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View Poll Results: Will Zimmerman get off the 2nd degree murder charge?

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  1. #276
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    Quote Originally Posted by forrma View Post
    @sufi, @fear. I can entertain that assuming race would be premature during the time the events happened. however, the events that unfolded afterwards had EVERYTHING to do with race. the chief of police. Lee, in an interview with CNN said that there was EXTREME pressure to make an arrest, regardless of if it stuck or not.
    that's true, everything turned into a race issue afterwards.

    Quote Originally Posted by F34R View Post
    Is that for you personally?



    I agree with ya. The race issue was the only reason charges were filed.
    so if it was a black person who had killed the kid, the parents would not have charged the shooter? people made it into a race thing, the parents don't give a shit. their kid is still dead.
    Quote Originally Posted by F34R View Post
    He didn't shoot Martin while Martin was walking home with a pack of skittles. He didn't do anything wrong that deserved for him to be attacked by Martin.
    you don't know if he did anything wrong or not. you're going by what he's telling you. even if zimmerman won the case, it still wouldn't prove that. only zimmerman knows that and shit, i can argue even he doesn't...perception is a bitch.

  2. #277
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    The parents didn't charge Zimmerman, the State did. The only reason they did was because the race card was being played by the media and public.

    You're right, I don't know. I should have worded that better. There isn't any evidence that shows Martin had the right to attack Zimmerman. That's the the justice system... Zimmerman doesn't have to prove anything. The prosecution has to prove Zimmerman did what they are charging him for. They don't have a single piece of anything except conjecture and circumstantial evidence trying to convince the jury that he killed Martin w/o the need to do so.




  3. #278
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    I'm confused here. Are we playing with semantics? Are you saying that the parents weren't going to prosecute him?

  4. #279
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sufi View Post
    I'm confused here. Are we playing with semantics? Are you saying that the parents weren't going to prosecute him?
    The parents can file the complaint, but they don't get to charge Zimmerman with Murder 2. Ya know, the police already had all the info for more than a month, and no charges were filed because they didn't have a case. Charges were file when race was played from the public and media.




  5. #280
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    Quote Originally Posted by F34R View Post
    How do you know he did?

    There's a huge percent of things called into 911 that doesn't necessarily need 911 services, but the calls are still made. I seriously doubt manslaughter will be done either. There's just too much evidence that backs up his claim of self defense. Actual, solid, real life evidence.

    If there was a way for the prosecution to prove that he shot Martin without an actual threat to his own life, and he just freaked out and shot him when Martin got aggressive, then I'd agree that manslaughter would be plausible. However, it doesn't go that way. There isn't anything actually past circumstantial that the prosecution has on its plate.
    The thing is that you are going by his word only. There are inconsistencies in his version of what happened. He is on trial for reason. Initially, they had enough evidence for a manslaughter charge. There is also real solid evidence that he has told some lies. For instance he said martin put his hand over his mouth to stop him from screaming for help, but there was no blood on martin hands. He also said martin went for and actually touched his gun but only his dna was found on the gun. When he was first question about the screaming he said it didn't sound him. He also said after he shot him he straddled him and spread out his arms but that was proven false because martin's arms were underneath him. Those and even more inconsistencies are the reason why he is on trial now. The cops are the one's who didn't believe his story. I'm not saying what will happen but don't forget that the jury is all female. That makes a difference.

  6. #281
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    but there is more to it right? If i recall correctly, it was either that they didn't question him or they didn't arrest him to interrogate even. in fact, they left the gun there too, did not investigate at all.

    it was then the case started to get more into the public and people started to pressure why there were so many inconsistencies.

    @sub. I don't believe for one second that the kid wanted to touch his gun and stupidly threatened that he was going to kill him that night. bull fucking shit. if he was much older, bigger and a thug, then i would have no problem believing it. a kid that wanted to run away from him at first, just makes no sense why he would become a killer all of a sudden.
    Last edited by Sufi; 07-12-2013 at 03:37.

  7. #282
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  8. Dislikes Sufi is confounded by the utter nonsense of this most disagreeable post
  9. #283
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sub-stance1 View Post
    The thing is that you are going by his word only. There are inconsistencies in his version of what happened. He is on trial for reason. Initially, they had enough evidence for a manslaughter charge. There is also real solid evidence that he has told some lies. For instance he said martin put his hand over his mouth to stop him from screaming for help, but there was no blood on martin hands. He also said martin went for and actually touched his gun but only his dna was found on the gun. When he was first question about the screaming he said it didn't sound him. He also said after he shot him he straddled him and spread out his arms but that was proven false because martin's arms were underneath him. Those and even more inconsistencies are the reason why he is on trial now. The cops are the one's who didn't believe his story. I'm not saying what will happen but don't forget that the jury is all female. That makes a difference.
    Hand over mouth doesn't REQUIRE blood to be there to prove it. Grabbing a gun does NOT transfer DNA automatically lol. As far as the arms theory goes... a witness testified that Martin could have pulled his arms in, because he didn't die immediately. So, again, conjecture.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sufi View Post
    but there is more to it right? If i recall correctly, it was either that they didn't question him or they didn't arrest him to interrogate even. in fact, they left the gun there too, did not investigate at all.

    it was then the case started to get more into the public and people started to pressure why there were so many inconsistencies.

