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  1. #601
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agriel View Post
    We got to see something that is more important that what the PS4 will look like, we got to see games.
    This. And amazing looking games at that.

  2. #602
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    @ Mynd Question is the MS GPU Single Precision or Double Precision?

    I believe Durango is DP GPU and if that's the case

    They are compare 1.8 Tf SP with 1.2 Tf DP! But they never write that this is different precision compute power!
    Last edited by X2; 02-24-2013 at 18:29.
    "We don't provide the 'easy to program for' console that (developers) want, because 'easy to program for' means that anybody will be able to take advantage of pretty much what the hardware can do, so then the question is, what do you do for the rest of the nine-and-a-half years?"
    --Kaz Hirai, CEO, Sony Computer Entertainment

  3. #603
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    Quote Originally Posted by X2 View Post
    yes I do, I have a ps3 as well.
    Being a multi-console owner doesn't absolve anybody from bias. We've already seen a shining example of that from another poster in this thread.

  4. #604
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    Quote Originally Posted by radgamer420 View Post
    Being a multi-console owner doesn't absolve anybody from bias. We've already seen a shining example of that from another poster in this thread.
    I wasn't trying to using that at all. I've been here long enough for people to know where I stand.
    "We don't provide the 'easy to program for' console that (developers) want, because 'easy to program for' means that anybody will be able to take advantage of pretty much what the hardware can do, so then the question is, what do you do for the rest of the nine-and-a-half years?"
    --Kaz Hirai, CEO, Sony Computer Entertainment

  5. #605
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yungstar 2006 View Post
    the messages coming from some at MS after Sony's rush PS4 reveal show they don't appear to be flustered by it at all. it looks more likely that Sony are fearing they are about to get lost in the reveal of 720 and are trying to have a voice before the rush starts.

    so without revealing anything, round 1 to MS it is.
    I'm sorry, are you MS' messenger as I certainly did not get a message from them? Are you a telekinesis interpreter?

    Do you mean, sort of like how MS rushed the console last generation in fear of Sony? Really? It's called business tactics lol. Do you realize how much buzz this has created?

    Xbox 360 came out 7+ years ago, PS3 6+... basically people wanted to see anything by now.

  6. #606
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    Quote Originally Posted by Two4DaMoney View Post
    The same people that wanted Sony to show all their cards, get naked and spread those cheeks.

    They act like E3 doesn't exist.
    Exactly! Why does everyone expect that Sony was to reveal every possible detail about their console. They didn't show the console so they failed. No they beat MS to the punch regardless of how you look at it. If they show everything MS can go back to the drawing board in some places to make 720 better. Not saying completely changing hardware but some features that maybe MS werent planning on using but because Sony showed them all they had to.

    Everyone knows e3 is the place to reveal you whole hand. So if MS doesn't show some things in their reveal is it rushed? Probably not because its MS.


  7. #607
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    Nice detour.
    Sony are rushing, we all know that, even they have said design aint finalised, but at least they have showed some key specs. MS is playing their cards close to their chest, so close we are still specilating, even after the hacker superdae came clean.

    We know now he never had an sdk, it was never sent to aus, and he has never seen one.
    His documents were gleaned from
    the intial ALPHA, Sdk.

    Alpha's are subject to immense change. So much so that MS did not reveal to
    Developers the true specs of the 360 gpu till only a few months before launch.

    Consider all this when you all speculate these supposed set in stone facts gleaned from a hacker from an alpha kit.

  8. #608
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    Oh lordy...The damage control going on these days is sad.

  9. #609
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost-Rhayne View Post
    Oh lordy...The damage control going on these days is sad.
    Agreed there sir

    ~~~OLD SKOOL~~~

  10. #610
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost-Rhayne View Post
    Oh lordy...The damage control going on these days is sad.
    720 twice as strong as ps4 confirmed.

  11. Likes Ghost likes this post
  12. #611
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    I'm merely referring to the fact of the doom and gloom outlook because they didn't reveal the console. Many act like they come out and said he we got the ps4 and left. They showed specs and even gameplay. Two aspects not many thought they would show. If it was the other around and they just showed the console and controller with a couple tech demos would that have been a rush? No it would have been a typical reveal. But because the console was not shown it was rushed. I'm sorry but i dont care about the plastic case near as much as what's inside.


  13. #612
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    Quote Originally Posted by mynd View Post
    Nice detour.
    Sony are rushing, we all know that, even they have said design aint finalised, but at least they have showed some key specs. MS is playing their cards close to their chest, so close we are still specilating, even after the hacker superdae came clean.

    We know now he never had an sdk, it was never sent to aus, and he has never seen one.
    His documents were gleaned from
    the intial ALPHA, Sdk.

    Alpha's are subject to immense change. So much so that MS did not reveal to
    Developers the true specs of the 360 gpu till only a few months before launch.

