Digital Foundry: PS4 vs Next Box (Orbis vs Durango)

[itachi73378]

The ONLY thing I can possibly pull out of a hat is AMD's Cinema 2.0 voxel raytracing/raster.. But the concept of running that off of GDDR3 seems preposterous.

I read some gloomy talk on gaf about how UE4 was removing its voxel based lighting because the next gen consoles weren't powerful enough (rumours and possible bs) so I dunno if durango will have specialized hardware/software for that.

[ps3freak18]

The Kinect related part of that article is a deal breaker by itself.

Kinect dependant...no thank you. If this turns out to be true MS must be trying to lose their hardcore fan base. No buy for me if this is right. So stupid.

[Ixion]

Yeah, most of that information sounds pretty cool besides the Kinect stuff. That's fucking creepy.

[Two4DaMoney]

Mandatory kinect - No thank you. Now kindly fuck off. Another thing to drive up price.

Mandatory installs - I wonder how many GB's this is going to eat up being that games will ship on blu-ray? I can see this filling up pretty damn fast.

Multitasking while playing a game - Was expected. Comes off as a bonus to me. Nothing that will make or break my purchase decisions.

Controller - I prefer the dualshock with my snap on triggers than the 360 controller. So the newer design is welcomed.

Companion App - Mehh...

Specs Nothing really new.

My stance haven't changed. What it does sound like is that they are losing any possible price advantage over the ps4. People say that multiplats won't show any of the ps4 extra power than the 720's version, for MS sake, they better hope that's true.

[ps3freak18]

Yeah, most of that information sounds pretty cool besides the Kinect stuff. That's fucking creepy.

Yeah they want to hack into your system and watch you make a fool of yourself.

[Lefein]

More like they want to gather usage statistics to sell to marketers. MS is making a grip off advertising this gen and can use an integrated Kinect to maximize user rapage.

Don't shoot the messenger.

[Cyn]

Both don't seem impressive in the least. The statement that sums up both consoles is in the article and justifiably so.



I look at these specs and I'm thinking, WEAK.

I share your concerns to a degree but I still think we'll see a sizeable leap in performance. Big enough, at least. The gap between the PS4 and the next-next gen probably won't be as big as the gap between PS3/360 to PS4/720.

If they are cheaper and more importantly don't have the atrocious failure rates of this gen, then I'm happy.

[ps3freak18]

Just awful decisions by MS this time around. Before all the specs and info came out I was definitely buying a 720. That slowly went down to maybe, to no go. Hopefully this is a lot of rumors and MS will show they are smarter than this but I guess we will just have to wait and see. As it stands now MS is tanking from the start for next gen.

[radgamer420]

Just awful decisions by MS this time around. Before all the specs and info came out I was definitely buying a 720. That slowly went down to maybe, to no go. Hopefully this is a lot of rumors and MS will show they are smarter than this but I guess we will just have to wait and see. As it stands now MS is tanking from the start for next gen.

Agreed. The more info that I hear about 720 the more positive I'm going PS4 only next gen.

[Two4DaMoney]

I'm guessing they think every 3rd party dev will put heavy focus into kinect features.

[ps3freak18]

I'm guessing they think every 3rd party dev will put heavy focus into kinect features.

Yeah bad idea. Im sure devs look at like most hardcore gamers do. Kinect and Move are just tacked on gimmicks noting more. This is why i see this as a bad idea. Hardcore gamers are getting so screwed.

[Sufi]

I share your concerns to a degree but I still think we'll see a sizeable leap in performance. Big enough, at least. The gap between the PS4 and the next-next gen probably won't be as big as the gap between PS3/360 to PS4/720.

If they are cheaper and more importantly don't have the atrocious failure rates of this gen, then I'm happy.

We don't know what these closed-box systems are capable of, so yea, I agree that we will see a big difference.

One thing I will say for sure is that we will see a lesser gap of graphics/physics/sound between PC and consoles...partially due to the fact that as generations are passing by, we're seeing less and less develoeprs fully taking advantage of technology (on all platforms) and some either don't have a choice (if they want the old-school feel) and some don't need to and people would still buy their games...

But also partially that even PC game development is slowing down, you don't need an 8GB system (much less the highest specs) to play the latest game.

[Two4DaMoney]

Yeah bad idea. Im sure devs look at like most hardcore gamers do. Kinect and Move are just tacked on gimmicks noting more. This is why i see this as a bad idea. Hardcore gamers are getting so screwed.

I'm more worried about MS. Sony kept the exclusives coming. Sequels and new i.ps. MS's kinect took off and they haven't looked back. New i.ps dried up and they relied heavily on 3rd party as they release halo,gears, forza and fable. If they lose the 3rd party advantage that they held this gen then they are in for a long trip down a road covered in potholes.

Sony proved they could handle Move titles along with serving their core audience. MS has failed to do so in the degree that Sony has and I'm that's not something I want to take a risk on.

