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  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yungstar 2006 View Post
    i think that by the time that could happen, they (Sony/MS) will allow external drives to be used to store downloads/installs.
    there's cloud storage.

    also i'm sure we'll be able to upgrade HDDs.

  2. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sufi View Post
    there's cloud storage.

    also i'm sure we'll be able to upgrade HDDs.
    MS already did a 180. I doubt upgrade HDD was included in that fiasco. Though with USB 3.0 and the simplified OS's I'd imagine External HDD won't create too much of a bottleneck on XBone. But yeah they'll be pushing for massive cloud storage I bet.


  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sufi View Post
    It would probably be cheaper as HD-DVD would've won.
    Sorry -- I wasn't trying to say that blu-ray wouldn't have existed. The strong push that blu-ray had and HD-DVD didn't, was the PS3. So you would still have two formats competing.

    Unless you understood what I said and your point was that HD-DVD would have won if blu-ray wasn't part of the PS3, then I don't think that is fair to say.

    If PS3 wasn't part of the strategy, they would have had another strategy and since we don't know what that strategy would have been, it's hard to declare a winner. It's a pointless exercise is what I am trying to say -- a what if/what if not scenario.

    My main point wasn't this (the reason I mentioned an alternative format in my original post, which could have been HD-DVD), my point simply was that you can't wait to introduce technology when you absolutely need it. You have to introduce it earlier when you can probably do without it.

    So whether it was Blu-ray or HD-DVD, being introduced last gen was the right way to go (and there is also the competition thing, competition drives cost down, if HD-DVD didn't have blu-ray to compete with, who is to say that it would have been the cheaper option or prices would have gone down as much as they ended up?)

    Blu-ray or insert another format here would have been a harder sell if movies weren't also part of the plan but this is another discussion.

    We can argue all day long whether blu-ray had to be used last gen for gaming but if you are going to use this argument you can't ignore the fact that a gaming console was the reason it won the format war. I don't care about the politics behind it all, I am simply trying to say one format had to win and had to be introduced before it was needed because if that hadn't happened before, it would have happened now.
    Last edited by sainraja; 10-27-2013 at 19:56.

  4. #29
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    To keep it simple, if you're saying that it was worth paying the price then, rather than paying more for it now assuming the war would not have ended? I don't believe so. One of them was going to win sooner or later...later being maybe another 6 months or more. It wasn't feasible to keep the war going. Honestly, I don't even think PS3 won the war, it was won because the corporations wanted Blu-Ray to win.

    We paid the price with the PS3 and while I do enjoy the fact that it makes my used gaming purchase much cheaper this way, i still don't think it was worth it.

    Whoever was going to win, would've been in next-gen consoles. We didn't need to pay the price. Yes, you have to introduce things that people don't know that they NEED (like a smart phone or touch screen phones/handhelds) but not things that people don't need YET.

    Consoles didn't need blu-ray until now.

  5. #30
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    Okay lets make this easy. Both systems will have a play as it installs feature and since I am betting save game files will be separate files hdd space is not a problem. When you are done playing the game uninstall it because of the play while install feature you dnot need to keep it on the hdd. This feature alone is worth buying a next gen
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  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sufi View Post
    To keep it simple, if you're saying that it was worth paying the price then, rather than paying more for it now assuming the war would not have ended? I don't believe so. One of them was going to win sooner or later...later being maybe another 6 months or more. It wasn't feasible to keep the war going. Honestly, I don't even think PS3 won the war, it was won because the corporations wanted Blu-Ray to win.

    We paid the price with the PS3 and while I do enjoy the fact that it makes my used gaming purchase much cheaper this way, i still don't think it was worth it.

    Whoever was going to win, would've been in next-gen consoles. We didn't need to pay the price. Yes, you have to introduce things that people don't know that they NEED (like a smart phone or touch screen phones/handhelds) but not things that people don't need YET.

    Consoles didn't need blu-ray until now.
    Look, it doesn't matter who ended up paying the price in the format war (somebody was going to -- be it gamers or other consumers -- that is besides the point.) One had to win in order for prices to down and for it be accepted globally. Things don't happen overnight.

    There were parties on both sides with their own interests pushing one format over the other. It doesn't matter. Blu-ray had PS3 and it wasn't an add-on (that is a big advantage.)

    So, you can downplay the impact of the PS3, but it was one of the factors that helped push blu-ray ahead of HD-DVD and ended the format war. You can say corporations wanted blu-ray to win or whatever (I don't see how this takes away anything from the point I was making) but HD-DVD was also backed up by corporations so I don't see why this matters?

    Again, I'm not arguing for when blu-ray was needed. It's good that a format is available that meets the disc capacity for current-gen without a format war.

    EDIT

    This just goes back to what I said earlier that you don't introduce technology when it's needed. You should introduce it before you think it will be needed. The how it happens, really doesn't matter (just that it does) and perhaps I shouldn't have gone into it.
    Last edited by sainraja; 10-28-2013 at 14:25.

