Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst ... 2
Results 26 to 45 of 45
  1. #26
    Dedicated Member
    Demi_God's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Icy hot of the north
    PSN ID
    Kamikaze_Krunch
    Posts
    1,426
    Rep Power
    17
    Points
    7,913 (0 Banked)
    Items User name style
    Quote Originally Posted by jlippone View Post
    Indeed, there isn't any technical limitation why one couldn't go higher either.. (outside obvious things like performance and no visible difference in quality.. )

    At start of the video the daytime seems to be different, could be other things as well.
    This time we know that both machines do have same gamma curve, so it's not it this time.
    two different videos with two color schemes on the cars and obviously very different videos. These videos weren't made for comparisons, they just threw them in. Very poor comparisons. PS4 will look dull while the other looks bright, than the PS4 will look bright while the other is dull and then they both look bright. They are videos with two different time of days driving on different parts of the map. not a proper comparison. if it's side by side the timings should be close to identicle.
    Last edited by Demi_God; 11-14-2013 at 11:18.

  2. #27
    Master Poster
    Beast of Bourbon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Blighttown
    PSN ID
    Azrael666
    Age
    30
    Posts
    3,494
    Rep Power
    77
    Points
    12,226 (0 Banked)
    Items DoomPlayStationDiablo IIIBlizzardDemons Souls CoverDark Souls Cover
    Can't see much difference in these muddy youtubevids tbh.
    I'll keep waiting for a "must have" exclusive.

  3. #28
    Supreme Veteran
    mynd's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Down Under
    Age
    41
    Posts
    17,833
    Rep Power
    162
    Points
    167,157 (0 Banked)
    Items User name style
    Achievements IT'S OVER 9000!
    Quote Originally Posted by mynd View Post
    There is a color difference, which I'm putting down to the video capture card at this point, that or the 64 bit color format of the XBO.
    Too early to tell.
    Actually after watching the video again, there seems to be no ambient occlusion on the PS4 version@1:24 of the IGN video. I imagine the final version will have it.
    Well...

    The second difference is in the Xbox One's utilisation of ambient occlusion. This is a self-shadowing calculation usually handled by the GPU, forming light patches of shading beneath a car's spoiler or wheels - though seemingly axed from the PS4 version at present.
    http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/di...ce-off-preview

    With an update....

    The article states that the PS4 version of the game is missing ambient occlusion, but the fact is that the PS4 version actually is using it in the form of HBAO.
    HBAO uses more GPU grunt, but in this case, I honestly think its broken. If you look at the DF video, the license plate on the PS4 looks like its got a light on it.

    Last edited by mynd; 11-16-2013 at 08:42.

  4. #29
    Legend
    F34R's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    South Carolina
    PSN ID
    F34RTEHR34PER
    Posts
    40,122
    Rep Power
    244
    Points
    147,835 (0 Banked)
    Items BullySteamGran Turismo 5LiverpoolAppleJoker (limited ICON)Naughty DogMaster ChiefAssassins Creed EzioGears of WarHeavy RainDiablo III
    Achievements IT'S OVER 9000!
    I wanna get this one, but will have to wait a little bit to figure out which system to get it on.




  5. #30
    Dedicated Member
    Sajuuk Khar's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Age
    26
    Posts
    1,443
    Rep Power
    73
    Points
    9,390 (0 Banked)
    Quote Originally Posted by mynd View Post
    Well...


    http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/di...ce-off-preview

    With an update....



    HBAO uses more GPU grunt, but in this case, I honestly think its broken. If you look at the DF video, the license plate on the PS4 looks like its got a light on it.


    Is that video from the current build though? they put at the end of the article that the version they were using could have had it turned off while the retail one has the full effect. Also cool that they are looking at the frame sequencing issue and going to fix it in a patch.

    Seriously considering this game, fun racer to hold me over till drive club :P

  6. #31
    Dedicated Member
    John Willaford's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Owings Mills, MD
    Age
    40
    Posts
    1,080
    Rep Power
    20
    Points
    416,487 (0 Banked)
    Quote Originally Posted by mynd View Post
    There is a color difference, which I'm putting down to the video capture card at this point, that or the 64 bit color format of the XBO.
    Too early to tell.
    Actually after watching the video again, there seems to be no ambient occlusion on the PS4 version@1:24 of the IGN video. I imagine the final version will have it.
    I think the overcast/fog is negating simulating the light radiocity in the environment to the same extent.

