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  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sufi View Post
    1080p with 2GB next-gen would be at max?

    4GB would a $100 more. I think we're going to see next-gen hardware on PC coming out soon that will be designed for 64-bit OSs.

    i don't even know how popular multitasking is anyway while gaming on PC. I don't remember myself doing more than browsing or maybe putting on a video...but that's if i wasn't doing anything in the game.

    You can browse while gaming on the Vita now. I think that's adequate.

    Do we really need a burn a DVD while gaming? On paper all that sounds awesome but really I don't see anyone doing it...especially because you'll be causing hitches and stuff while playing.
    Is video RAM even an issue like with the 32bit Windows limit?


    Also
    http://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/art...GB-Memory-154/

  2. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by keefy View Post
    Is video RAM even an issue like with the 32bit Windows limit?


    Also
    http://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/art...GB-Memory-154/
    it is exactly due to the 32-bit OS limit. they have been available but for the first time, they will be required to play the games...meaning, no more 32-bit windows for games.

  3. #28
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    You can use a 6gb Titan with 32bit windows


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  4. #29
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    I'll guarantee you it's not using the extra 2GB out of that.

  5. #30
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    Probably not all of it. At least 3Gb of it though. Pointless o know I'm not doubting games will start only supporting 64bit OS's though


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  6. #31
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    it's already a report...not making it up XD

    http://kotaku.com/5912180/if-you-don...be-missing-out

  7. #32
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    64bit CPUs have been available for 10 years so someone that doesnt have 64bit OS I wonder why.
    Last edited by keefy; 07-21-2013 at 03:28.

  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by keefy View Post
    64bit CPUs have been available for 10 years so someone that doesnt have 64bit OS I wonder why.

    Also the RAM limit is unique to windows only Operating systems. Mac and Linux do not suffer the same problem.
    is it? I didn't even think you could have a Windows 7 64 to play them. i thought it was only Win 8 64-bit.

    the problem is that while 64-bit CPUs were available, they weren't truly being utilized. So if they made a game that only runs on 64-bit, then you're taking out almost all of your user base that still has 32-bit processors.

    most CPUs are 64-bit nowadays however not all people use 64-bit windows.

    so now that people will need a 64-bit CPU with a 64-bit OS, you're looking at a totally different ballgame.

    i think they had to force this cut off because consoles ain't gonna wait around for PC...if it were up to PC developers, we'd never see a shift because their market is stuck with people who have $#@!ty computers.

    so now while it will help PC enthusiasts as they'll get a big bump in ports and consoles won't be holding them back as much...also the 32-bit OS users won't be holding them back either.

    however, the problem now will be that their market will be fraction of what it used to be. me thinks we're still going to see games that will be on PC with both 32/64 OS supported...but eventually they'll start to look outdated compared to next-gen PC/console games.

    What would be interesting is to see developers making an exclusive for Windows 8. Now that would be fairly utilized well. We'd be seeing next-next-gen already. Sort of like Crysis back in 2007.

  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by keefy View Post
    Is video RAM even an issue like with the 32bit Windows limit?


    Also
    http://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/art...GB-Memory-154/
    Don't listen to what anyone said. They don't know what they are saying. Video RAM can be as large as it wants to be. The 32-bit OS only limits the system memory.

  10. #35
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  11. #36
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    I want to iterate a few things that BBK have said:
    While hardware costs have always been expensive, a PC's hardware can still stay the same for several years without a problem, hell some games coming out now still require even a low end machine that you can pick up for about 250 and you'll be able to run the game at max settings, sure it'll be the base unit only with onboard graphics but it'll do the job quite nicely. Of course if you're going for the bigger games then you could still play them on max settings with a low-mid range PC setting you back about the cost of about 500, that will last you a good 3-4 years if you're wanting to play the bigger games. I put together a PC 6 years ago that lasted me until October last year and it cost me only 680 with top of the range parts at the time, I upgraded the GFX card once so I guess add another 80 on there but still I was able to play even Shogun 2 and Metro on Max settings with it albeit at ~20FPS but it was easily playable.

