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    Edge: PlayStation 4 is currently around 50 per cent faster than its rival Xbox One.

    http://www.edge-online.com/news/powe...e-performance/

    PlayStation 4 is currently around 50 per cent faster than its rival Xbox One. Multiple high-level game development sources have described the difference in performance between the consoles as “significant” and “obvious.”

    Our contacts have told us that memory reads on PS4 are 40-50 per cent quicker than Xbox One, and its ALU (Arithmetic Logic Unit) is around 50 per cent faster. One basic example we were given suggested that without optimisation for either console, a platform-agnostic development build can run at around 30FPS in 1920×1080 on PS4, but it’ll run at “20-something” FPS in 1600×900 on Xbox One. “Xbox One is weaker and it’s a pain to use its ESRAM,” concluded one developer.

    Microsoft is aware of the problem and, having recently upped the clock speed of Xbox One, is working hard to close the gap on PS4, though one developer we spoke to downplayed the move. “The clock speed update is not significant, it does not change things that much,” he said. “Of course, something is better than nothing.”

    Last edited by victorijapoosp; 09-13-2013 at 12:53.
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    Maths is biased! It keeps telling me the PS4 is 50% more powerful than XboxOne!
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    Wow, I didnt think the difference was that much if true.

    That is significant.

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    this part disheartened me

    One source even suggested that enforcing parity across consoles could become a political issue between platform holders, developers and publishers. They said that it could damage perceptions of a cross platform title, not to mention Xbox One, if the PS4 version shipped with an obviously superior resolution and framerate; better to “castrate” the PS4 version and release near-identical games to avoid ruffling any feathers.
    given how both are now comparable to PC's (architecturally) you'd assume it wouldn't be too hard to let one run a higher screen or texture res.

    that being said, the PS3 was routinely run at sub-HD this gen by multiplat developers.

    so i imagine something similar to carry on, except with reversed roles
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fijiandoce View Post
    this part disheartened me


    given how both are now comparable to PC's (architecturally) you'd assume it wouldn't be too hard to let one run a higher screen or texture res.

    that being said, the PS3 was routinely run at sub-HD this gen by multiplat developers.

    so i imagine something similar to carry on, except with reversed roles
    This has been my concern for a while. I have stayed out of all the spec comparisons since that is not my area of expertise, but say all the reports are true that the PS4 is superior in hardware, are the devs actually going to showcase that with their games? Microsoft has spent a lot of money to build relationships with developers and earned timed exclusives and other perks. How will Microsoft react if a multiplat is released and the PS4 looks significantly better? I'm just wondering how much power Microsoft has in all this. Can Microsoft influence developers enough to dumb down the PS4 version so there is no noticeable difference? I am hoping devs use every bit of power that each console provides and let consumers decide for themselves, but somehow I am afraid it will not be that easy.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fijiandoce View Post
    this part disheartened me


    given how both are now comparable to PC's (architecturally) you'd assume it wouldn't be too hard to let one run a higher screen or texture res.

    that being said, the PS3 was routinely run at sub-HD this gen by multiplat developers.

    so i imagine something similar to carry on, except with reversed roles
    We already knew this unfortunately though, regardless of the PS4 being more powerful than XBone we shouldn't expect better looking games on 3rd party games. Tbh I don't know why should a developer compromise on graphics just so they not differ one from each other, that's like making the PC version look $#@!ty just because it looks $#@!ty on consoles.


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    I'd say the PS4 exclusives will be on another level!
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    Maths is biased! It keeps telling me the PS4 is 50% more powerful than XboxOne!
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    Quote Originally Posted by victorijapoosp View Post
    I'd say the PS4 exclusives will be on another level!

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    The fact of the FCC test sheet is that it states "maximum clock frequency in the system". The simple fact of where that is located is all speculation until it is confirmed. Yes, 2.75GHz is conveniently twice the GPU base clock frequency but that does not necessarily mean it is for the GPU WCLK.

    This is a table from AMD on their latest APU:


    Notice even AMD references the GPU by its base clock, not by its write clock. Nobody ever refers to a GPU clock with the write clock. Also, notice the clock specs for the CPU. The APU CPU clock has doubled since the Jaguar. Also notice, how they refer to the CPU clock: MAX/BASE. This has been AMD's practice for quite awhile. So, the production Jaguar has a BASE CLOCK of 2GHz, with an unidentified MAX CLOCK. Looking at the chart above, notice how much CPU clock frequency has increased since Jaguar.

    There is just as much evidence for the PS4 having a MAX CPU clock of 2.75GHz as there is for that being the GPU write clock. And that is the point there, the PS4 is showing evidence of performing much faster with much more compute power than the XBone.

