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  1. #1
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    Pre-owned block will kill the Xbox retail warns

    Retailers rally against anti-pre-owned rumours as next-gen Xbox rumours heat up.



    Retailers have warned that introducing a block on pre-owned software in the next-generation Xbox will "kill" the console if Sony continues to support used software with PlayStation 4.


    Speaking to MCV, numerous retail execs offered their thoughts on the rumours that Microsoft's next Xbox will block playback of pre-owned software and require an always-online internet connection, with Steven Doyle, manager of Games Dojo saying:


    "It all depends on what the PS4 does. If Xbox doesn't allow pre-owned and the PS4 does - it will kill the Xbox."


    Robert Lindsay, managing director of indie retailer Games Centre added: "If Microsoft incorporates the tech to lock out pre-owned games and Sony doesn't then there is going to be only one winner in the next generation of consoles - and it won't be Microsoft."


    Numerous other shop owners aren't happy with the rumours either, with Excite Games owner Paul Whitfield saying "blocking pre-owned would be a bad thing," and Don McCabe, joint MD of Chips adding, "block second-hand and force a constant connection and the market will shrink rapidly, but Microsoft will still make a profit.


    "As for the rest of us, tough titty."


    Lindsay adds that he's "optimistic that the rumours will remain just that," however, "and Microsoft and Sony will make the right decision for the industry".


    Microsoft has yet to announce its next-generation Xbox or comment on rumours that it intends to block pre-owned software and require an always-on internet connection for its next console.
    Comments from a creative director at Microsoft Studios last night, however, suggest that the latter could be true.


    Sony has yet to commit to a stance on pre-owned software on PlayStation 4, either, but inspired confidence during the console's announcement when it told CVG that it will "do the right thing" and that it is "mindful of what the game development community wants".


    Microsoft is expected to announce its next Xbox within the next few weeks.



    http://www.videogamer.com/news/pre-owned_block_will_kill_the_xbox_retail_warns.html
    Last edited by Ghost; 04-06-2013 at 00:25.

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    They could be right and they could be wrong. People said the RROD fiasco would sink Microsoft and the Xbox 360......it never happened. Sales kept chugging along.

    I also think a lot of these retailers who sell used games have a vested interest in saying this. Considering they give you next to nothing for trade-ins and turn around and sell them at a very sizable profit without giving devs a dime. Wait until digital downloads become the norm...... these retailers are screwed. Especially the likes of Gamestop.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GreatSpaceKoaster View Post
    They could be right and they could be wrong. People said the RROD fiasco would sink Microsoft and the Xbox 360......it never happened. Sales kept chugging along.

    I also think a lot of these retailers who sell used games have a vested interest in saying this. Considering they give you next to nothing for trade-ins and turn around and sell them at a very sizable profit without giving devs a dime. Wait until digital downloads become the norm...... these retailers are screwed. Especially the likes of Gamestop.
    So would you rather always buy new games or would you rather also have the option of maybe buying used games sometimes?

    Not sure why you would compare this to RROD.

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    I think that being always online will sink any console that adopts it. In fact, I'd bet good money that if all three consoles used always online that handhelds would take over almost all of gaming. It would shrink the overall console business so much that developers and publishers would abandon ship and it would become a dead business model.

    I think these people would do well to remember that they can be replaced. If they blur the lines between PC and console to that much of a degree, people will choose the platform they can upgrade at their own convenience and connect controllers and HDMI cables to all the same.... and have infinite backwards compatibility as a bonus. Meanwhile, you can never really architect an always online handheld as it would defeat the designed purpose for the machine and murder its sales as well. Gaming would go there.

    What will ultimately happen is, publishers are going to have to choose whether they want to protect themselves from thieves or simply not be able to sell their games to an ever shrinking population.
    Last edited by Lefein; 04-06-2013 at 10:45.
    Who would have thought building a solid product that serves your customer's needs would beat out money, marketing, hype, and greed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lefein View Post
    I think that being always online will sink any console that adopts it. In fact, I'd bet good money that if all three consoles used always online that handhelds would take over almost all of gaming. It would shrink the overall console business so much that developers and publishers would abandon ship and it would become a dead business model.

    I think these people would do well to remember that they can be replaced. If they blur the lines between PC and console to that much of a degree, people will choose the platform they can upgrade at their own convenience and connect controllers and HDMI cables to all the same.... and have infinite backwards compatibility as a bonus. Meanwhile, you can never really architect an always online handheld as it would defeat the designed purpose for the machine and murder its sales as well. Gaming would go there.