    For drivers and everything I don't even need to think about if they're out of date now, the only drivers you need to think about is your graphics drivers, even then you don't need to do that. Install Windows and it will automatically get the latest drivers for you, just hit that big "update windows" button and it'll do it for you, it couldn't be simpler really. When there are new drivers available you get a prompt in the corner saying "new drivers available, click here to install". Best thing about the graphics drivers nowadays is that they don't require a reboot anymore because Windows switches to a generic driver while the installation takes place.

    While people might not have the technical mindset of putting a PC together you don't need one nowadays, it's as easy as looking at the slots and going "oh look it fits in there", it's just a giant Lego set, in fact Lego is WAY harder than putting a PC together and I'm not kidding. Oh course if you want to make things tidy then it can take hours to put together but otherwise putting parts together can take no more than 20 minutes tops, perhaps an hour for someone doing it for the first time. I always tell new PC owners to buy a PC in parts and build it themselves so that not only will they save hundreds on the overall PC but also you'll know how to replace parts if anything goes wrong. It really is a piece of cake and isn't as hard as people make it out to be.

    Ah the controllers, PC can use anything including custom made controllers, you name a controller and it'll work on the PC, the peripheral range on the PC is mental, hell I'm still saving up for a Frex system.

    I want to create a custom rig like this!


    I won't go on forever so my last point is this, the rig might cost you twice as much as a console but think of it like this, we can often purchase games in the 3-15 range for blockbuster titles shortly after release while most console games hold their value above 15 after 2 years, considering I just bought Demon's Souls for a fiver that's pretty new on the PC is testament to this, hell even Tomb Raider was half-price after a month on the PC. The PC market is astronomically larger than the console market and it's quite even on the retail space, just imagine adding all of these digital retail sites together (especially Steam) and you'll be stunned at the sales the PC gets.

    One more thing, there's a reason PC gamers hate having to pay for online because we already get everything for free due to being such an open platform. With PS+ though I don't mind paying for because of the services it gives (free games across all Sony platforms plus heavy discounts on other items) is fair enough and I've already saved a shed load of money I would have otherwise spent. Everything else PS+/XBox Live offers though Steam does a million times better, and their new cards/levelling system is quite addictive, damn you Gabe!!!

    Oh just to properly clarify about the RAM issues:
    • 16b = 64MB addressable system resources
    • 32b = 4GB addressable system resources
    • 64b = 16EB (exabyte) addressable system resources

    People have often complained about Windows not being able to address their 4GB RAM and 2GB VRAM, the reason is that a 32b OS simply can't. You can get RAM extensions but these are known as IA64 address extensions from IBM which do work however what it actually does is use a swap file like crazy, not only this but you'll also wonder why a laptop gave only 3GB RAM and 512MB onboard VRAM, it's because 512MB is also used for other system resources such as the onboard sound, the north and southbridge controllers, and a lot of other things on the motherboard, ask the laptop to add more into the VRAM and the main RAM used will shrink.

    I first saw the true benefits of a 64b OS with Vista 64, the multi-threading was finally used properly and my RAM plus VRAM was being fully used but as asinine as people were back then they labelled Vista a failure - probably because people didn't understand why they should have migrated across, this led to incompatibility issues from users and it just went all awry. Shame really because it was a decent OS. When Windows 7 came out 64b drivers and software was a lot more mature and people were more aware of it so these problems didn't occur.

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  13. #37
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    Nice long read there Varsh! Said everything I said but in a much better way! +rep

    I will just say one thing. I think your estimation of 20 minutes is kind of quick! My next PC took me about 4/5 hours to put together but i'd take a guess that 1 1/2 of those hours were me cutting and fitting my loop.

    Though saying that I was building at a leisurely pace, watching F1 and taking breaks to eat as it was a hot Sunday afternoon so probably I dragged it out for a lot longer than i needed to

    Plus, i'd love to see someone build a PC from scratch with nice cable management in that time You are correct though, building a PC is relatively easy. If it doesn't fit, it's not supposed to go there!
    Last edited by BBK..; 07-22-2013 at 14:18.

  14. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by BoyBettaKnow View Post
    I think playing at 1080 2GB would be fine. If not there is a 4GB 770. I don't think the memory thing is a massive issue. The 690 only has 3GB (or 6gb shared) memory but that'll still be eating games for a while yet.
    Yeah. The 690 hasn't been touched yet.

