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  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sub-stance1 View Post
    As far as we know right now, gaikai isn't capable of doing what ms cloud does in terms of scaling and compute. According to sony, Gakai is only going to be used as a streaming service. Sony has recently admitted that they don't really understand how MS is using their cloud. I don't know about the power stuff but MS says offloading CPU processes to the cloud can allow things like advanced AI and improved visual fidelity. Forza 5 supposedly uses the cloud for this.
    Do you even know what Gaikai is? There's nothing magical about MS's cloud that Sony can't do with Gaikai. Gaikai has already been established as a record-breaking cloud gaming service and now they're working with Sony. MS has been embarrassingly over-exaggerating the "power of the cloud". It's going to be a wonderful thing in the coming years, especially with increasing home bandwidth speeds, but some of the statements being made are... quite frankly... asinine.
    "The biggest adversary in our life is ourselves. We are what we are, in a sense, because of the dominating thoughts we allow to gather in our head. All concepts of self-improvement, all actions and paths we take, relate solely to our abstract image of ourselves. Life is limited only by how we really see ourselves and feel about our being. A great deal of pure self-knowledge and inner understanding allows us to lay an all-important foundation for the structure of our life from which we can perceive and take the right avenues.”

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    Basically, if you listen to most of the posters here, it is 100% possible for Gaikai to effectively render complete games in the cloud and 100% impossible for MS to improve PARTS of a game using the cloud.

    That seems like a bit of a dubious premise to me, but we will have to wait and see how it all plays out.

    In answer to the initial question, we haven't seen any evidence or claim that Gaikai was set up to do what MS has proposed that they will accomplish with the cloud.

    We also haven’t seen any evidence that MS can do what they claim, but we will have to wait and see.

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    Quote Originally Posted by justsayin View Post
    Basically, if you listen to most of the posters here, it is 100% possible for Gaikai to effectively render complete games in the cloud and 100% impossible for MS to improve PARTS of a game using the cloud.

    That seems like a bit of a dubious premise to me, but we will have to wait and see how it all plays out.

    In answer to the initial question, we haven't seen any evidence or claim that Gaikai was set up to do what MS has proposed that they will accomplish with the cloud.

    We also haven’t seen any evidence that MS can do what they claim, but we will have to wait and see.
    Gaikai streams games entirely from the cloud. That's what Gaikai is. MS is claiming the console is 4x more powerful with "cloud power" and they've yet to showcase anything that even remotely resembles this claim.

    The problem isn't with MS improving parts of games with the cloud... that's not some incredible task that defies logic... it's their magical fairy dust claim of 4x power that doesn't set right with anyone. If they do end up showing off something of that nature, then you can color me impressed. They keep talking about it... but have shown nothing to back up their claims. Also, with Gaikai... it's possible for the PS4 to play any generation of PS games on it... as well as other devices like tablets and the Vita that wouldn't otherwise be able to do such a thing by themselves. Gaikai is already an established cloud gaming service with over 50 million users. I don't really see cloud gaming becoming any sort of norm until next gen though. I hope Gaikai is as good as Sony is touting... and I also hope MS is working on something cool as well. But they're just making baseless claims with nothing to show. I want to see some of this 4x power in action. Forza is not an example of that.
    "The biggest adversary in our life is ourselves. We are what we are, in a sense, because of the dominating thoughts we allow to gather in our head. All concepts of self-improvement, all actions and paths we take, relate solely to our abstract image of ourselves. Life is limited only by how we really see ourselves and feel about our being. A great deal of pure self-knowledge and inner understanding allows us to lay an all-important foundation for the structure of our life from which we can perceive and take the right avenues.”

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    Quote Originally Posted by PBM View Post
    Gaikai streams games entirely from the cloud. That's what Gaikai is. MS is claiming the console is 4x more powerful with "cloud power" and they've yet to showcase anything that even remotely resembles this claim.

    The problem isn't with MS improving parts of games with the cloud... that's not some incredible task that defies logic... it's their magical fairy dust claim of 4x power that doesn't set right with anyone. If they do end up showing off something of that nature, then you can color me impressed. They keep talking about it... but have shown nothing to back up their claims. Also, with Gaikai... it's possible for the PS4 to play any generation of PS games on it... as well as other devices like tablets and the Vita that wouldn't otherwise be able to do such a thing by themselves. Gaikai is already an established cloud gaming service with over 50 million users. I don't really see cloud gaming becoming any sort of norm until next gen though. I hope Gaikai is as good as Sony is touting... and I also hope MS is working on something cool as well. But they're just making baseless claims with nothing to show. I want to see some of this 4x power in action. Forza is not an example of that.
    I would basically agree with everything you said. There is absolutely no proof of any cloud benefit as of yet.