    @sub. I don't believe for one second that the kid wanted to touch his gun and stupidly threatened that he was going to kill him that night. bull fucking shit. if he was much older, bigger and a thug, then i would have no problem believing it. a kid that wanted to run away from him at first, just makes no sense why he would become a killer all of a sudden.
    The did an investigation.. it doesn't require an arrest, or confiscate all the items, etc. If he tells the story, and everything lines up with it, then they can't just arrest someone just because.




  10. #284
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    Quote Originally Posted by F34R View Post
    Hand over mouth doesn't REQUIRE blood to be there to prove it. Grabbing a gun does NOT transfer DNA automatically lol. As far as the arms theory goes... a witness testified that Martin could have pulled his arms in, because he didn't die immediately. So, again, conjecture.

    The did an investigation.. it doesn't require an arrest, or confiscate all the items, etc. If he tells the story, and everything lines up with it, then they can't just arrest someone just because.
    Fear, there is no way possible for someone to put there hand on someones bloody face and find no trace of blood on the hand. Even though it was raining, you still would find traces of blood and would be able to determine who it came from. The first investigator is the one who wanted him charged with manslaughter because there were inconsistencies with his story. His story didn't line up. The state upgraded the charge to 2nd degree murder. Once they looked deeper they found that he lied about some things. The story just didn't add up. Like I said before if he gets convicted it will mostly because of his own mistakes.

  11. #285
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sub-stance1 View Post
    Fear, there is no way possible for someone to put there hand on someones bloody face and find no trace of blood on the hand. Even though it was raining, you still would find traces of blood and would be able to determine who it came from. The first investigator is the one who wanted him charged with manslaughter because there were inconsistencies with his story. His story didn't line up. The state upgraded the charge to 2nd degree murder. Once they looked deeper they found that he lied about some things. The story just didn't add up. Like I said before if he gets convicted it will mostly because of his own mistakes.
    Sorry. Being in law enforcement for almost two decades, I've seen plenty of things that you think aren't possible.

    Things that are said under stress compared to the same story told after the effects of the event pass, are normal.




  12. #286
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    Quote Originally Posted by F34R View Post
    Hand over mouth doesn't REQUIRE blood to be there to prove it. Grabbing a gun does NOT transfer DNA automatically lol. As far as the arms theory goes... a witness testified that Martin could have pulled his arms in, because he didn't die immediately. So, again, conjecture.

    The did an investigation.. it doesn't require an arrest, or confiscate all the items, etc. If he tells the story, and everything lines up with it, then they can't just arrest someone just because.
    who's saying all items? i'm just saying, the item that "killed" the person. they left it there.

  13. #287
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sufi View Post
    who's saying all items? i'm just saying, the item that "killed" the person. they left it there.
    sorry, that was a typo. "any of"




  14. #288
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    that still doesn't change the point. why did they leave the weapon there?

  15. #289
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    Unless I'm mistaken, they took the gun when they took him, and returned it to him.




  16. #290
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    Quote Originally Posted by F34R View Post
    Is that for you personally?



    I agree with ya. The race issue was the only reason charges were filed.
    The race issue is the only reason it took so long for charges to be filed.

  17. #291
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    Quote Originally Posted by skyballin View Post
    The race issue is the only reason it took so long for charges to be filed.
    The race issue is the only reason charges were filed.




  18. #292
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    Quote Originally Posted by F34R View Post
    Sorry. Being in law enforcement for almost two decades, I've seen plenty of things that you think aren't possible.

    Things that are said under stress compared to the same story told after the effects of the event pass, are normal.
    yea, but you don't need to be in law enforcement to know if someone comes in contact with blood you will find traces of it. Especially in places like under the fingernails. It doesn't just wash away. If he had put his hands there there would definitely be blood traces. I think this is one of the things he lied about, and if he lied about that he could definitely be doing the same about other stuff.

    Quote Originally Posted by F34R View Post
    The race issue is the only reason charges were filed.
    No it wasn't. The lead investigator is the one that wanted him charged first. He was overruled by the state attorney. That is when the outrage started.
    Last edited by Sub-stance1; 07-12-2013 at 04:27.

