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  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lefein View Post
    I can say, with all honesty, that last gen was their fair chance. Sony laid down and played dead while MS ran them over, yet they couldn't finish the job. Everyone, including the gaming press, has made excuses for them time and again for everything from RRoD to selling Bungie to Kinect. The whole "Let's treat MS with kiddy gloves because they're handicapped compared to Big Mean Sony" days are long over. At least for me. When they raised the Live fees to $60 a year and continued ramming ads down peoples throats, it was a sign. When their first party studios abandoned anything but Kinect titles, it raised the red alert. But when they say stuff like this:
    http://uk.gamespot.com/news/women-ar...signer-6406037
    everyone should be skeptical as hell.

    We played nice.. They showed their true colors. Now it's SSJ4 Lefein time.
    You can say with all HONESTY? Gave them a FAIR CHANCE? Played NICE did ya there Leffy? I've lurked here for years off and on. Couldn't bring myself to join because...frankly... this forum got kinda stale and boring the last few years IMHO.... ESPECIALLY this last year with hardly new interesting threads and some threads going days without a single new post. But I have seen your post record in that time.

    I'd describe you like a football fan that was dressed head to toe in the team colors. And those colors are Sony. And your support for Microsoft is the equivalent of a dime sized lapel pin. Except that's giving you too much credit. Because upon closer examination..... it's pin is bent, has deep scratches , is scuffed up and shows clear abuse to the point of almost being barely recognizable. And most of the times you do compliment them, it's usually sarcastic and backhanded.

    If you say the press was handling Microsoft with kid gloves, then you were handling Microsoft with UFC gloves.

    I'm cool with people having their preference and liking Sony. There is a lot there to like and I totally understand. But please..... let's not pretend you've given them any shred of a fair chance. I'd have a hell of a lot more respect for you if you said you hated Microsoft.... that would be refreshingly HONEST. Cuz otherwise.... your post history betrays you I'm afraid.


    As for Sony LAID DOWN and PLAYED DEAD? How so?

    Were they laying down and playing dead when they were getting exclusive in-house and award winning indie titles on PSN? How about when they made Home and kept adding to it? Or the fact they kept giving us new IPs, more 1st party devs and buying up more devs to become 1st party? Or that they saw the success Nintendo was having with the motion controller and decided to make a better one with Move? Or that they saw Xbox Live and improved their own PSN service? Or the fact they kept online gaming free and even offered PS+ with it's FREE games all the time? How about the price cuts and console bundles?

    And the list goes on.......

    That's the Sony that laid down and died? Sounds more like a lot of standing up, living and fighting hard to me. Stop throwing the victim card around when it comes to Sony. ESPECIALLY when they did sooooooo much RIGHT and had a 100+ million PS2 fanbase that was ripe for the re-picking that Microsoft couldn't count on from the first Xbox.

    As I said in other threads....I think most of the fault for the PS3's position in relation to the Xbox 360 has little to do with Sony. Cuz other than a mistake here and there, Sony was doing everything right and giving us the goods....reliable hardware, a next-gen disc format and games, games, games!

    I think it has more to do with what Microsoft did RIGHT and what I call the mysterious brand "fickle" factor. That NOT SO EXPLAINABLE trend of people drifting away from a long established and respected brand for no obvious reason. Kinda like great civilizations rising and falling....with the next one or ONES taking it's place.

    I think now that Sony is shedding or refocusing their other products, in addition to making an easy to program PS4.....I see Sony on the rise. Do I think they will attain their former dominant status? Nope.... not likely with the increased competition and their much reduced financials. But I think they will thrive as a leaner and meaner company.
    Last edited by GreatSpaceKoaster; 03-29-2013 at 22:37.

  2. #52
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    My FPSes and MMORPGs as well as most of my indie gaming is done on an MS system, though. So, I can't really HATE them


    lol!
    Who would have thought building a solid product that serves your customer's needs would beat out money, marketing, hype, and greed.

  3. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lefein View Post
    PS4 has come out all guns blazing. Sony has been dominating the news from GDC as well. MS being quiet is, as you WELL know, simply not in their DNA

    Time will tell. Every day that MS stays silent about the 720 makes it really look like they just aren't prepared to take Sony on this holiday season.. That or they are playing a completely different ballgame altogether.. as in.. not competing with Sony at all.
    Really...

    Sony announced the cell processor in February of 2005. I can never forget the endless talk of how great the cell was going to be on this forum; dawn of a new age type ****. Never happened...

    MS did nothing.

    MS announced the xbox 360 months later on May 12, 2005, days before E3. Sony officially announces the PS3 at E3.

    To me it looks like this year is mirroring 2005.

    So I ask.

    What's with the selective memory?