    I do notice the AI difference in Forza, but that is not a 4X improvement on anything.

    Don’t get me wrong. I don’t inherently believe anything that MS has said about the cloud. I just don’t write off the possibility of it making a big difference down the road. My personal opinion (not backed by any fact at this point) is that there will be measurable benefits to the developers having access to the cloud resources that MS will provide, but it won’t be anywhere near a 4X improvement in real world application. To me, that feels like a theoretical maximum rather than an achievable number.
    Last edited by justsayin; 11-25-2013 at 12:50.

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    Sony have signed a deal with a company called rackspace for some sort of cloud processing partnership for something Sony are calling openstack

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    The cloud cannot replace hardware. What good is it to store code if your gpu doesn't have the power to render it? Commonsense people

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    Quote Originally Posted by PBM View Post
    Do you even know what Gaikai is? There's nothing magical about MS's cloud that Sony can't do with Gaikai.
    And how do you know this, and why are they teaming up with rackspace if they can do it with only gaikai. Sony has already stated that cloud gaming for them is going to be only streaming games to different devices.

    Gaikai has already been established as a record-breaking cloud gaming service and now they're working with Sony.
    I know. Its a game streaming service. MS has one of the leading cloud computing services in the world. A full scale cloud services that does compute and iirc,recently beat out Amazon. Even, sony has admitted that they don't really understand what MS is doing when it comes to it, which really doesn't surprise me since sony isn't that type of company. It explains why they would team up with rackspace IMO.

    Sony Worldwide Studios boss Shuhei Yoshida has branded Microsoft's messaging over Xbox One's cloud computing capabilities as "confusing", and admitted that he "totally doesn't understand" the way his rival plans to use cloud processing.


    "We've been clear on what cloud gaming means, and that's getting games to run on the server and sending that video signal to a distant device," Yoshida told GamesIndustry.biz.
    "The way they are using cloud computing seems very different and I totally don't understand what they mean by that. So we can't react to what they are saying because we don't understand."
    Yoshida admits that he had to read an article produced by tech experts Digital Foundry to get an understanding of Microsoft's plans, but suggests that he still doesn't fully understand how it will work.
    "[Digital Foundry] went through all the computing tasks a game goes through," Yoshida continued, "and for each one they checked off if it can actually be done on the server versus the client, and most of the tasks a game has to perform, they said, cannot be done on the server because of the huge latency and the bandwidth.
    "There's so much data going back and forth between the CPU and memory and GPU inside the console compared to going through the internet... There were maybe four or five tasks that actually could be done on the server. So that was very educational to me. After reading the article, the Microsoft message was even more confusing to me."
    http://www.videogamer.com/news/yoshi...computing.html

    MS has been embarrassingly over-exaggerating the "power of the cloud". It's going to be a wonderful thing in the coming years, especially with increasing home bandwidth speeds, but some of the statements being made are... quite frankly... asinine.
    I guess we will find out this gen, but according to them it's possible to offload certain things like cpu task to the cloud that the console would normally do. This would take some of the load off the console hardware.

    Quote Originally Posted by thanatos144 View Post
    The cloud cannot replace hardware. What good is it to store code if your gpu doesn't have the power to render it? Commonsense people

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    They never said it could. They said it could free up resources normally used by the hardware.

    Quote Originally Posted by dj1979 View Post
    Sony have signed a deal with a company called rackspace for some sort of cloud processing partnership for something Sony are calling openstack
    yep, and openstack is cloud software technology.(not named or owned by sony) Rackspace is just one of many that uses it.
    Last edited by Sub-stance1; 11-25-2013 at 15:20.

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    Clouds can be used for COMPUTE, no doubt... SETI @ Home, BIONIC etc...
    but...
    They aren't going to speed up game scene rendering... If it can take some resources off in the BG it can make a slight impact, but, nothing like having 50% more graphics hardware and 100% more RAM bandwidth!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sub-stance1 View Post
    And how do you know this, and why are they teaming up with rackspace if they can do it with only gaikai. Sony has already stated that cloud gaming for them is going to be only streaming games to different devices.