  7. #32
    Master Poster
    TheBreezyBB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Qatar
    PSN ID
    BreBaz
    Age
    30
    Posts
    3,475
    Rep Power
    85
    Points
    18,170 (0 Banked)
    Items One PieceOne PieceAuronPS3 FatVitaNaughty DogFinal Fantasy XPlayStation
    Quote Originally Posted by F34R View Post
    I wanna get this one, but will have to wait a little bit to figure out which system to get it on.
    PC would be the best bet




  8. #33
    Apprentice
    toontoonizer's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Posts
    354
    Rep Power
    62
    Points
    176 (0 Banked)
    Quote Originally Posted by mynd View Post
    Sorry, but your wrong. While its true our final image is shown in 32-bit's 64 bits are used frequently to allow for high dynamic dynamic range. Its possible to use a 64 bit buffer to result in subtle changes in the final color output.

    It actually never occurred to me, I assumed if they were doing a comparison video they'd be getting these things the same. If that's the case, then yeah, this is an awefull comparison.
    Wasn't going to reply to this as it is clear we are talking about quite different things, and you have no idea what I was talking about. I am most certainly not wrong.

    I believe you are referring to the actual calculation of contrast/brightness values used to create a HDR image. I don't want to get too technical but what you are referring to actually has very little to do with colour - it is in fact in reference to the dynamic range of the image (i.e. how bright, bright points are and how dark, dark points are and how much detail can be preserved in both).

    Essentially (and im simplifying this purposefully) a scene will have a certain contrast ratio, lets say 256:1 which means there are 255 levels of brightness so the brightest white is only 255 levels brighter than the darkest shade (black). Each pixel will specify its place on this spectrum by mapping this to the floating point values of 0.0 (darkest black level 1) and 1.0 (brightest white - level 255). A 256:1 contrast ratio is achieved with 8-bit integer based values (i.e. 11111111 or 00000000). The limitation of integer based values is that, obviously, they can only be integers (so on our scale of 0-255 a pixel could have a brightness value of 12 or 13 but not 12.5). This is not how things work in real life, obviously.

    Recently however, HDR rendering has improved considerably and we are now able to perform 128-bit Floating Point 16 (that is a number to 16 decimal figures as opposed to an integer) calculation of contrast ratios. I cant be bothered to calculate it, but this is a hugely expansive contrast ratio.

    THIS is what you are referring to when you speak of the Xbox One's ability to display 64-bit "colour" - what you mean, is its ability to perform HDR Rendering to an accuracy of (I imagine) FP16 64-bit. And surprise, surprise, the ability to calculate and to display are two different things - this is why we have tone mapping (read: compression) so that monitors can display this information in some visibly noticeable fashion. So, unfortunately, you are STILL quite mistaken in your explanation and what I posted initially STILL stands. I would have left it but I honestly could not leave the misinformation alone, let alone being told I was wrong, when quite frankly, you can't make heads or tails of what you are saying yourself.

  9. #34
    Supreme Veteran
    mynd's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Down Under
    Age
    41
    Posts
    17,833
    Rep Power
    162
    Points
    167,157 (0 Banked)
    Items User name style
    Achievements IT'S OVER 9000!
    Quote Originally Posted by toontoonizer View Post
    Wasn't going to reply to this as it is clear we are talking about quite different things, and you have no idea what I was talking about. I am most certainly not wrong.

    I believe you are referring to the actual calculation of contrast/brightness values used to create a HDR image. I don't want to get too technical but what you are referring to actually has very little to do with colour - it is in fact in reference to the dynamic range of the image (i.e. how bright, bright points are and how dark, dark points are and how much detail can be preserved in both).

    Essentially (and im simplifying this purposefully) a scene will have a certain contrast ratio, lets say 256:1 which means there are 255 levels of brightness so the brightest white is only 255 levels brighter than the darkest shade (black). Each pixel will specify its place on this spectrum by mapping this to the floating point values of 0.0 (darkest black level 1) and 1.0 (brightest white - level 255). A 256:1 contrast ratio is achieved with 8-bit integer based values (i.e. 11111111 or 00000000). The limitation of integer based values is that, obviously, they can only be integers (so on our scale of 0-255 a pixel could have a brightness value of 12 or 13 but not 12.5). This is not how things work in real life, obviously.