    What will ultimately happen is, publishers are going to have to choose whether they want to protect themselves from thieves or simply not be able to sell their games to an ever shrinking population.

    haha you think !! i'll even buy the Champagne so MS can smash across it's Bow as it goes down & point at my PC & Laugh at them for basically committing Console Suicide if they really go that route :P Honestly can not see MS alienating such a a Market where even unlimited download Connections is still a Luxury in today society The US especially.

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    Meanwhile Gamestop has been talking to MS extensivley and seems excited.

    Go figure.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mynd View Post
    Meanwhile Gamestop has been talking to MS extensivley and seems excited.

    Go figure.
    Sssshhhhhh just play along just now....Da Xbox is DoooOOOOOOmed

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    Quote Originally Posted by Flaw3d Genius View Post
    Sssshhhhhh just play along just now....Da Xbox is DoooOOOOOOmed
    What if Gamespot had plans for a digital distribution store of its own? Gamespot is a big fish in gaming, after all. What you guys should be paying attention to is the reaction from the little guy.. Because that is what you are. You are the littlest guy of them all, the consumer.
    Who would have thought building a solid product that serves your customer's needs would beat out money, marketing, hype, and greed.

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    Microsoft and maybe Sony too will have deals in place with the big retailers like Gamestop. Pre-owned games will be blocked on the system by default, but Gamestop will sell codes from the publisher to make them work. Just an evolution of the online codes of this gen.

    Smaller retailers who's sole business is used games could be left out in the cold to die.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cyn View Post
    Microsoft and maybe Sony too will have deals in place with the big retailers like Gamestop. Pre-owned games will be blocked on the system by default, but Gamestop will sell codes from the publisher to make them work. Just an evolution of the online codes of this gen.

    Smaller retailers who's sole business is used games could be left out in the cold to die.
    And the countries who don't have gamestop
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lefein View Post
    What if Gamespot had plans for a digital distribution store of its own? Gamespot is a big fish in gaming, after all. What you guys should be paying attention to is the reaction from the little guy.. Because that is what you are. You are the littlest guy of them all, the consumer.
    The little guy wonders where we jumped from:

    -Always online (confirmed for PS4, rumored for 720)
    ->Must have internet to play (rumored for 720)
    ->Stop pre-owened games being played (not rumored form any source for any one in the past year).
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    Quote Originally Posted by mynd View Post
    The little guy wonders where we jumped from:

    -Always online (confirmed for PS4, rumored for 720)
    ->Must have internet to play (rumored for 720)
    ->Stop pre-owened games being played (not rumored form any source for any one in the past year).
    I'm pretty sure Sony stated that you don't have to be connected but its something they encourage.
    It's funny that in this day in age people can steal as long as they have a reason too. Even if that reason is created by the thieves themselves.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mynd View Post
    Meanwhile Gamestop has been talking to MS extensivley and seems excited.

    Go figure.
    I remember some programmers were "excited" and "looking forward to" working with the ps3 at the beginning of this gen, lol..



    We wont know till ms announces for sure, but damn thats takes some balls if true.

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    PRe owned block will hurt only pre owned sellers and I do not mean you or I, I men the big stores that sell our games double what they gave us.

    This is a local shop for local people you have no business here!

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    You do not have to be always oneline for the PS4. Just if you want to play the PSN games you got on your PS3 since the PS4 will not be backwards compatible and you'll be running off their machines somewhere in the cloud.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mynd View Post
    Uh? If your system is on, and you have it connected to the internet, it is always online.
    The only way on the PS4 not to have it always online would be to unplug the internet connection.

    Always online doesn't mean YOU HAVE TO BE CONNECTED TO THE INTERNET to use it. It just means if you have your console hooked up, it's always connected.

    Why the heck do you think it has a low power mode, and a background chip to download your stuff so that when you turn it on all you new updates are just there?

    The PS4 is an always online console.



    No one has every said always online is a requirement to play games on the PS4.
    But the console is always online, because it never turns off, and if it never turns off, is plugged into the net,and we know it goes out and does you background updates..guess what....you are always online.