    I know. Its a game streaming service. MS has one of the leading cloud computing services in the world. A full scale cloud services that does compute and iirc,recently beat out Amazon. Even, sony has admitted that they don't really understand what MS is doing when it comes to it, which really doesn't surprise me since sony isn't that type of company. It explains why they would team up with rackspace IMO.





    I guess we will find out this gen, but according to them it's possible to offload certain things like cpu task to the cloud that the console would normally do. This would take some of the load off the console hardware.


    They never said it could. They said it could free up resources normally used by the hardware.


    yep, and openstack is cloud software technology.(not named or owned by sony) Rackspace is just one of many that uses it.
    I'd love to see some sources to these claims so that I can have a better grasp:

    Sony has already stated that cloud gaming for them is going to be only streaming games to different devices. (why partner with Rackspace...?)
    Sony has admitted that they don't really understand what MS is doing when it comes to it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by John Willaford View Post
    Clouds can be used for COMPUTE, no doubt... SETI @ Home, BIONIC etc...
    but...
    It's seems sony won't be using gaikai for that reason. At least right now it doesn't. I don't think Gaikai is on the same scale as ones like azure and amazon. They are massive and have world wide servers.



    They aren't going to speed up game scene rendering... If it can take some resources off in the BG it can make a slight impact, but, nothing like having 50% more graphics hardware and 100% more RAM bandwidth!
    I don't know about all that 50%/100% stuff, but i don't think MS ever claimed that either.


    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost View Post
    I'd love to see some sources to these claims so that I can have a better grasp:

    Sony has already stated that cloud gaming for them is going to be only streaming games to different devices. (why partner with Rackspace...?)
    Sony has admitted that they don't really understand what MS is doing when it comes to it.
    I posted info a while back about MS compute. You even commented in the thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost View Post
    Sony is going to have to match this dedi server action because that's badass. I mean MS has 300,000 of these, and even if they through out a hundred servers per big release, they'd probably still never run out.
    Xbox One’s Azure Cloud Computing Solution Ranked #1, Beats Out Amazon S3

    http://www.psu.com/forums/showthread...-Out-Amazon-S3
    Last edited by Sub-stance1; 11-25-2013 at 16:07.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sub-stance1 View Post
    It's seems sony won't be using gaikai for that reason. At least right now it doesn't. I don't think Gaikai is on the same scale as ones like azure and amazon. They are massive and have world wide servers.





    I don't know about all that 50%/100% stuff, but i don't think MS ever claimed that either.




    I posted info a while back about MS compute. You even commented in the thread.



    Xbox One’s Azure Cloud Computing Solution Ranked #1, Beats Out Amazon S3

    http://www.psu.com/forums/showthread...-Out-Amazon-S3

    I'm still missing references that point me to Sony saying they don't know what MS is doing, and that Sony's only cloud ambitions are Gaikai...or did I miss something in that article?
    Last edited by Ghost; 11-25-2013 at 16:17.

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    Snake oil.

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    Just hope this Gaikai doesn't drop a lot like Music Unlimited does for me. Nothing would make me rage more than completing a level and the connection is lost.


    $Greatness$ Awaits™


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    Quote Originally Posted by Sub-stance1 View Post
    It's seems sony won't be using gaikai for that reason. At least right now it doesn't. I don't think Gaikai is on the same scale as ones like azure and amazon. They are massive and have world wide servers.





    I don't know about all that 50%/100% stuff, but i don't think MS ever claimed that either.




    I posted info a while back about MS compute. You even commented in the thread.



    Xbox One’s Azure Cloud Computing Solution Ranked #1, Beats Out Amazon S3

    http://www.psu.com/forums/showthread...-Out-Amazon-S3

    I was referring to the PS4 having 50% more GPU hardware and over twice the general memory bandwidth (100% more) as the XBO.
    SONY with David Perry's Gaikai services will render PS1/2/3 games in the cloud, using farms of either emulation or native chip servers to run the games, and stream their image frames at a max of 720p to the user and receive from the user realtime input controls.

    MS talks about using Azure to hose XBO for Cloud Processing. As to having dedicated servers for 3P companies to run on a standard network, it's admirable, and streaming would be great to offer old games as well, but they have not advertised any such service.