    Consider all this when you all speculate these supposed set in stone facts gleaned from a hacker from an alpha kit.
    These are the specs that came from vgleaks for ps4

    GPU:

    GPU is based on AMD’s “R10XX” (Southern Islands) architecture
    DirectX 11.1+ feature set
    Liverpool is an enhanced version of the architecture
    18 Compute Units (CUs)
    Hardware balanced at 14 CUs
    Shared 512 KB of read/write L2 cache
    800 Mhz
    1.843 Tflops, 922 GigaOps/s
    Dual shader engines
    18 texture units
    8 Render backends


    AMD ATI 7850 (Southern Islands):
    http://www.amd.com/US/PRODUCTS/DESKT...on-7850.aspx#3


    DirectX 11.1-capable graphics
    LIVERPOOL SOC
    860MHz Engine Clock
    153.6GB/s memory bandwidth (maximum)
    1.76 TFLOPS Single Precision compute power
    16 Compute Units
    64 Texture Units

    So we know the PS4 uses a custom 7850 going by these specs.

    The Durango can only be 8970

    But take a close look:

    PS 4 (!!!)GPU - 1.843 Tflops (SP) (!!!), 922 GigaOps/s (DP) = AMD ATI 7850 (Southern Islands)
    Durango GPU - 4.311 Tflops (SP),(!!!)1.2 Tflops/s (DP)(!!!) =AMD ATI 8970 (Volcano Islands)

    We're looking at two different precision compute powers. But still there is more Single Precision and Double Precision compute power on the Durango GPU.

    Now check this out.

    Oban and the design of the cpu/s gpu/s .. are the equivalent Theoretical bandwidth. Oban is designed as the enhancement "change". As where sony has sp which is all most preferred over Dp. Because of read wright error's due to memory problems, but all this can really come down to a pc environment, as pc have to go via old style of bus and memory interconnection. Also the memory is not going to be utilized 100% due to no specialized memory controls. As kryptos has a way more advanced memory controller and accelerator, so double precision will not see the same problems. also gpu shader core threads are not 768.. as these cores can do two threads each which is equal to 2,304threads and at 100% utilization. Pc gpus and cpu use about 50/60% of there max capability, due to OS requirements and without a closed design it is unable to have a level of optimization like a closed set of hardware.
    Last edited by X2; 02-24-2013 at 19:28.
    "We don't provide the 'easy to program for' console that (developers) want, because 'easy to program for' means that anybody will be able to take advantage of pretty much what the hardware can do, so then the question is, what do you do for the rest of the nine-and-a-half years?"
    --Kaz Hirai, CEO, Sony Computer Entertainment

  14. #613
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost-Rhayne View Post
    Oh lordy...The damage control going on these days is sad.
    I frickin love it lol. These forums wouldn't be the same without these guys

  15. #614
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    Quote Originally Posted by X2 View Post
    These are the specs that came from vgleaks for ps4

    GPU:

    GPU is based on AMD’s “R10XX” (Southern Islands) architecture
    DirectX 11.1+ feature set
    Liverpool is an enhanced version of the architecture
    18 Compute Units (CUs)
    Hardware balanced at 14 CUs
    Shared 512 KB of read/write L2 cache
    800 Mhz
    1.843 Tflops, 922 GigaOps/s
    Dual shader engines
    18 texture units
    8 Render backends


    AMD ATI 7850 (Southern Islands):
    http://www.amd.com/US/PRODUCTS/DESKT...on-7850.aspx#3


    DirectX 11.1-capable graphics
    LIVERPOOL SOC
    860MHz Engine Clock
    153.6GB/s memory bandwidth (maximum)
    1.76 TFLOPS Single Precision compute power
    16 Compute Units
    64 Texture Units

    So we know the PS4 uses a custom 7850 going by these specs.

    The Durango can only be 8970

    But take a close look:

    PS 4 (!!!)GPU - 1.843 Tflops (SP) (!!!), 922 GigaOps/s (DP) = AMD ATI 7850 (Southern Islands)
    Durango GPU - 4.311 Tflops (SP),(!!!)1.2 Tflops/s (DP)(!!!) =AMD ATI 8970 (Volcano Islands)

    We're looking at two different precision compute powers. But still there is more Single Precision and Double Precision compute power on the Durango GPU.

    Now check this out.

    Gotta say...I doubt it. It would be an 8950 first off, and you're talking about cramming a 210 TDP gpu into a console. I just don't see it happening. It's more likely a modded 7770.

  16. #615
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    Quote Originally Posted by X2 View Post
    These are the specs that came from vgleaks for ps4
    Just the other damn day, you told me not to even guess what possible specs could be in the 720 even with edge having almost everything(even the 8gb bump) in the ps4 correctly. So why are you still carrying on about the 720 with the same rumors basically?
    Last edited by Two4DaMoney; 02-24-2013 at 20:38.