    This aint that hard to figure out people, jesus.
    Wait, it never turns off? Are you talking about when it's suspended? I assure you that it will be possible to turn it off. There will either be a switch that you can use or a plug you can pull. Also keep in no d the desire for more green electronics. Example: my blu ray player can turn on REAL fast or you can turn off the setting and it will take longer to boot up because it isn't running as many processes in the background. In other words, it has its own sort of limited suspension mode that you can use or you can turn it of and it will only keep on its IR reader like normal older electronics. I wouldn't be at all surprised if the PS4 can do this. I would use that feature as it saves electricity (greener). With my BR player, we don't even use it every day, I don't know why I would even need that feature.
    Quote Originally Posted by Serinous View Post
    So would you rather always buy new games or would you rather also have the option of maybe buying used games sometimes?

    Not sure why you would compare this to RROD.
    If you can't play used the. The value of new will be lower to gamers. Devs are not going to be happy with initial sell through.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Typical guy View Post

    If you can't play used the. The value of new will be lower to gamers. Devs are not going to be happy with initial sell through.
    Actually I don't think it's about initial sales. The same people who would buy used price would probably wait to buy the game when its new price dropped to at least equivalent to a used game, if buying used game is not an option. Either way the devs arn't getting the initial sales.

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    Decent article, I'm gonna have to agree having worked in games retail for 2 years.

    I ready have dozens of customers who currently have a 360 and talk about buying a Ps4. Rumours or not, Sony seems to be cutting the bs


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    Quote Originally Posted by Serinous View Post
    Actually I don't think it's about initial sales. The same people who would buy used price would probably wait to buy the game when its new price dropped to at least equivalent to a used game, if buying used game is not an option. Either way the devs arn't getting the initial sales.
    I agree used buyers would wait for the new prices to depreciate. The ppl that buy on release day may not be doing so though. A lot of people buy a game for $60 then blow through it in a week or two then dump it on ebay and get 45-50 back or they'll trade it into GameStop while that value is high. I think initial sales will fall off a cliff except for multiplayer games like COD that people keep but that's only a very small number of games.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Typical guy View Post
    I agree used buyers would wait for the new prices to depreciate. The ppl that buy on release day may not be doing so though. A lot of people buy a game for $60 then blow through it in a week or two then dump it on ebay and get 45-50 back or they'll trade it into GameStop while that value is high. I think initial sales will fall off a cliff except for multiplayer games like COD that people keep but that's only a very small number of games.
    So you're saying that the population of people who buy games on day 1 with the intention of possibly reselling it soon after purchasing while the value is still high, may be turned off by this? thus making them less likely to buy day 1 since there's no value buying the game on day 1 anymore. yes it's possible and makes sense. However, do we know how many people actually do that? what is the volume of resold games? It would be nice to see the numbers, comparing volume of first-hand buyers vs. used buyers.

    one way I can see them doing it without too much damage. If they want to block used game, then make price of new games less. like perhaps $40. this way i think there's a break-eveb point.

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    I think that's a fair point. There will certainly be a drop in sales because a portion of game buyers (not a large portion but significant enough to notice) do indeed buy games and trade them back in the same week. Plenty of my mates used to do it.

    I remember back in the day when GAME were less business savvy, you could get a full refund if you took it back less than a week later and you could just keep doing it for months.

    Although anyone who thinks game prices will drop if used games are blocked isn't living in the real world.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cyn View Post

    Although anyone who thinks game prices will drop if used games are blocked isn't living in the real world.
    I know it's probably not going to happen. But I'm saying that it would be a break-even point if they do it.

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    All this negativity cannot be good for MS. They could blow it out the water with the reveal. I'm just not all for this silence. It doesn't install confidence for me. Just have to wait and see.




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    This isn't even a rumor...next.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cyn View Post
    I think that's a fair point. There will certainly be a drop in sales because a portion of game buyers (not a large portion but significant enough to notice) do indeed buy games and trade them back in the same week. Plenty of my mates used to do it.

    I remember back in the day when GAME were less business savvy, you could get a full refund if you took it back less than a week later and you could just keep doing it for months.

    Although anyone who thinks game prices will drop if used games are blocked isn't living in the real world.
    Exactly. I by no means am saying these groups of people represent the majority of gamers but when you put together all the disenfranchised people of always online + no used games you will see some developers unhappy with MS. It will have a **** install base compared to the PS4 and we'd probably see developers abandoning the platform. I know the guy that said this stuff is the creative head so its probably planned but all this negative publicity and feedback has to be making an impact on them in the boardroom.

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