    What becomes highly dubious is stating that your going to send various bits of real time data to the cloud and get results back. There has to be a real time solver model in the cloud for the game, a solver server essentially, that takes enough data to position those things in that game world precisely and get those results and send them back to the user in the same temporal envelope. Meaning that the data has to mean something to the client machine in the time that it returns. Otherwise, if they send lighting and water model data (their words, remember) to the cloud and ask for results back, everything will look off.
    The idea is just preposterous.
    This knocks it down to having a model server which merely tracks the statistics of the games and sends back all of the changes, the 'physics of the universe' in the sense of all the massive changes happening in real time. THAT is something you use servers for. MS already knew the XBO was coming in under powered and made these 4X power in the cloud claims hoping sheep would blindly believe they were getting 4x their money's worth.

    That's not gonna happen.
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    Quote Originally Posted by John Willaford View Post
    I was referring to the PS4 having 50% more GPU hardware and over twice the general memory bandwidth (100% more) as the XBO.
    SONY with David Perry's Gaikai services will render PS1/2/3 games in the cloud, using farms of either emulation or native chip servers to run the games, and stream their image frames at a max of 720p to the user and receive from the user realtime input controls.

    MS talks about using Azure to hose XBO for Cloud Processing. As to having dedicated servers for 3P companies to run on a standard network, it's admirable, and streaming would be great to offer old games as well, but they have not advertised any such service.

    What becomes highly dubious is stating that your going to send various bits of real time data to the cloud and get results back. There has to be a real time solver model in the cloud for the game, a solver server essentially, that takes enough data to position those things in that game world precisely and get those results and send them back to the user in the same temporal envelope. Meaning that the data has to mean something to the client machine in the time that it returns. Otherwise, if they send lighting and water model data (their words, remember) to the cloud and ask for results back, everything will look off.
    The idea is just preposterous.
    This knocks it down to having a model server which merely tracks the statistics of the games and sends back all of the changes, the 'physics of the universe' in the sense of all the massive changes happening in real time. THAT is something you use servers for. MS already knew the XBO was coming in under powered and made these 4X power in the cloud claims hoping sheep would blindly believe they were getting 4x their money's worth.

    That's not gonna happen.
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    Quote Originally Posted by John Willaford View Post
    I was referring to the PS4 having 50% more GPU hardware and over twice the general memory bandwidth (100% more) as the XBO.
    SONY with David Perry's Gaikai services will render PS1/2/3 games in the cloud, using farms of either emulation or native chip servers to run the games, and stream their image frames at a max of 720p to the user and receive from the user realtime input controls.

    MS talks about using Azure to hose XBO for Cloud Processing. As to having dedicated servers for 3P companies to run on a standard network, it's admirable, and streaming would be great to offer old games as well, but they have not advertised any such service.

    What becomes highly dubious is stating that your going to send various bits of real time data to the cloud and get results back. There has to be a real time solver model in the cloud for the game, a solver server essentially, that takes enough data to position those things in that game world precisely and get those results and send them back to the user in the same temporal envelope. Meaning that the data has to mean something to the client machine in the time that it returns. Otherwise, if they send lighting and water model data (their words, remember) to the cloud and ask for results back, everything will look off.
    The idea is just preposterous.
    This knocks it down to having a model server which merely tracks the statistics of the games and sends back all of the changes, the 'physics of the universe' in the sense of all the massive changes happening in real time. THAT is something you use servers for. MS already knew the XBO was coming in under powered and made these 4X power in the cloud claims hoping sheep would blindly believe they were getting 4x their money's worth.