    Recently however, HDR rendering has improved considerably and we are now able to perform 128-bit Floating Point 16 (that is a number to 16 decimal figures as opposed to an integer) calculation of contrast ratios. I cant be bothered to calculate it, but this is a hugely expansive contrast ratio.

    THIS is what you are referring to when you speak of the Xbox One's ability to display 64-bit "colour" - what you mean, is its ability to perform HDR Rendering to an accuracy of (I imagine) FP16 64-bit. And surprise, surprise, the ability to calculate and to display are two different things - this is why we have tone mapping (read: compression) so that monitors can display this information in some visibly noticeable fashion. So, unfortunately, you are STILL quite mistaken in your explanation and what I posted initially STILL stands. I would have left it but I honestly could not leave the misinformation alone, let alone being told I was wrong, when quite frankly, you can't make heads or tails of what you are saying yourself.
    Eh? I know all of that, I've been known to "dabble" in graphics programming.


    that or the 64 bit color format of the XBO.
    Thats a reference to the full 64 bit pipeline (CB rop is 64 bit output vs 32 on the PS4) that allows for 64 bit framebuffer as the norm (although with Esram considerations you may well be mad to use it).
    I'm sorry if you thought I meant some sort of 64 bit display, which is not what I was talking about.
    Last edited by mynd; 11-27-2013 at 21:07.

  10. #35
    Apprentice
    toontoonizer's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Posts
    354
    Rep Power
    62
    Points
    176 (0 Banked)
    Quote Originally Posted by mynd View Post
    Eh? I know all of that, I've been known to "dabble" in graphics programming.



    Thats a reference to the full 64 bit pipeline (CB rop is 64 bit output vs 32 on the PS4) that allows for 64 bit framebuffer as the norm (although with Esram considerations you may well be mad to use it).
    I'm sorry if you thought I meant some sort of 64 bit display, which is not what I was talking about.
    I know you know this, your reputation precedes you, which is why I wonder you would say something like "64-bit colour". If you look on the first page of this post you did say this. There is no confusion, you weren't talking about a 64 bit display. You referred specifically to 64-bit colour. Go take a look. I was trying to illustrate there is no such thing as 64 bit colour not matter how many bits your frame buffer or pipeline is. Colour is only available in a maximum of 48 bits (and i will eat crow if the Xbox One outputs in 48 bit colour because I'm pretty sure only Nvidia Quadro or ATI FirePro professional graphics cards (costing upwards of 1000) provide support for 48 bit deep colour).

    This is my bone of contention with your comment on the first page.

  11. #36
    Supreme Veteran
    mynd's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Down Under
    Age
    41
    Posts
    17,833
    Rep Power
    162
    Points
    167,157 (0 Banked)
    Items User name style
    Achievements IT'S OVER 9000!
    Quote Originally Posted by toontoonizer View Post
    I know you know this, your reputation precedes you, which is why I wonder you would say something like "64-bit colour". If you look on the first page of this post you did say this. There is no confusion, you weren't talking about a 64 bit display. You referred specifically to 64-bit colour. Go take a look. I was trying to illustrate there is no such thing as 64 bit colour not matter how many bits your frame buffer or pipeline is. Colour is only available in a maximum of 48 bits (and i will eat crow if the Xbox One outputs in 48 bit colour because I'm pretty sure only Nvidia Quadro or ATI FirePro professional graphics cards (costing upwards of 1000) provide support for 48 bit deep colour).

    This is my bone of contention with your comment on the first page.
    I actually said "64 bit color format"

    Which is a legit statement. There is such a thing as 64 bits color format.

    And again I'll reiterate that I was referring to the CB output.

  12. #37
    Apprentice
    toontoonizer's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Posts
    354
    Rep Power
    62
    Points
    176 (0 Banked)
    Quote Originally Posted by mynd View Post
    I actually said "64 bit color format"

    Which is a legit statement. There is such a thing as 64 bits color format.

    And again I'll reiterate that I was referring to the CB output.
    Can you please refer me to any kind of evidence/documentation of a 64 bit colour format with regard to what colour space that colour format would display in?

  13. #38
    Supreme Veteran
    mynd's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Down Under
    Age
    41
    Posts
    17,833
    Rep Power
    162
    Points
    167,157 (0 Banked)
    Items User name style
    Achievements IT'S OVER 9000!
    Quote Originally Posted by toontoonizer View Post
    Can you please refer me to any kind of evidence/documentation of a 64 bit colour format with regard to what colour space that colour format would display in?
    Who said anything about displaying it?
    There is 128 bit formats as well.