[radgamer420]

Yeah bad idea. Im sure devs look at like most hardcore gamers do. Kinect and Move are just tacked on gimmicks noting more. This is why i see this as a bad idea. Hardcore gamers are getting so screwed.

Getting screwed by MS. I have no doubt that Sony will continue with their main focus on core gamers and will continue to deliver with a steady stream of core exclusives. And its the core gamers that go out and buy consoles on launch day and stand in long lines waiting for the doors to open.

[Sufi]

I'm more worried about MS. Sony kept the exclusives coming. Sequels and new i.ps. MS's kinect took off and they haven't looked back. New i.ps dried up and they relied heavily on 3rd party as they release halo,gears, forza and fable. If they lose the 3rd party advantage that they held this gen then they are in for a long trip down a road covered in potholes.

Sony proved they could handle Move titles along with serving their core audience. MS has failed to do so in the degree that Sony has and I'm that's not something I want to take a risk on.

I'm assuming you mean better-looking 3rd party games when you say "3rd party advantage"...I honestly don't think just the graphics will matter much. The reason why 360 sold more copies was because the console itself is better suited for mainstream American gamers and that's why FIFA sold more on the PS3 even though it was probably inferior too unless someone can correct me here...same with Tekken games or non-NA games that sold better on the PS3, mostly due to the fact that PS3 is more suited for Japanese and EU gamers...but EU is more of a tie there.

[radgamer420]

I'm more worried about MS. Sony kept the exclusives coming. Sequels and new i.ps. MS's kinect took off and they haven't looked back. New i.ps dried up and they relied heavily on 3rd party as they release halo,gears, forza and fable. If they lose the 3rd party advantage that they held this gen then they are in for a long trip down a road covered in potholes. Sony proved they could handle Move titles along with serving their core audience. MS has failed to do so in the degree that Sony has and I'm that's not something I want to take a risk on.

Definitley this.^

[Two4DaMoney]

Getting screwed by MS. I have no doubt that Sony will continue with their main focus on core gamers and will continue to deliver with a steady stream of core exclusives. And its the core gamers that go out and buy consoles on launch day and stand in long lines waiting for the doors to open.

I agree. It's risky dealing with the casuals. Wii U is the perfect example that casuals change their minds really fast. The touch screen doesn't seem to grasp that same wii fit/wii sports audience that cause the Wii to take off in sales. Kinect sales have slowed down and that's in just 3 or 4 years. It's like MS is looking at kinect as being the reason it's a success or success as to why the 360 sold more than the ps3. I'm looking at Kinect being the reason that Sony didn't over take the 360 in sales while MS decided to get lazy with their exclusives. It was a market for kinect but I don't think that market is very big in a Wii-like manner.

I'm assuming you mean better-looking 3rd party games when you say "3rd party advantage"...I honestly don't think just the graphics will matter much. The reason why 360 sold more copies was because the console itself is better suited for mainstream American gamers and that's why FIFA sold more on the PS3 even though it was probably inferior too unless someone can correct me here...same with Tekken games or non-NA games that sold better on the PS3, mostly due to the fact that PS3 is more suited for Japanese and EU gamers...but EU is more of a tie there.

I agree with you there. I wasn't thinking about breaking it down in regions as you did. I was also talking about earlier this gen. They had exclusives and timed exclusives due to the ps3 being a pain in the ass to deal with. Mass Effect, Bio Shock, Left 4 Dead...those were huge back then;back when the ps3 had "ps3 has no games" following it around. They won't hold that advantage.

I also want to include the price advantage the 360 had over the ps3. MS cut into market and made their brand known but with the PS brand is still stronger. I'm basing that off of the ps3 costing more and moving more units outside of 2 years while they shared the market together. In 06'/07' and in 08'/09' was the only years that MS sold more than the ps3. This is why I don't understand why they are even risking giving up any advantages.

PS3
Hardware Sales   Ap-Jn    Jl-Sp    Oc-Dc    Ja-Mr     FY       LTD

FY 2006/07         -        -       1.7      1.8      3.5      3.5

FY 2007/08        0.7      1.3      4.9      2.2      9.1      12.6 

FY 2008/09        1.6      2.4      4.5      1.6      10.1     22.7 

FY 2009/10        1.1      3.2      6.5      2.2      13.0     35.7

FY 2010/11        2.4      3.5      6.3      2.1      14.3     50.0

FY 2011/12        1.8      3.7      6.5      1.9      13.9     63.9

FY 2012/13           6.1                                       70.0

MS

 FY          Jl-Sp    Oc-Dc    Ja-Mr    Ap-Jn     FY       LTD

2006/07        1.0      4.4      0.5      0.7      6.6      11.6    

2007/08        1.8      4.3      1.3      1.3      8.7      20.3    

2008/09        2.2      6.0      1.7      1.2      11.2     31.5     

2009/10        2.1      5.2      1.5      1.5      10.3     41.8

2010/11        2.8      6.3      2.7      1.7      13.7     55.3 

2011/12        2.3      8.2      1.4      1.1      13.0     68.3

2012/13        1.7      5.9       -        -       7.6      75.9

*And for the folks thinking I have some sort of agenda, I don't. I'm speculating purely off how this gen is ending and off the rumors as of late. Also off how Sony has handled the psvita.*

[ps3freak18]

Getting screwed by MS. I have no doubt that Sony will continue with their main focus on core gamers and will continue to deliver with a steady stream of core exclusives. And its the core gamers that go out and buy consoles on launch day and stand in long lines waiting for the doors to open.