  19. #293
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sub-stance1 View Post
    yea, but you don't need to be in law enforcement to know if someone comes in contact with blood you will find traces of it. Especially in places like under the fingernails. It doesn't just wash away. If he had put his hands there there would definitely be blood traces. I think this is one of the things he lied about, and if he lied about that he could definitely be doing the same about other stuff.
    You're assuming he put his hands on a place where there was blood to transfer.




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    Quote Originally Posted by Sub-stance1 View Post
    Fear, there is no way possible for someone to put there hand on someones bloody face and find no trace of blood on the hand. Even though it was raining, you still would find traces of blood and would be able to determine who it came from. The first investigator is the one who wanted him charged with manslaughter because there were inconsistencies with his story. His story didn't line up. The state upgraded the charge to 2nd degree murder. Once they looked deeper they found that he lied about some things. The story just didn't add up. Like I said before if he gets convicted it will mostly because of his own mistakes.
    He covered Zimmerman's mouth and bleeding nose with his hands and baggy sweatshirt cuffs. But the rain completely washed away all DNA. Not degraded it. Not made it harder to identify. Completely washed it away What a joke.

  21. #295
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    Quote Originally Posted by F34R View Post
    Unless I'm mistaken, they took the gun when they took him, and returned it to him.
    i don't know the actual report but that's what i heard.

  22. #296
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    Quote Originally Posted by F34R View Post
    You're assuming he put his hands on a place where there was blood to transfer.
    I'm not assuming anything. These are zimmerman's words. He is the one who said martin put his hands over his moth and nose to try and stop him from screaming. He was bleeding from the nose so there would of been blood somewhere on his hands or even somewhere else on his clothing.

    Edit....meant mouth and nose.
    Last edited by Sub-stance1; 07-12-2013 at 04:34.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sub-stance1 View Post
    I'm not assuming anything. These are zimmerman's words. He is the one who said martin put his hands over his moth and nose to try and stop him from screaming. He was bleeding from the nose so there would of been blood somewhere on his hands or even somewhere else on his clothing.

    Edit....meant mouth and nose.
    Maybe you should have prosecuted this case... maybe called a medical expert to the stand to refute Zimmermans statement about that. You must be a heck of a lot smarter than the team that brought this to court.

    You're saying that there isn't any possibility that Martins hands were over Zimmermans mouth and/or nose, at any time during the struggle?

    Is it possible that he covered the mouth and/or nose before it started bleeding?




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    Quote Originally Posted by Sufi View Post
    if someone's life is threatened then I understand. but shooting people for destroying "things" isn't just. we have laws in place for a good reason. this is an extremist thinking.
    No, Extremist thinking is killing someone cause they don't share ur point of view, that is extreme.
    Shooting a dumbtard trying to destroy my property which was acquired with blood, sweat and tears is not extreme, It's fucking righteous!

    Quote Originally Posted by skyballin View Post
    The race issue is the only reason it took so long for charges to be filed.
    Zimmerman is not even White... .... ....

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    Quote Originally Posted by F34R View Post
    Maybe you should have prosecuted this case... maybe called a medical expert to the stand to refute Zimmermans statement about that. You must be a heck of a lot smarter than the team that brought this to court.
    They did do that. Well the examiner said there were no traces of blood found on the hand. I guess that can be considered as such.



    You're saying that there isn't any possibility that Martins hands were over Zimmermans mouth and/or nose, at any time during the struggle?
    No. I'm saying that according to his version, there would of been blood on martin's hands if he did.

    Is it possible that he covered the mouth and/or nose before it started bleeding?
    Not according to Zimmerman. He is the one who said that when martin put his hands over his nose and mouth the pain was excruciating and he was bleeding.


    I'm not saying he is guilty or not guilty but there are clearly some inaccuracies in his story. Remember, the first investigator is the one who initially didn't believe his version.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sub-stance1 View Post
    They did do that. Well the examiner said there were no traces of blood found on the hand. I guess that can be considered as such.




    No. I'm saying that according to his version, there would of been blood on martin's hands if he did.



    Not according to Zimmerman. He is the one who said that when martin put his hands over his nose and mouth the pain was excruciating and he was bleeding.


    I'm not saying he is guilty or not guilty but there are clearly some inaccuracies in his story. Remember, the first investigator is the one who initially didn't believe his version.
    Medical expert didn't say "his hand/s couldn't have been over the mouth and/or nose"...
    Bleeding from? Got a link? I'm gonna guess it's the pain from his freakin' head being slammed into the ground.




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