    Fp16=64 bits (rgba)
    Fp32=128 bits. (rgba)

    You keep getting stuck on the final output, which I never said was 64 bits.
    Games don't simply output a single framebuffer, every triple AAA game uses multiple framebuffers to post process everything from ambient occlusion, HDR, AA, depth of field effects etc etc.

    You can happily have one of you input formats as 64 bits, as long as you final output is 32 bits.
    Last edited by mynd; 11-27-2013 at 23:48.

  14. #39
    Supreme Veteran
    keefy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    The Sock Gap
    Posts
    17,942
    Rep Power
    127
    Points
    63,522 (0 Banked)
    Items Gran Turismo 5Michelle MarshDoomid SoftwareCommodore 64Metal Gear Solid
    Achievements IT'S OVER 9000!
    Quote Originally Posted by mynd View Post


    I am so glad I am waiting.
    Why do colors seem to pop more on the Xbox one version? Why are these machines so similar, but vastly different in video capture?

    Quote Originally Posted by mynd View Post
    There is a color difference, which I'm putting down to the video capture card at this point, that or the 64 bit color format of the XBO.
    Too early to tell.
    Actually after watching the video again, there seems to be no ambient occlusion on the PS4 version@1:24 of the IGN video. I imagine the final version will have it.

    The colour isnt the same check the sliders about 5 seconds prior.

  15. #40
    Supreme Veteran
    mynd's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Down Under
    Age
    41
    Posts
    17,833
    Rep Power
    162
    Points
    167,157 (0 Banked)
    Items User name style
    Achievements IT'S OVER 9000!
    Quote Originally Posted by keefy View Post
    The colour isnt the same check the sliders about 5 seconds prior.
    Yeah I know, you're a bit late to the party

    Digital Foundry did a better side by side, and it show no real difference other than the AO and some depth effects.

  16. #41
    Forum Guru
    jlippone's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Age
    37
    Posts
    3,824
    Rep Power
    86
    Points
    10,258 (0 Banked)
    Quote Originally Posted by mynd View Post
    You can happily have one of you input formats as 64 bits, as long as you final output is 32 bits.
    Indeed.
    This reminded me of the old good Dos times, we had 16-bit "truecolor" demo and someone asked us to make 8bit mode for it, so we did. (rendered 8:8:8 and output it directly to 2:3:3 )
    Last edited by jlippone; 11-28-2013 at 07:19. Reason: Sorry for Off topic.. ;)
    -------
    Couple of nice blog posts about OpenGL.
    The Truth on OpenGL Driver Quality
    Things that drive me nuts about OpenGL

  17. #42
    Newbie
    Majin187's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Age
    29
    Posts
    11
    Rep Power
    0
    Points
    222 (0 Banked)
    Relax nerds, it's the same damn game. Who cares which console it looks better on. Just shut up and race.

  18. #43
    Master Poster
    Beast of Bourbon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Blighttown
    PSN ID
    Azrael666
    Age
    30
    Posts
    3,494
    Rep Power
    77
    Points
    12,226 (0 Banked)
    Items DoomPlayStationDiablo IIIBlizzardDemons Souls CoverDark Souls Cover
    You waited 5 years to post that?!

  19. #44
    Member
    IshTing's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Sheffield
    PSN ID
    IshTing
    Age
    24
    Posts
    133
    Rep Power
    8
    Points
    2,094 (0 Banked)
    Quote Originally Posted by Majin187 View Post
    Relax nerds, it's the same damn game. Who cares which console it looks better on. Just shut up and race.
    Forums are places for discussions such as this to take place. Don't like it? Don't post.

  20. #45
    Valar Morghulis
    Serinous's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    PSN ID
    SerinousTSE
    Posts
    10,874
    Rep Power
    95
    Points
    21,277 (0 Banked)
    Items PS3 FatVitaPS3 Slim
    Achievements IT'S OVER 9000!
    Quote Originally Posted by Majin187 View Post
    Relax nerds, it's the same damn game. Who cares which console it looks better on. Just shut up and race.
    lol. speaker from a dude with manga avatar. dont judge others.




Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
vBCredits II Deluxe v2.1.0 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2010-2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.