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Last edited by LfCpS3; 01-19-2013 at 00:03.
and this theme seems to echo around all forums that have been following the spec rumours for some time.
this board, by contrast, has NOT been paying much attention, which is why so few are questioning these specs.
the prevailing and "latest" specs are very similar to the vgleaks 6 months ago if memory serves correctly, not these, which seem to have little basis. which is a shame.Got YLOD? In the UK? I'll buy it off you.
Strange vg247 said ps4 is 50percent more powerful. I dont know what to believe.
uuummmmm...Fried Beer iis a reality.
the problem here is we seem to have confused rumours that are clearly from fanboy sources, (and i stress i'm not talking about the mainstream journalism that lazily picks up on any rumour that may attract hits) and sources that actually inspire technical discussion.
there is a BIG difference.
put it this way. by now i'm sure everyone knows my bias. i have always prefered the 360, even though my favourite game is GoW. i want the 720 to be better, because i know their UI will be - and this is a massive bugbear of mine. i think the ps3 is a better console, marred by $#@! interface and poor controls. anyway, the point is DECENT rumours, however incomplete (and this is where i think the 720 will surprise people), point to better conventional specs for the ps4. currently both look underwhelming, but the ps4, from a conventional standpoint - which maynot be the best comparison, looks a good way ahead. i don't believe any of the latest misterxmedia claims, because they are baseless. i killed my inner fanboy years ago so i don't have to listen to it.
if we want to have decent discussion of rumours, we need to talk from a technical standpoint - not pick up on every bit of propaganda that suits our agenda.
Originally Posted by liquidboy
Interesting you bring up DSP ... I've been following the DSP discussion for the Durango perspective (all rumors of course)...
From what I can gather MS will have a couple of DSP's that are being sold as a way to "future proof" the system..
We have an Audio DSP sitting on 1 of the 3 socs
We have Hardware DSP's sitting on the other 2 socs.
The following patents from MS
1. "Using ray tracing for real time audio synthesis"
2. "Exposing off-host audio processing capabilities"
Explicitly these patents talk about how "Audio DSP" on a device can be used as a source of audio stream signals that can be pushed to
a) other SoC/Components within the host for processing
b) to a different external host (like the cloud) for processing
(interestingly it uses RayTracing techniques to carry out processing of these signals)
The result of the processing can be returned back to the host, if it was processed outside of it, and the played ...
There are other patents that talk about using the other DSP's (video/HW) as sources of streams that can be orchestrated outside of the Host (cloud etc) ... basically using similar techniques as the audio dsp
I guess that's one way MS is future proofing its console, by adding a dimension of the cloud to augment their hardware via these DSP's...
I know its all rumors but its ive always been interested in the rumors of Durango and its DSP's as being a differentiating point ...
How would raytracing audio work? Use the tracing to figure out how sound would bounce? Seems cool, makes more sense than VTE for doing raytracing lighting.
Are we sure there won't be a VTE in Durango? Somenoe said raytracing takes alot of memory maybe this si why there is 8gb of GDRR5 in durango? i think durango will do raytracing, or maybe its just what i really wan to happen
i guess a better question is why WOULDN'T there be VTE in durango for raytracing? if a 680gtx can do raytracing whats to say a vte made just for raytracing wouldn't happen?
or should i am just kidding myself? (be brutally honest guys!)
come on, discussing this sort of thing is surely much more interesting? what is it that makes devs claim "there isn't much in it"?
i know little about raytracing, but i find it interesting to see that noone technical really believes its possible for graphics, and then interesting links start merging with the DSP custom unit rumours.
i agree, unit we get the final specs, don't argue about which is better based on 'my blog is better than yours', but look at what rumours have any basis. that's why i like the DF article. they have CLEARLY double checked and cross checked rumours before posting them. everything they've reported has at least a few sources.
its not just from $#@!ing misterxmedia!!
Last edited by J3ff3; 01-19-2013 at 04:03.Got YLOD? In the UK? I'll buy it off you.
i have read the DF one though, and still think that it is better researched than some of the more recent articles, but ill admit there is some possible confusion in the piece (again from forums!) "secret sauce" for example was consistantly used (and is used in inverted commas in their article, suggesting plagiarism) in reference to the durango on several forums, not the ps4. this came from the idea that the 720 had several customisations to help the apparently weaker gpu (blitter? raytracing?! DSP etc). and i think 8 gigs is personally a similar confusion - but as you said, speculation is speculation. a 4 to 8 gig jump is not implausible. it may well stem from prior documents or toying with the idea of DDR ram on sony's part. or just confusion by DF between the two consoles. a ~1-1.5tf to 3-4tf, however, is a stretch, imo. i can't see how that leap is made without justification.
but the underlying specs, jaguar etc, seem much better researched and matched with most of what we know. again there is debate, but in terms of scale it is negligable (like the outdated idea that they were steamroller cores, or that jaguar cores were too big and not powerful enough). there was always reason behind the speculation and the disagreements. its why these misterxmedia rumours are just laughed out of technical forums. they are the equivalent of those vgcharts around here
*ill add the disclaimer that mynd, you are far more technical than i am. have a read around - and i mean following a few of the big threads from (ok not quite) start to finish. you'd gain much more from them and be able to pass on much better knowledge here than i would. i can just see where and how the rumours are being manipulated because i read the threads everyday. these things have 5,6,7 pages added within an afternoon. some of them are quite active and worth keeping up to date on. i think you'd enjoy them!