    That's not gonna happen
    .
    I take that to be just speculation unless you actually have some experience with azure/ xbl compute. All we know from the information is Gaikai seems like it will be used differently from azure and it's a long way from being ready. So far devs have backed up the claim of offloading certain tasks on the cloud to free up resources for the hardware for xb1. I'm not an expert on this stuff and won't say what is or isn't possible. It's too early to be making predictions. I'm sure ms had this stuff planned for years and they didn't just come up with it overnight. Their console was built with the cloud in mind , so I wouldn't be surprised in a few years we will be seeing more games built around their cloud service. We already have games like TF and sunset overdrive that will be taking advantage of cloud computing in some form. I expect it will take time with this just like it will take time for devs to get better at programming for the consoles.
    Last edited by Sub-stance1; 12-15-2013 at 19:58.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sub-stance1 View Post
    I take that to be just speculation unless you actually have some experience with azure/ xbl compute. All we know from the information is Gaikai seems like it will be used differently from azure and it's a long way from being ready. So far devs have backed up the claim of offloading certain tasks on the cloud to free up resources for the hardware for xb1. I'm not an expert on this stuff and won't say what is or isn't possible. It's too early to be making predictions. I'm sure ms had this stuff planned for years and they didn't just come up with it overnight. Their console was built with the cloud in mind , so I wouldn't be surprised in a few years we will be seeing more games built around their cloud service. We already have games like TF and sunset overdrive that will be taking advantage of cloud computing in some form. I expect it will take time with this just like it will take time for devs to get better at programming for the consoles.
    Their platform was built with serving your own TV to you that you already pay for while selling their own advertising and serving up programming from their own cloud in mind, while also taking more of a casual approach to gaming, hedging their bets that More casual gaming and Nintendo style gamers would be attracted to the Kinect and that their hardcore base would just choose XBO because 'They are xbox people'.
    After Balmer got involved, it got messy. All his job ever was as he stated is how to make money out of things, and that's where he pushed the XBO. No problem with that, but, the early fiasco that ended up being all reversed and the confusion it caused did XBO no favors.

    That the system is built for the clouds shows a very narrow consideration for worldwide living standards.
    Much of Europe and asia couldn't possibly support cloud gaming properly, as well as a good part of Rural USA. I won't even go into South America and Africa.
    US cities, Japan, Hong Kong and Taiwan and possibly Malaysia's big islands are likely the only places with internet speeds which really could leverage cloud gaming's potential, and they still don't have the real world bandwidth to render graphics in real time.

    Game Servers have always computed 'something'. It computes the positions of the AI enemies and broadcasts game statistics to all client machines. So, other than enemy targets/bosses online, the boss and characters are all cross loaded into each client and then their stats/positions etc are broadcast to each gamer, the model isn't broadcast back frame by frame, and certainly it's 'lighting ' isn't cast on the server, Real Time Visuals are all computed on the client... because the server would potentially be stuck with calculating the visuals for N number of clients and sending that individual data back to each client, such as in a FPS perspective game. It's just alot of bull they are spreading around, and if they try to go beyond what is smart to do, they will make titles that won't run properly for over half of their client base.

    That's why their outlandish statements irk many of us who do know and work in networking/programming etc. We heard 'bull$#@!' echo in our heads as those words were first spoken and read. When everyone gets 1Gb/s fiber for $25 a month available at their homes, or faster, then we can talk some serious uses for Compute, but they are going to need some serious servers.
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    Quote Originally Posted by John Willaford View Post
    Their platform was built with serving your own TV to you that you already pay for while selling their own advertising and serving up programming from their own cloud in mind, while also taking more of a casual approach to gaming, hedging their bets that More casual gaming and Nintendo style gamers would be attracted to the Kinect and that their hardcore base would just choose XBO because 'They are xbox people'. After Balmer got involved, it got messy. All his job ever was as he stated is how to make money out of things, and that's where he pushed the XBO. No problem with that, but, the early fiasco that ended up being all reversed and the confusion it caused did XBO no favors.
    After Ballmer got involved? Baller is the one who gave the original Xbox the go ahead. So he was always involved. And you think the others aren't into this to make money? They make consoles and games just for $#@!s and giggles?..lol. Xbox and play station have the same goal and it involves the color green. I don't see neither giving away consoles because they just love their fans.




    That the system is built for the clouds shows a very narrow consideration for worldwide living standards.
    Much of Europe and asia couldn't possibly support cloud gaming properly, as well as a good part of Rural USA. I won't even go into South America and Africa.
    US cities, Japan, Hong Kong and Taiwan and possibly Malaysia's big islands are likely the only places with internet speeds which really could leverage cloud gaming's potential, and they still don't have the real world bandwidth to render graphics in real time.
    So that means they should can the whole thing? Does that mean Sony should can Gaikai because according to them the same problems exist for their service in Europe? The internet should of been put off because all countries couldn't support it?


    Game Servers have always computed 'something'. It computes the positions of the AI enemies and broadcasts game statistics to all client machines. So, other than enemy targets/bosses online, the boss and characters are all cross loaded into each client and then their stats/positions etc are broadcast to each gamer, the model isn't broadcast back frame by frame, and certainly it's 'lighting ' isn't cast on the server, Real Time Visuals are all computed on the client... because the server would potentially be stuck with calculating the visuals for N number of clients and sending that individual data back to each client, such as in a FPS perspective game. It's just alot of bull they are spreading around, and if they try to go beyond what is smart to do, they will make titles that won't run properly for over half of their client base.