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by thanatos144 View Post
    Okay lets make this easy. Both systems will have a play as it installs feature and since I am betting save game files will be separate files hdd space is not a problem. When you are done playing the game uninstall it because of the play while install feature you dnot need to keep it on the hdd. This feature alone is worth buying a next gen
    The problem is I do not want to have to install a game when I want to play it again.Then you have digital games.I don't see why you cannot play it without that massive install.All these new technologies but no one can make these games run faster without a huge install? Plus X1 does not let you swap the HDD and MS has said no external support will be available at launch.

  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by sainraja View Post
    Look, it doesn't matter who ended up paying the price in the format war (somebody was going to -- be it gamers or other consumers -- that is besides the point.) One had to win in order for prices to down and for it be accepted globally. Things don't happen overnight.
    Of course but the way I look at it. You pay for it if you want it. Did we all want it? Well, I bet most of us did because Sony told us that we did. Would we have complained if they did not put in the Blu-Ray? Probably not. I’d argue we wouldn’t even acknowledge that the 360 was going to run into troubles eventually because there’s nothing to compare.

    Consoles run into trouble eventually anyway, they’re closed boxes. They will always be outdated and bottlenecked eventually. 360 fixed that problem. Maybe Sony knew they couldn’t implement game installs? Or they would’ve given it to us anyway…but that’s a different topic.

    The point is, if you want a 60” 3D TV that can do 120MHz then you should pay that premium price but you want this product. We were given Blu-Ray whether we liked it or not.

    Would we have taken a PS3 for $350 or $399 at launch with a DVD? Probably majority. I have never seen a Blu-Ray movie on my PS3 except the one that came with the console and then I lost it because I didn’t care for it.

    Buying discs nowadays are really for the enthusiasts…I would probably buy some Blu-Ray movies if they were the right ones…but they don’t exist so I have no use for a Blu-Ray drive. However, I paid the price.

    Heck, with the arrival of Netflix and Hulu, you don’t even need a movie player anymore. Do I care that most of these aren’t even in HD? Nope.
    There were parties on both sides with their own interests pushing one format over the other. It doesn't matter. Blu-ray had PS3 and it wasn't an add-on (that is a big advantage.)
    MS was stupid to push HD-DVD, it seemed like they probably struck a deal with Toshiba (wasn’t it Toshiba?) to do an HD-DVD add-on. And they failed. That’s all there’s to it.
    You can look at it from this perspective and while it’s true, you’re forgetting that we also paid a hefty amount for it, so it better gave us at least “some” advantages. The problem is that most of us likely never used half of the advantages…and that is that it can play Blu-Ray movies since 2006.
    So, you can downplay the impact of the PS3, but it was one of the factors that helped push blu-ray ahead of HD-DVD and ended the format war. You can say corporations wanted blu-ray to win or whatever (I don't see how this takes away anything from the point I was making) but HD-DVD was also backed up by corporations so I don't see why this matters?
    It doesn’t matter if it won the war, it was still not consumer centric and it broke a few natural laws of business and thus why they technically suffered a defeat.

    They were both backed by corporations but it was clear that Blu-Ray was getting more backing, which is all that matters. Was it really because of the PS3? Honestly, it depends on how many people were actually using their Blu-Ray players as a movie player…I highly doubt there was much penetration there…especially in the beginning, and that’s basically when Blu-Ray won. I don’t remember it going long.

    Again, I'm not arguing for when blu-ray was needed. It's good that a format is available that meets the disc capacity for current-gen without a format war.
    It was somewhat good that Blu-Ray became useful as a movie player…for me at least, it seems that it didn’t matter either way because I don’t buy movies. I don’t know how many others are in the boat but with the popularity of Netflix and things going DD now…it seems like the physical formats moving forward will likely be more of a niche than the majority.

    What I care about or should’ve cared about a decade ago is what matters to me as a gamer and that’s what I’m doing now and PS4 definitely falls within my criteria. PS3 does not although I’m “dealing with it” because I still prefer a lot of things about the brand as a whole.

    EDIT: To add a side-note that I feel is important. Say if Sony never included a Blu-Ray player and let’s assume that PS3 helped win the war. Would it really save us money now moving forward? I highly doubt it, by the time Blu-Ray won the war, people were already fed up with the war and corporations were being forced to make a decision because people were holding out on what format to buy the movies for.

    How long have Blu-Ray players been sitting at less than $100? A long time now. I highly doubt it was going to go longer than 6 months or a year, even if it wasn’t included in the PS3.

    So we can take whatever we can from it because I do like some things about the Blu-Ray but did we need to pay the cost now to save later? Probably not. Even if that were true, it seems like MS fans were smart to make us pay for something they will save later. But I don’t agree with that scenario.

    Sony messed up.
    Last edited by Omar; 10-28-2013 at 14:39.

  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by DarkNemesis View Post
    The problem is I do not want to have to install a game when I want to play it again.Then you have digital games.I don't see why you cannot play it without that massive install.All these new technologies but no one can make these games run faster without a huge install? Plus X1 does not let you swap the HDD and MS has said no external support will be available at launch.
    Of course Microsoft does not have an external hard drive option they want you to buy a larger hard drive they will sell separately down the road. As for the large installs we are talking about huge amounts of data taken from a disk drive quickly
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  10. #35
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    I like having a physical copy over digital. Digital they can erase at any time physical they can't
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