Yeah mainly referring to MS. Sony tried for it to be an integral part and it never took off. So they adapted and basically used it for additional content and optional use instead ofpushing something that want working. MS had success and they went full throttle and have looked back. I believe this thinking is going to bite them in the ass.

[Lefein]

Another thing that could be forcing Sony to come out with a much less expensive PS4 is that it is very possible that the next XBox could be "cheap" and come loaded with a ton of optional subscription services. The idea being that you would spend 1-200 for the machine itself and contract IPTV as well as Live subscriptions.

That way, MS has a residual revenue stream off after the sale of the machine irrespective of game sales. The gamer was never MSes target audience with the XBox to begin with. MS simply saw Sony strap a games machine to a DVD player and trojan horse its way into over 150 million homes with the PS2.

What we are seeing is the end-game. The "always connected" user tracking device they have dreamed of for well over a decade. They don't want to be the next Playstation, they want to be the next Time Warner.


Ring any bells? Why else would a game console come with a standard 500GB HDD out of the box? It's not for just games. It's a DVR.

[FableMaster]

lol Can I use that last part in my sig?

haha. Sure.

Another thing that could be forcing Sony to come out with a much less expensive PS4 is that it is very possible that the next XBox could be "cheap" and come loaded with a ton of optional subscription services. The idea being that you would spend 1-200 for the machine itself and contract IPTV as well as Live subscriptions.

That way, MS has a residual revenue stream off after the sale of the machine irrespective of game sales. The gamer was never MSes target audience with the XBox to begin with. MS simply saw Sony strap a games machine to a DVD player and trojan horse its way into over 150 million homes with the PS2.

What we are seeing is the end-game. The "always connected" user tracking device they have dreamed of for well over a decade. They don't want to be the next Playstation, they want to be the next Time Warner.


Ring any bells? Why else would a game console come with a standard 500GB HDD out of the box? It's not for just games. It's a DVR.

this. I was saying people need to get over weaker spec of Xbox because Xbox is focusing something other than games. It will be something epic if Xbox can excute is correctly.

[Soldier 95B]

Dang, Durango is looking awesome as fuck, and so is Orbis. Gonna be an awesome gen! Can't wait to get both machines on day one.

[Lefein]

I think it will be even more awesome if Sony can put the Microsoft threat to bed once and for all by simply sticking to what the gamers want.

[radgamer420]

Another thing that could be forcing Sony to come out with a much less expensive PS4 is that it is very possible that the next XBox could be "cheap" and come loaded with a ton of optional subscription services. The idea being that you would spend 1-200 for the machine itself and contract IPTV as well as Live subscriptions. That way, MS has a residual revenue stream off after the sale of the machine irrespective of game sales. The gamer was never MSes target audience with the XBox to begin with. MS simply saw Sony strap a games machine to a DVD player and trojan horse its way into over 150 million homes with the PS2. What we are seeing is the end-game. The "always connected" user tracking device they have dreamed of for well over a decade. They don't want to be the next Playstation, they want to be the next Time Warner. Ring any bells? Why else would a game console come with a standard 500GB HDD out of the box? It's not for just games. It's a DVR.

That definitely makes sense. I never really thought about it that way but I can totally see that.

[MATRIX 2]

Another thing that could be forcing Sony to come out with a much less expensive PS4 is that it is very possible that the next XBox could be "cheap" and come loaded with a ton of optional subscription services. The idea being that you would spend 1-200 for the machine itself and contract IPTV as well as Live subscriptions.

That way, MS has a residual revenue stream off after the sale of the machine irrespective of game sales. The gamer was never MSes target audience with the XBox to begin with. MS simply saw Sony strap a games machine to a DVD player and trojan horse its way into over 150 million homes with the PS2.

What we are seeing is the end-game. The "always connected" user tracking device they have dreamed of for well over a decade. They don't want to be the next Playstation, they want to be the next Time Warner.


Ring any bells? Why else would a game console come with a standard 500GB HDD out of the box? It's not for just games. It's a DVR.

How much do you want to bet the ps4 will also have a 500GB hdd?

Hell there is a ps3 sku available today with a 500GB HDD. (360 never went past 320GB)

[Lefein]

From what I'm hearing, that's what the developers are being told the baseline model of the Durango will be.