on the plate that where these people want to go to kill others, there isn't anyone armed to stop them. All the schools where I live have an armed officer on duty an hour before school starts, and they end their shift an hour after school lets out. That has been like that since the school shooting in my wife's' class in 1995. We haven't had an incident like this again. We've had a lot of kids caught with weapons at school before they were able to use them.

I'm hoping that they put another in each school after this incident, or at least, step up the ability to let someone in the school just because they are a familiar person.

But that does not extend to the kids of parents that can get them and kill people

it was the mother that owned the guns and her son got them and did this.... The NRA needs to help and government to... Also parents play a role in this as well

do you not think that if a parent owns guns, they should teach their kids that guns are dangerous and that its wrong to use them in the wrong way

so parents, NRA, government, Gun shop owners, regulators... These are the people that need the education in how to handle gun control and limitions to the 2snd amendment

[djpenny]

should do this

[F34R]

But that does not extend to the kids of parents that can get them and kill people

it was the mother that owned the guns and her son got them and did this.... The NRA needs to help and government to... Also parents play a role in this as well

do you not think that if a parent owns guns, they should teach their kids that guns are dangerous and that its wrong to use them in the wrong way

so parents, NRA, government, Gun shop owners, regulators... These are the people that need the education in how to handle gun control and limitions to the 2snd amendment

I agree with you 100% on this one. As far as the NRA and Gov't helping, they do A LOT as far as the education goes. It's up to the parents to get their kids there though. There are also local groups that are licensed by the NRA to give the classes, etc. The support is out there. Again, it's up to the parents to get their kids into these programs. Gun Education.

[claud3]

Agreed, but it's just like the internet with the government

they need educated on that and they still fail in some parts... The same goes for guns mate

the NRA and Government still need educated on this

[F34R]

I think that just applies to everything known to mankind. There's always some way to move forward in any aspect of life.

[claud3]

agreed, but there is always them few steps back that just knock everything of course

[Equinoqs]

Since my previous post was censored for being 'insulting/harassing', here is a milder version of it.

I have been raging for the past day on the need for gun control NOW. No one's taking your guns away in America, but you can wait two weeks for a background check to make sure you aren't a felon or certifiably unstable. If you still say guns don't kill people, I say you are deluding yourself. If you still fear the government/Obama/liberals are coming to take away your guns, you are deluding yourself. I stopped reading the rest of this thread as soon as the asinine gun defenses began, so I don't really know how other board members feel on the issue.

One thing I have not been able to do is give sympathies to the families of the victims because even thinking about the kids makes me think of the Christmas trees that have presents sitting under them right now that will never be opened and that will make me totally lose my shit.