  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lefein View Post
    My FPSes and MMORPGs as well as most of my indie gaming is done on an MS system, though. So, I can't really HATE them


    lol!
    You can still hate them and own their products. You own it BY DEFAULT cuz you basically have to... not for any love you have for them. Cuz if ALL those games and programs you like on Windows were on Linux, Windows would be wiped off that hard drive so fast it would make heads spin. You MIGHT keep it around if your work FORCED you to need to have it around. But let their be no doubt... you would be 100% Linux if it had the same level of software support that Windows has.

    Other than maybe Valve... what MAJOR gaming dev release their big titles on Linux? Pretty much NONE. Mostly indie titles. Hence why you MUST begrudgingly keep Windows around so you don't miss out on all those games.

  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by TrUe GaMeR View Post
    Really...

    Sony announced the cell processor in February of 2005. I can never forget the endless talk of how great the cell was going to be on this forum; dawn of a new age type ****. Never happened...

    MS did nothing.

    MS announced the xbox 360 months later on May 12, 2005, days before E3. Sony officially announces the PS3 at E3.

    To me it looks like this year is mirroring 2005.

    So I ask.

    What's with the selective memory?
    Easy questions.

    1. Cell, BluRay and the PS3 have been under-utilized this whole generation due to the Xbox 360. I don't fault MS for that, they merely did what they do best. Before we get into the "superior multiplats argument" there have been many instances like Arkham Asylum, FFXIII and even Bioshock Infinite that simply run better on PS3. With games like Uncharted, God of War and Heavy Rain clearly leading the pack in graphics this gen... What is there to back pedal from?

    2. This time around, Sony hasn't announced a single component early, they showed off the baseline architecture and running games. Something Sony didn't really do in earnest back at E3 2005. (Oh, dat Killzone movie..) ..Not so much a movie now, is it?

    3. Developers coming out of the woodwork immediately for the PS4. Back in '05, we had the typical spreadsheet display of company monikers and publishers, but the indie/small firms were nowhere to be seen. The reason being, they were just as baffled by Cell as we were. Sony and Kuturagi were sitting high in their thrones laughing at all the peasants who were going to line up for their PS3s no matter what and it was a gamble that failed. MS was the early bird, not just in launching the harware, but in securing relationships with developers and publishers.

    To me, that's the biggest difference between 2005 and 2013. Now it is MS that is hiding away in their castle in the sky planning global domination while Sony is on the ground running at events like GDC. A lot of developers have openly admitted to either being turned off by MS recently or having no open communication with them. So, I gotta say, for having an eye to detail you sure missed that one. MS is taking a page right out of the Kuturagi/PS3 playbook.

    4. This, personally, is the biggest one. Three may have been the deal maker, but this is the deal breaker for MS and a huge reason why 2013 isn't even in the same galaxy as 2005 for MS. In 2005, the goodwill was built up and palpable. They just overcame the GCNs total sales and were in this for a fresh start. The industry itself was in a completely different condition than it is today. A whole lot of developers and publishers were prepared to ween themselves off the Playstation teet. Their business was healthy, the economy was rocky but in good stead and the gamers were ready for something different.

    With the Wiiu tanking faster than the Titanic and a whole lot of gamers holding nostalgia for brighter days past. MS has a track record of letting people down, not "championing the new gaming generation" like we were promised since the first XBox that they would do. They're not "the new guy" in school anymore. He's now that kid that came over to your house and scratched a game or made you wait 6 weeks to play that new game you just bought. He got in a fight with the most popular kid in school (Bungie) and then one day started acting all weird and flailing his arms around like a crackhead..

    So, yeah.. I don't think my memory is selective much. Sony learned some hard lessons and has acted on each and every one of them. For us Sony guys, 2013 is looking like the opposite of 2005. No one is crying "Teh prerendered video hype".. No one is is calling the PS4 "Emotion Engine 2.0". or any of that..

    But even worse for you guys.. No one is saying on any board anywhere (I know, because I am present on many boards) "Dude, just wait til MS shows off Halo 5 and it is over man!" No one is saying that the next Elder Scrolls is going to be a major system seller, either. No one is even speculating what "KILLER APP" Live is going to have that puts MS head and shoulders beyond PSN. People just aren't talking about that stuff. And THAT is truly NOTHING like 2005, my bro.

    #ThankyouBasedKaz #ThankyouBasedCerny #SDC
    Who would have thought building a solid product that serves your customer's needs would beat out money, marketing, hype, and greed.

  6. #56
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    Who cares about about cell and jaguar stuff. If the PS4 is supporting games like what we seen so far, that is good enough for me to buy it.

    It's going to be sweet...

    She put the lime in the coconut, she drank them both up.

    http://youtu.be/5LxC3M-Yngs

  7. Likes Lefein wishes they had posted this first.
  8. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coconut_Crunch View Post
    Who cares about about cell and jaguar stuff. If the PS4 is supporting games like what we seen so far, that is good enough for me to buy it.