    Again, TGS is the line in the sand for no more bull$#@! make-up specs, called "putting lipstick on the pig" in the industry.
    Last edited by Bligmerk; 09-13-2013 at 20:07.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bligmerk View Post
    The fact of the FCC test sheet is that it states "maximum clock frequency in the system". The simple fact of where that is located is all speculation until it is confirmed. Yes, 2.75GHz is conveniently twice the GPU base clock frequency but that does not necessarily mean it is for the GPU WCLK.

    This is a table from AMD on their latest APU:


    Notice even AMD references the GPU by its base clock, not by its write clock. Nobody ever refers to a GPU clock with the write clock. Also, notice the clock specs for the CPU. The APU CPU clock has doubled since the Jaguar. Also notice, how they refer to the CPU clock: MAX/BASE. This has been AMD's practice for quite awhile. So, the production Jaguar has a BASE CLOCK of 2GHz, with an unidentified MAX CLOCK. Looking at the chart above, notice how much CPU clock frequency has increased since Jaguar.

    There is just as much evidence for the PS4 having a MAX CPU clock of 2.75GHz as there is for that being the GPU write clock. And that is the point there, the PS4 is showing evidence of performing much faster with much more compute power than the XBone.

    Again, TGS is the line in the sand for no more bull$#@! make-up specs, called "putting lipstick on the pig" in the industry.
    I think, in this instance, you're wrong Blig. In particular, for the CPU and GPU to work optimally (and really make the whole GPGPU thing possible) the GPU clock must be about half the CPU clock. At present (1.6Ghz CPU, 800Mhz GPU) this is the exact ratio. This is why the Xbox One had to do a CPU upclock in addition to its GPU upclock proportionately.

    For the PS4, this isn't so simple. First, it is a much smaller case thus the thermal headroom (unless I'm totally missing something) just 'isn't there' compared to the Xbox One.. Which has a huge case. Secondly, unlike the Xbox One, the PS4's GPU is simply much bigger. An upclock applied to it will result in heightened power consumption and thermals in considerable excess to the Xbox One.

    For what you're proposing to 'really work' the GPU on PS4 would have to be clocked in at roughly 1375Mhz or 1.37 Ghz. That's over a 50% increase lol.

    What you're suggesting is simply unrealistic.

    Even a bump to 2Ghz would require a GPU clock of 1Ghz.


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    Its a good thing for me that i usually buy exclusives but that really sucks for console gaming in general.

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    Quote Originally Posted by F34R View Post
    As long as the games are awesome, I don't care about the "power" mumbojumbo.
    This and ill add both consoles with have excellent games, November is gonna be a frigging expensive month!

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    it does bode well for playstation though.

    One source even suggested that enforcing parity across consoles could become a political issue between platform holders, developers and publishers. They said that it could damage perceptions of a cross platform title, not to mention Xbox One, if the PS4 version shipped with an obviously superior resolution and framerate; better to “castrate” the PS4 version and release near-identical games to avoid ruffling any feathers.
    wonder how perceptions will be damaged when their titles are being held up against the best from Sony's first parties

    its all fluff to appease people, i say. no need for devs to burn bridges this early.
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    Quite honestly this really should come as no surprise to anybody at this point. We can throw around all of the 'unique' scenarios that might put Xbox One ahead of PS4 in unique circumstances relating to its slightly increased (56Mhz) throughput and ESRAM techniques or slight CPU advantage but.. At the end of the day it's simply weaker tech.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Vulgotha View Post
    Quite honestly this really should come as no surprise to anybody at this point. We can throw around all of the 'unique' scenarios that might put Xbox One ahead of PS4 in unique circumstances relating to its slightly increased (56Mhz) throughput and ESRAM techniques or slight CPU advantage but.. At the end of the day it's simply weaker tech.
    good luck convincing some people of this though....



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    When/if the install base shifts away from the even spread this gen in favour of the PS4 ie 70/30 split. That is when we will see multiplat devs putting extra effort into the PS4 version.

    But I wouldn't put it past Microsoft to run a "Dollars for visual parity" scheme, in order to gimp the PS4 version. But then this gen on PS3, I prefered Sony first party titles such as Uncharted, God of War, The last of us, Killzone, Infamous, Little big planet, Heavenly Sword, Gran Turismo, Journey, Flower, Motorstorm, Puppeteer, Warhawk, unfinished swan, Ratchet & Clank etc anyway.

    So I will have plenty of first party games to occupy myself, while the install base shifts and multiplatform devs realise that they could probably make more money by optimising their game to look as good as possible on PS4, therefore competing visually vs Sony first party titles than losing money from the bribery or political problems from MS.
    Last edited by victorijapoosp; 09-13-2013 at 13:34.
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    Quote Originally Posted by victorijapoosp View Post
    But I wouldn't put it past Microsoft to run a "Dollars for visual parity" scheme, in order to gimp the PS4 version. But then this gen on PS3, I prefered Sony first party titles such as Uncharted, God of War, The last of us, Killzone, Infamous, Little big planet, Heavenly Sword, Gran Turismo, Journey, Flower, Motorstorm, Puppeteer, Warhawk, unfinished swan, Ratchet & Clank etc anyway.
    that is when you know they are going to be in the $#@!. If they start doing that it's time to hire more competent people to run that company because that is nothing more than what they were doing this gen and it certain bit them in the ass. Mainly because it's a waste of money when that money could be used to strengthen their 1st party developments and to buy certain ip's.