  15. #39
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    Exactly. Why would Nvidia release a flagship card if it would be gimped out of the gate


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    i do see where i was faulted. realistically, the consoles are really only going to be using about a couple of gigs for graphics and a little more or less depending on the kind of games they will be used for.

    which makes the VRAM on current video cards more than adequate enough. however, the 64-bit OS would still be required and makes total sense as you still need RAM for bigger games. can't fit all that in 3-4GB of system/vram all at once.

  17. #41
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    VRAM on GPU's is only really used for Gaming @ High res & Multi-Monitor setups 1.2 GB of VRAM is more than enough for Gaming for a good while.

  18. #42
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  19. #43
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    Then use a wireless controller and put Steam into Big Picture mode. :P

  20. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Varsh View Post
    Then use a wireless controller and put Steam into Big Picture mode. :P
    Are Valve still coming out with the Steam OS?

  21. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by MacP View Post
    Okay so we know that PS4 and Xbox One are releasing soon but what I would like to know is why gamers are not choosing the PC. it is still lead platform for developers and is generic I mean we only had to look at the Battlefield 4 gameplay trailers to see how stunning the graphics are

    What are your thoughts?
    well gamers such as u quoted "hardcore" gamers do own either a console and a pc or all consoles and a pc. most want the diversified experiences not to mention access to all games that are offered. I don't have a pc because I don't wanna dish money for it.


    moving on tapatalk



    Currently Playing: COD Ghosts, Battlefield 4, Assassins Creed 4

  22. #46
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    One of the problems PC gaming will always have is that developers are not accountable to anyone and therefore the bad ones can $#@! you over without much in the way of repercussion. Yes ok in a free market they are accountable to customers, etc. But many just don't seem to care. How many games have you bought (especially at launch) that are near enough unplayable on anything except the most powerful of hardware? I bet it is a lot more than you would like to admit

    In my opinion the tax that Sony, MS and Nintendo effectively levy on us for console games because of royalties is worth it simply because you know you're getting a game that has been through their QA and you know it works. Now sadly there are a couple exceptions to this rule *cough* Behtesda *cough* and that is when the law should get involved. But rarely does it

  23. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by keefy View Post
    Are Valve still coming out with the Steam OS?
    Steam OS? That would be insane. PC needs that badly.

  24. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cyn View Post
    One of the problems PC gaming will always have is that developers are not accountable to anyone and therefore the bad ones can $#@! you over without much in the way of repercussion. Yes ok in a free market they are accountable to customers, etc. But many just don't seem to care. How many games have you bought (especially at launch) that are near enough unplayable on anything except the most powerful of hardware? I bet it is a lot more than you would like to admit

    In my opinion the tax that Sony, MS and Nintendo effectively levy on us for console games because of royalties is worth it simply because you know you're getting a game that has been through their QA and you know it works. Now sadly there are a couple exceptions to this rule *cough* Behtesda *cough* and that is when the law should get involved. But rarely does it
    Actually out of all my games i've tried on Steam/Origin, i've never had that issue once. Then again my PC used to be fairly high-end - it's low end now - so that might have been why i never had issues. The worst issue I can think of is with the Witcher 2 i'd get random lens flares on the screen but that was due to shoddy AMD drivers, surprise surprise.

  25. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Varsh View Post
    Then use a wireless controller and put Steam into Big Picture mode. :P
    I did for a couple of years. The occasional freezing, the "go back and forth" to setup the game, I liked the better graphics and loved 4xAA but in the end I liked the console experience more.
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  26. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by keefy View Post
    Are Valve still coming out with the Steam OS?
    You mean the Steam box?

    Quote Originally Posted by KnotGamer901 View Post
    I don't have a pc because I don't wanna dish money for it.
    What a few of us are trying to say though is that although the initial cost of a PC is more for a high-spec (about 750 for the base unit) the overall cost of saving on games will recoup that cost within a year if even only purchasing new games a month after release. Not even dedicated PC sites seem to iterate this point which is a shame.

    Oh and BBK forgot to mention, your rig takes 5+ hours because you're putting together water cooling.

    I've got 4 Arctic Cooling fans in my machine, it's running on almost silent and it's the coolest thing in my room right now... think I should open the window.

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