    It's going to be sweet...
    Yes indeed!

  9. #58
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    They might know final. Specs but they cant say anything

  10. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by coolguy View Post
    They might know final. Specs but they cant say anything
    Chuck norris knows the final hardware...as he's part of it. Ps4 has the chuck norris gpu.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Coconut_Crunch View Post
    Who cares about about cell and jaguar stuff. If the PS4 is supporting games like what we seen so far, that is good enough for me to buy it.

    It's going to be sweet...

    CPU is definitely not a priority for video games. Sony lied to us.

  12. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by jj03 View Post
    Chuck norris knows the final hardware...as he's part of it. Ps4 has the chuck norris gpu.
    Chuck Norris himself, is actually a holographic render of Chuck Norris running on a Chunk Norris built CPU/GPU.

    Chuck himself projects the image as the real world can no longer handle how awesome he is.

    He keeps himself locked away in a bunker, giving the access code only to the president of the United States, in case the world needs him. Many mistakenly believe the "football" codes the president carries with him are nuclear arming codes.

    This is incorrect.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lefein View Post
    I still hold that they are having to go back to the drawing board about something. Perhaps after seeing the WiiU flop, they are second guessing betting the farm on Kinect? I don't know. It's just awfully, incredibly strange to see a console manufacturer not hold a timeline leading up to a hardware launch. If there hasn't been some radical redesign, then there had to be some kind of minor change that is pushing them back.

    PS4 has come out all guns blazing. Sony has been dominating the news from GDC as well. MS being quiet is, as you WELL know, simply not in their DNA. A lot of people are saying "OMG, teh hidden nukes" but that is simply not how they operate. It makes me wonder if there was some validity to the stories about Sony changing their specs up right before the Playstation Meeting.. Did MS actually try to telegraph Sony's punch and prepare for a low-ball system?

    Time will tell. Every day that MS stays silent about the 720 makes it really look like they just aren't prepared to take Sony on this holiday season.. That or they are playing a completely different ballgame altogether.. as in.. not competing with Sony at all.
    Rein on MS's silence at GDC

    Rein said that assumptions Microsoft didn't have a private presence at the conference "isn't true," and that on the public side it's simply a case of one platform holder having announced their new console and the other not.

    "I think that's more perception than reality," Rein said of Microsoft's suggested absence from GDC.

    "Microsoft has always been very developer centric with all of their platforms and that Sony is embracing that approach is wonderful. But I don't think it diminishes what Microsoft is doing.

    "I don't think with developer relations anyone is trying to be public, it's just you're at GDC and Sony has the hardware to talk about, and Microsoft hasn't talked about it publicly yet. So I think it's just the difference between someone who can say the name of their console and someone who can't."
    http://www.computerandvideogames.com...ays-epic-exec/
    Last edited by mynd; 03-30-2013 at 03:45.
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  13. #62
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    Chuck Norris actually sucks thats why Chuck Norris Memes exist.
    This is a local shop for local people you have no business here!

  14. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by keefy View Post
    Chuck Norris actually sucks thats why Chuck Norris Memes exist.
    Blasphemy! ....blasphemy I tell ya!

    BTW..... Chuck just recently shaved off his beard.


    EDIT: Fixed
    Last edited by GreatSpaceKoaster; 03-30-2013 at 09:09.

  15. #64
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    He shaved his beard...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vulgotha View Post
    He shaved his beard...
    He doesn't shave, he just threatens his facial hair.
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  17. Likes Ixion , Coconut_Crunch, Vulgotha wishes they had posted this first.
  18. #66
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    Chuck and his beard are actually two seperate entitys. His beard attacks first...thats why he hasn`t got it now. It has been dispatched on a mission.

    Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk HD

  19. Likes PS4freak , mynd wishes they had posted this first.
  20. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by GreatSpaceKoaster View Post
    You can say with all HONESTY? Gave them a FAIR CHANCE? Played NICE did ya there Leffy? I've lurked here for years off and on
    There's a surprise

    I'd describe you like a football fan that was dressed head to toe in the team colors. And those colors are Sony. And your support for Microsoft is the equivalent of a dime sized lapel pin. Except that's giving you too much credit. Because upon closer examination..... it's pin is bent, has deep scratches , is scuffed up and shows clear abuse to the point of almost being barely recognizable. And most of the times you do compliment them, it's usually sarcastic and backhanded.
    Switch the words Microsoft and Sony around you have just described yourself. Exquisitely. Good job

    I'd have a hell of a lot more respect for you if you said you hated Microsoft.... that would be refreshingly HONEST. Cuz otherwise.... your post history betrays you I'm afraid.
    And again

    And the list goes on.......
    Sure does

    Quote Originally Posted by GreatSpaceKoaster View Post
    You can still hate them and own their products. You own it BY DEFAULT cuz you basically have to... not for any love you have for them. Cuz if ALL those games and programs you like on Windows were on Linux blah blah
    Same way you utterly despise Sony, sling fist fulls of mud at them any chance you get and still own some of their products, right? Right.