    Do you know that for sure or are you just speculating? I guess it's a bunch of bull that they have 300,000 servers too right?


    That's why their outlandish statements irk many of us who do know and work in networking/programming etc. We heard 'bull$#@!' echo in our heads as those words were first spoken and read. When everyone gets 1Gb/s fiber for $25 a month available at their homes, or faster, then we can talk some serious uses for Compute, but they are going to need some serious servers.

    it doesn't irk respawn, turn 10,insomniac and other gaming studios out there. I think I will take their word over someone on a forum who has never developed a console game and know so little about what this stuff can actually do.

  23. #69
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    300,000 servers could mean anything, it doesn't mean millions of XBox One chips on server racks waiting to somehow quadruple enhance your gaming, which is what Microsoft wants you to imagine from their words. For every XBOX ONE YOU BUY YOU HAVE 4 IN THE CLOUD... really?

    Are they going to have 360Million Servers/Chips if they sell 80,000,000 units one day eventually, will they have 16 million chips in servers when they sell 4 million units?
    NO.

    http://videogamesandnews.com/xbox-on...the-real-deal/

    They are just using Azure for dedicated servers and pricing it affordably for publishers, hopefully large and small. You can use Compute for some things... pretty much what any other game developer in history ever has used their server for... That Froza 5 might study gamer patterns and adjust AI doesn't mesmerize me, it's kind of a normal thing. It's just called good AI or Adaptive AI, whoooptie doo.
    It's not 4 XBOX Ones in the cloud, never will be.

    SONY's signed a deal with Rackspace apparently, so, there comes that equivalent soon. Hopefully SONY will also have a good money maker where by tablet and phablet owners can stream older PS games to their screens over WiFi or even 4G. It'd be nice if XBOX One owners could someday access older content from the XBO.

    The statements I made about worldwide broadband adoption stand and are self evident, think harder.
    If they try to do to much with compute requiring a certain guaranteed broadband condition to exist, ideally... do you think they will really sell enough copies of said title? You can try to piss on anyone's toasties by saying yes, so, go ahead, it's all you know how to do anyway, i know better on this point.

    This is why dipstick now works at Zinga, i'll say that much.
    Sleeping very soundly on a Saturday morning I was dreaming
    I was Al Capone
    There's a rumour going round, gotta clear outta town
    I'm smelling like a dry fish bone
    Here come the Law, gonna break down the door, gonna carry me
    away once more
    Never, never, never get it any more
    Gotta get away from this stone cold floor
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    Stone cold crazy, you know

  24. #70
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    300,000 servers could mean anything, it doesn't mean millions of XBox One chips on server racks waiting to somehow quadruple enhance your gaming, which is what Microsoft wants you to imagine from their words. For every XBOX ONE YOU BUY YOU HAVE 4 IN THE CLOUD... really?

    Are they going to have 360Million Servers/Chips if they sell 80,000,000 units one day eventually, will they have 16 million chips in servers when they sell 4 million units?
    NO.

    http://videogamesandnews.com/xbox-on...the-real-deal/

    They are just using Azure for dedicated servers and pricing it affordably for publishers, hopefully large and small. You can use Compute for some things... pretty much what any other game developer in history ever has used their server for... That Froza 5 might study gamer patterns and adjust AI doesn't mesmerize me, it's kind of a normal thing. It's just called good AI or Adaptive AI, whoooptie doo.
    It's not 4 XBOX Ones in the cloud, never will be.

    SONY's signed a deal with Rackspace apparently, so, there comes that equivalent soon. Hopefully SONY will also have a good money maker where by tablet and phablet owners can stream older PS games to their screens over WiFi or even 4G. It'd be nice if XBOX One owners could someday access older content from the XBO.

    The statements I made about worldwide broadband adoption stand and are self evident, think harder.
    If they try to do to much with compute requiring a certain guaranteed broadband condition to exist, ideally... do you think they will really sell enough copies of said title? You can try to piss on anyone's toasties by saying yes, so, go ahead, it's all you know how to do anyway, i know better on this point.

    This is why dipstick now works at Zinga, i'll say that much.
    Sleeping very soundly on a Saturday morning I was dreaming
    I was Al Capone
    There's a rumour going round, gotta clear outta town
    I'm smelling like a dry fish bone
    Here come the Law, gonna break down the door, gonna carry me
    away once more
    Never, never, never get it any more
    Gotta get away from this stone cold floor
    Crazy
    Stone cold crazy, you know

  25. #71
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    I feel bad for XBOX One owners who have to read my posts, i'll admit that.
    I pull no punches...