  17. #616
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    Quote Originally Posted by Two4DaMoney View Post
    Just the other damn day, you told me not to even guess what possible specs could be in the 720 even with edge having almost everything(even the 8gb bump) in the ps4 correctly. So why are you still carrying on about the 720 with the same rumors basically?
    It's called best case scenario

  18. #617
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost-Rhayne View Post
    Oh lordy...The damage control going on these days is sad.
    Yep, its sounding pretty desperate. Pathetic as it may be it does make for some entertaining reading though. lol

  19. #618
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    Quote Originally Posted by Two4DaMoney View Post
    Just the other damn day, you told me not to even guess what possible specs could be in the 720 even with edge having almost everything(even the 8gb bump) in the ps4 correctly. So why are you still carrying on about the 720 with the same rumors basically?
    I tried to apply that, but I love the conversations reminds me of 2005. I admitted I went back on my word.
    "We don't provide the 'easy to program for' console that (developers) want, because 'easy to program for' means that anybody will be able to take advantage of pretty much what the hardware can do, so then the question is, what do you do for the rest of the nine-and-a-half years?"
    --Kaz Hirai, CEO, Sony Computer Entertainment

  20. #619
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost-Rhayne View Post
    Oh lordy...The damage control going on these days is sad.
    Time will tell I guess, even on the specs that have been published, this GPU already keeps pace in terms of vertex and polygon throughput.

  21. #620
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    Quote Originally Posted by X2 View Post
    These are the specs that came from vgleaks for ps4

    GPU:

    GPU is based on AMD’s “R10XX” (Southern Islands) architecture
    DirectX 11.1+ feature set
    Liverpool is an enhanced version of the architecture
    18 Compute Units (CUs)
    Hardware balanced at 14 CUs
    Shared 512 KB of read/write L2 cache
    800 Mhz
    1.843 Tflops, 922 GigaOps/s
    Dual shader engines
    18 texture units
    8 Render backends


    AMD ATI 7850 (Southern Islands):
    http://www.amd.com/US/PRODUCTS/DESKT...on-7850.aspx#3


    DirectX 11.1-capable graphics
    LIVERPOOL SOC
    860MHz Engine Clock
    153.6GB/s memory bandwidth (maximum)
    1.76 TFLOPS Single Precision compute power
    16 Compute Units
    64 Texture Units

    So we know the PS4 uses a custom 7850 going by these specs.

    The Durango can only be 8970

    But take a close look:

    PS 4 (!!!)GPU - 1.843 Tflops (SP) (!!!), 922 GigaOps/s (DP) = AMD ATI 7850 (Southern Islands)
    Durango GPU - 4.311 Tflops (SP),(!!!)1.2 Tflops/s (DP)(!!!) =AMD ATI 8970 (Volcano Islands)

    We're looking at two different precision compute powers. But still there is more Single Precision and Double Precision compute power on the Durango GPU.

    Now check this out.

    Are you insane? You really think they're going to put an AMD 8970 in the Durango? Prepare to be disappointed.

    You just jumped the shark man.


    http://www.vgleaks.com/durango-gpu-2/

    I see nothing in the leaks or rumors from vetted devs anywhere that the Durango is packing something so powerful, or even that its GPU is more robust than the PS4's.
    Last edited by Vulgotha; 02-24-2013 at 22:44.


  22. #621
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    Using a 8970 would push the console into the 600 Dollar price range.

  23. #622
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    Quote Originally Posted by keefy View Post
    Using a 8970 would push the console into the 600 Dollar price range.
    Not to mention excess power draw and heat. No manufacturer wants another RROD situtation
    I wonder when a nuclear warhead goes off, does the frame rate of real life drop?

  24. #623
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    Quote Originally Posted by keefy View Post
    Using a 8970 would push the console into the 600 Dollar price range.
    The 8970's estimated launch price is $549...by itself.

  25. #624
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    buy it for $99 and pay $50 each month for the next 10 years! watch

  26. #625
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    Sony is flustered like crazy with that rushed show they put on. The only good that came out of it were the confirmation of specs. With that confirmation of specs also came the confirmation that so many of you are so happy to overlook. That Sony was completely wrong in regards to the cell. That's the main thing I took away from that rush job of a show. With that confirmation and the ecstatic nature you guys are displaying about their change to go kinda in a xbox direction with development just says MS knows what they're doing and most of you were wrong all these years.

    Praising Sony. Condemning lazy devs.
    Those lazy devs don't know the true power of the cell. /s
    lol

    Now a few of you are actually saying MS made the next xbox harder to develop for. Just because Sony threw a bunch a power at something doesn't mean anything really. Just look at a single core windows phone,iphone and a dual core android phone. All that time throwing power at android did nothing. That $#@! lagged and stuttered like Michael J. Fox. It only helped when google came in with project butter that it started showing improvements. In other words..... forget it.

    The 2005-2006 feeling is coming to fruition.

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