  21. #68
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    Because to be a true warrior, you have to know your enemy well.

    I like those reviews when a member buys the competitor's console and then posts a review about it with basically a "meh" lol. Alright, I mean, you knew how it was, then you bought it lol now stop crying.

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    we do not know the spec's and also not every spec will be revealed


  23. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vulgotha View Post
    -shrugs- the rumors were 95% accurate on the PS4. And the same rumor(s) concerning Durango have been vetted by multiple individuals including the guys over at DF and B3D.

    That's good enough for me to operate off of. Until proven wrong I will accept what they have to say on the matter. I don't have a vested interest in the Durango being weaker than Orbis, if anything two consoles with closer specs would be better for everybody.

    And if you knew anything about the topic, you wouldn't be saying that what Sony did with the PS4 was a "major revision". It really wasn't. Just a pretty surprising and expensive one.

    So for you to call me out and declare that I'm full of it for saying that MS couldn't drastically change their specs- that's pretty damn telling in my book. You go ahead and maintain hope that they will swap out CPU\GPU or switch RAM types, I'd rather stay rooted in reality.

    I would be pleasantly surprised if the Durango was revealed in a month and it was as powerful as PS4 and that the rumors surrounding it are bogus. But MS doesn't seem to have their focus on that objective, they seemingly have a different strategy. They are putting alot of emphasis on Kinect and seem to be convinced that the appropriate tactic for nextgen is to really push it.

    And that's fine. I would be impressed if Kinect 2.0 could really enhance the core gamer (with a controller) experience. I'm skeptical, and I'd rather have the resources allotted to it (and budget) sunk back into the silicon of the machine, but who knows.
    The title of this thread pretty well sums it up.

  24. #71
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    Lol no probably not there skipper. The rumors predicted the Sony announced 1.84 TF GPU, the 8 core Jaguar CPU, that it would use GDDR5 memory, and so on.

    Now, Sony can tweak clocks a tiny bit and rearrange some small stuff. But nothing massive, it's more or less locked in now.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vulgotha View Post
    Lol no probably not there skipper. The rumors predicted the Sony announced 1.84 TF GPU, the 8 core Jaguar CPU, that it would use GDDR5 memory, and so on. Now, Sony can tweak clocks a tiny bit and rearrange some small stuff. But nothing massive, it's more or less locked in now.
    Skipper? lol Anyway guess we'll find out in May.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vulgotha View Post
    Lol no probably not there skipper. The rumors predicted the Sony announced 1.84 TF GPU, the 8 core Jaguar CPU, that it would use GDDR5 memory, and so on.

    Now, Sony can tweak clocks a tiny bit and rearrange some small stuff. But nothing massive, it's more or less locked in now.
    Except its not. Cerny has said they are still massively messing with the buss and cache to try and emulate SPU's. i may be reading more into it, but i don't think the word trying should be there.

    “We’re trying to replicate the SPU Runtime System (SPURS) of the PS3 by heavily customising the cache and bus,” he said. ”SPURS is designed to virtualise and independently manage SPU resources. For the PS4 hardware, the GPU can also be used in an analogous manner as x86-64 to use resources at various levels.

    “This idea has 8 pipes and each pipe(?) has 8 computation queues. Each queue can execute things such as physics computation middle ware, and other proprietorially designed workflows. This, while simultaneously handling graphics processing.”
    Which is where the 4 cu obviously come into it.
    Last edited by mynd; 03-31-2013 at 00:04.
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  27. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by mynd View Post
    Except its not. Cerny has said they are still massively messing with the buss and cache to try and emulate SPU's. i may be reading more into it, but i don't think the word trying should be there.



    Which is where the 4 cu obviously come into it.

    I think this has to do with something about the PS4's 8 ACE (Asynchronous Compute Engines) units or something doesn't it?

    Further, the 14+4 split is in contention. Some information coming to light has not supported that division (whatever the actual division is) and claimed it is simply 18 CU's. While others, obviously the one you're referring to (older rumors) state that there is in fact a 14+4 situation.

    Regardless, I'm still unsure about the impact scope of these kinds of changes. They're targeting a 2013 holiday launch, they can't do too much without delaying it.
    Last edited by Vulgotha; 03-31-2013 at 00:10.
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    All 18 CUs are fully functional. Pic not related
    Who would have thought building a solid product that serves your customer's needs would beat out money, marketing, hype, and greed.

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