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    Quote Originally Posted by victorijapoosp View Post
    When/if the install base shifts away from the even spread this gen in favour of the PS4 ie 70/30 split. That is when we will see multiplat devs putting extra effort into the PS4 version.

    But I wouldn't put it past Microsoft to run a "Dollars for visual parity" scheme, in order to gimp the PS4 version. But then this gen on PS3, I prefered Sony first party titles such as Uncharted, God of War, The last of us, Killzone, Infamous, Little big planet, Heavenly Sword, Gran Turismo, Journey, Flower, Motorstorm, Puppeteer, Warhawk, unfinished swan, Ratchet & Clank etc anyway.

    So I will have plenty of first party games to occupy myself, while the install base shifts and multiplatform devs realise that they could probably make more money by optimising their game to look as good as possible on PS4, therefore competing visually vs Sony first party titles than losing money from the bribery or political problems from MS.
    The only reason to make one version substantially better then another from a business point of view is if one console has a better royalty rate where the dev would make more money per copy on that platform than the other. Otherwise you are just putting more money into the budget of the game to make it better, but not getting anymore money per copy out of it.

    You basically have the same amount of people that are gonna buy a certain game. It's merely what platform are they gonna buy it on.

    As for bribes for parity? I'm all for it. Just as I would be okay if Sony paid devs more to get the better version. It's business and I wouldn't hate on either company for doing it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GreatSpaceKoaster View Post
    The only reason to make one version substantially better then another from a business point of view is if one console has a better royalty rate where the dev would make more money per copy on that platform than the other. Otherwise you are just putting more money into the budget of the game to make it better, but not getting anymore money per copy out of it.

    You basically have the same amount of people that are gonna buy a certain game. It's merely what platform are they gonna buy it on....
    This argument is some what true, but only if you ignore the aspect of game companies also competing with each other for our attention and money. To be competitive they would all be striving to be the best. Best graphics, sound, game play, unique features etc to put them ahead of the competition. There is the possibility of selling more games because a) its the better version ( which agrees with your position) but also b) because its also better than another companies game that did play to platform weaknesses rather than strengths.

    Actually might have to disagree with you more using that royalty rate as a reason, unless you have some good numbers to back up that position. As we have seen through the current gen is, a single platform is targeted ( chances are the one that will provide the better performance), with the other platforms pulled up to that level as close as possible. I would hazard a guess that it is very rarely the other way around ie, weaker platform targeted with the more powerful ones left with processing resources.

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    So the PS4 CPU is 2.6ghz?

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    Well, this time around, even if the playstation version of multi-plat games aren't going to be substantially better, they will be at least the better version.. looks like there's no chance of getting an inferior port this time around. And then there are exclusives, which of course will shine.

    And I believe this might happen too.

    Quote Originally Posted by victorijapoosp View Post
    When/if the install base shifts away from the even spread this gen in favour of the PS4 ie 70/30 split. That is when we will see multiplat devs putting extra effort into the PS4 version.

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    Eventually, the third parties will have to compete with each other for sales over each others franchises. Sandbagging graphics won't be for too long, especially if XBone unit sales start lagging behind PS4 significantly.

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    MS has no power over PS4 versions of a game, Sony wouldn't allow it, same with MS wouldn't either.

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    More tidbits:

    This is anecdotal from E3, but...

    I've heard the architecture with the ESRAM is actually a major hurdle in development because you need to manually fill and flush it.

    So unless MS's APIs have improved to the point that this is essentially automatic, the bandwidth and hardware speed are probably irrelevant.

    For reference, the story going around E3 went something like this:

    "ATVI was doing the CoD: Ghosts port to nextgen. It took three weeks for PS4 and came out at 90 FPS unoptimized, and four months on Xbone and came out at 15 FPS."


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    Quote Originally Posted by Vulgotha View Post
    More tidbits:

    This is anecdotal from E3, but...

    I've heard the architecture with the ESRAM is actually a major hurdle in development because you need to manually fill and flush it.

    So unless MS's APIs have improved to the point that this is essentially automatic, the bandwidth and hardware speed are probably irrelevant.

    For reference, the story going around E3 went something like this:

    "ATVI was doing the CoD: Ghosts port to nextgen. It took three weeks for PS4 and came out at 90 FPS unoptimized, and four months on Xbone and came out at 15 FPS."

    (by Peter Bartholow - CEO of Lab Zero Games - Guys who made Skullgirls)
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    Maths is biased! It keeps telling me the PS4 is 50% more powerful than XboxOne!
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