    Had it been awesome, i'd be using that HDMI port myself.
    I just wanted that feature for reminders to exit gaming and see the stuff I planned on watching once in a while.
    The naivate there was that the HDMI In port would be used for the gamer's benefit. Not so much.
    Shrink your pict out to keep stats up all around it.... maybe if you have a 60inch or better, i'd never do it on my 50in.
    Alot of the rest of the things they did with it kind of are blah to me.
    Including Windows 8 and HyperVisor still makes my head whirl.
    Had to sneak Windows in there didn't they, yuck.

    I honestly wish Comcast would let me use the HDMI In's on the X1 cable box and , pop up reminders, that solves what I wanted to do really.

    Microsoft somehow made a system which the developers either aren't ready for or does not have the cajones MS thought it would.
    It runs Sports games in 1080p, right now, but all the stuff requiring high terrain turnover is down to 720p.
    720p is NOT where gamers want to be. Hell, some are mildly confused these new systems don't run games in 4K since 4K tv's are out!
    That's just an economic reality, most high end PC's costing over $1000USD can't run a game in 4K reliably (multiple cards SLI/Crossfire issues).
    So, it upscales images to send out a 1080p signal such that if someone checks their TV it says their game is in 1080p. Congrats.

    If Microsoft can get their DX tech to pipeline enough tiled resources in such a way that it makes up for the bandwidth issues , they still run into the 50% deficit in GPU circuitry , and that is the big kahuna. The cloud just doesn't fix all of this.

    In other words...

    it does not compute!
    Sleeping very soundly on a Saturday morning I was dreaming
    I was Al Capone
    There's a rumour going round, gotta clear outta town
    I'm smelling like a dry fish bone
    Here come the Law, gonna break down the door, gonna carry me
    away once more
    Never, never, never get it any more
    Gotta get away from this stone cold floor
    Crazy
    Stone cold crazy, you know

  26. #72
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    Achievements IT'S OVER 9000!
    Quote Originally Posted by John Willaford View Post
    300,000 servers could mean anything, it doesn't mean millions of XBox One chips on server racks waiting to somehow quadruple enhance your gaming, which is what Microsoft wants you to imagine from their words. For every XBOX ONE YOU BUY YOU HAVE 4 IN THE CLOUD... really?



    Are they going to have 360Million Servers/Chips if they sell 80,000,000 units one day eventually, will they have 16 million chips in servers when they sell 4 million units?
    NO.
    I don't recall them ever saying anything like that. I do remember people saying that the cloud stuff was just PR and they didn't have those servers. I'm not saying what can't be done but i'm not just writing it off as BS because i don't know. Do you have any proof other than being pessimistic about any of these claims?


    They are just using Azure for dedicated servers and pricing it affordably for publishers, hopefully large and small. You can use Compute for some things... pretty much what any other game developer in history ever has used their server for... That Froza 5 might study gamer patterns and adjust AI doesn't mesmerize me, it's kind of a normal thing. It's just called good AI or Adaptive AI, whoooptie doo.
    It's not 4 XBOX Ones in the cloud, never will be.
    How many games are using servers for AI on last gen consoles? You make it sound like all devs have been using this technique for years and it's a industry standard.






    SONY's signed a deal with Rackspace apparently, so, there comes that equivalent soon. Hopefully SONY will also have a good money maker where by tablet and phablet owners can stream older PS games to their screens over WiFi or even 4G. It'd be nice if XBOX One owners could someday access older content from the XBO.
    Do you kow what they are using Rackspace for or are you just speculating again? How do you know the deal isnt just for renting servers to expand Gaikai?


    The statements I made about worldwide broadband adoption stand and are self evident, think harder.
    If they try to do to much with compute requiring a certain guaranteed broadband condition to exist, ideally... do you think they will really sell enough copies of said title? You can try to piss on anyone's toasties by saying yes, so, go ahead, it's all you know how to do anyway, i know better on this point.

    This is why dipstick now works at Zinga, i'll say that much.
    I can't predict the future. I guess we will have to wait and see what happens. It may not take as much bandwidth as people think.
    Last edited by Sub-stance1; 12-16-2013 at 06:54.

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