Last edited by J3ff3; 01-19-2013 at 04:53.Got YLOD? In the UK? I'll buy it off you.
new xbox sounds like the Atari Jaguar's Tom and Jerry BS lol
No matter which rumors are true and which are not, the one sure thing is that the nextbox is going to be an absolute BEAST! Will it be more "powerful" than the PS4, who really cares? I'm sure each system will have their advantages and disadvantages. One thing for sure is that the nextbox will replace my 360 and my current 3D Blu-Ray, (my PS3) as the only console I'll need and own.
Me, I'm getting the nextbox regardless of what Sony does with their next console. I know the nextbox will be a great machine, have great third party support and will be a great multimedia machine.
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Also personally I'd rather have an all in one conolse than some box that just plays games.
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That's the thing, the ps4 will no doubt have that media side to it, look at the ps4.
It probably will not focus as much on that as the 720 ( plus with the rumoured xbox having a full windows 8 as the OS... not sure i like that tbh)
Personally i think SONY will have the right balance of games to other media.
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VG Leaks Durango Unveiled
As we promised during the weekend in the next weeks we will unveil Durango and Orbis. All the technical info you want to know about the next generation machines from Sony and Microsoft.
The first one is Durango. In this article we present the system overview with the general components and some technical details about them.
How are durango components connected?
Here you can see the Durango system block diagram:
Let’s check what’s inside the box:
- x64 Architecture
- 8 CPU cores running at 1.6 gigahertz (GHz)
- each CPU thread has its own 32 KB L1 instruction cache and 32 KB L1 data cache
- each module of four CPU cores has a 2 MB L2 cache resulting in a total of 4 MB of L2 cache
- each core has one fully independent hardware thread with no shared execution resources
- each hardware thread can issue two instructions per clock
- custom D3D11.1 class 800-MHz graphics processor
- 12 shader cores providing a total of 768 threads
- each thread can perform one scalar multiplication and addition operation (MADD) per clock cycle
- at peak performance, the GPU can effectively issue 1.2 trillion floating-point operations per second
High-fidelity Natural User Interface (NUI) sensor is always present
Storage and Memory:
- 8 gigabyte (GB) of RAM DDR3 (68 GB/s)
- 32 MB of fast embedded SRAM (ESRAM) (102 GB/s)
- from the GPU’s perspective the bandwidths of system memory and ESRAM are parallel providing combined peak bandwidth of 170 GB/sec.
- Hard drive is always present
- 50 GB 6x Blu-ray Disc drive
- Gigabit Ethernet
- Wi-Fi and Wi-Fi Direct
- Move engines
- Image, video, and audio codecs
- Kinect multichannel echo cancellation (MEC) hardware
- Cryptography engines for encryption and decryption, and hashing
We will give more detailed information about each component in future articles.
Last edited by Itachi; 01-21-2013 at 16:15.I wonder when a nuclear warhead goes off, does the frame rate of real life drop?
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I do not see this being fact... This next gen between these two, could and might go either way
Depends on how much time they have actually put into their respective consoles and also money is the big thing here
will Sony make a massive lost this time around or have they learnt from the PS3 lessons. Also Microsoft will use current tech like Kinect and just upgrade it a wee bit, and pass it of as if it is Next-gen Kinect
So goes for the PS3 MovePlato and Aristotle, a detail of The School of Athens, a fresco by Raphael. Aristotle gestures to the earth, representing his belief in knowledge
Personally, exclusives aren't that important to me. Most of what I play is multi-platform anyway but if a decent exclusive comes along I'll pick it up. There are no exclusives that make me want one console over another. I've always favored the Xbox over the Playstation so I'll be sticking with it again next gen.
So the question of the hour is, just how accurate is the information? Based on our communications with the leaker, the data appears genuine - the only real question is how recent it is. The proof presented by the source suggests that the data is at most nine months old: factoring in how long it takes to create a console, the chances are that there will not be many changes implemented since then.
01-21-2013 #72"We don't provide the 'easy to program for' console that (developers) want, because 'easy to program for' means that anybody will be able to take advantage of pretty much what the hardware can do, so then the question is, what do you do for the rest of the nine-and-a-half years?"
--Kaz Hirai, CEO, Sony Computer Entertainment
and as for the articles comment on 'nothing will change in 9 months' - pretty sure the orbis went from 2-4 gig in that time frame.
i'm hoping something will, because i'm not *overly* impressed with either. yes, we don't know about the custom blocks properly yet, and there maybe other things (HSA?) implemented that make these consoles powerful, but i don't consider them 'beasts' by any stretch of the imagination, and i'm struggling to see what 'investments' or ventures MS has had with AMD. it all looks rather basic.
lets hope that's a sign that there is much more to come.Got YLOD? In the UK? I'll buy it off you.
I wonder when a nuclear warhead goes off, does the frame rate of real life drop?
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From thw same article
UPDATE: VG247 has just revealed areport ofa source that hasrevealed to the site that thePS4 isin fact more powerful than the Xbox 720. Here the source claims the PS4 will be capableof 1.82TFlops while the Xbox720 iscapable of only 1.23 TFlops.
It's a world away from thedetails we've posted here, but weurge you to have a read and judge for yourself.
As always it'sworth remember that thisis all earlyconjecture - how trueany of this is hard to gauge until wesee final confirmation of the hardware.
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"Xbox is about to become the next water cooler”
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