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  1. #26
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    so $471 is for the console + kinect. that's not bad. i knew something was up here.

    i don't know too much about manufacturing costs but it seems like their guesses are bloated or under-represented.
    Quote Originally Posted by MATRIX 2 View Post
    I would be very surprised if there wasn't some price cut/price reduction promotion for the X1 sometime in 2014. I would also be surprised if MS didn't have an aggressive strategy for cost reduction regarding the X1 hardware/ components.
    of course they have to. that's why i said that it's important when they do it...i'm not saying that they won't do a price cut. I just don’t think they can possibly be as aggressive as Sony can as their console is bare bones compared to the X1. There isn’t going to be a Kinect-less bundle.

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    Microsoft doesn't seem to know how to make money anymore....

  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by thanatos144 View Post
    Microsoft doesn't seem to know how to make money anymore....
    their strategy is just as good as Sony's, if not better.

    They may not be trying to save gaming here but I don’t think they have a choice (well technically they are saving gaming because gaming in the form it is today, will not survive, Sony can only prolong it). At the same time, Sony doesn’t have a choice “but” to save gaming for the time being. So they’re both doing what they need to do.
    Last edited by Omar; 11-27-2013 at 16:52.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sufi View Post
    their strategy is just as good as Sony's, if not better.

    They may not be trying to save gaming here but I don’t think they have a choice (well technically they are saving gaming because gaming in the form it is today, will not survive, Sony can only prolong it). At the same time, Sony doesn’t have a choice “but” to save gaming for the time being. So they’re both doing what they need to do.
    There strategy is better huh? So that means they are out selling PS4 right? It means windows 8 isn't a giant piece of $#@! right? Means Bing is rolling in the dough correct? Microsoft is making more wrong choices then right ones. Their bread and butter software is going to $#@! as well.

  5. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by MATRIX 2 View Post
    I would be very surprised if there wasn't some price cut/price reduction promotion for the X1 sometime in 2014. I would also be surprised if MS didn't have an aggressive strategy for cost reduction regarding the X1 hardware/ components.
    If it performs poorly after launch like PS3 did, then you will likely see a $50 price drop by the end of July. It will make the appeal of the system rise. Just don't know how much. I honestly don't know if this thing is going to skyrocket without a kinectless SKU. Could likely see that next fall. Just thinking out loud.




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  6. #31
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    Wall of text:

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sufi View Post
    Wall of text:
    Microsoft is a SOFTWARE company so of course it is their bread and butter and your wall of text still does nothing to deter the fact that it is failing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by thanatos144 View Post
    Microsoft is a SOFTWARE company so of course it is their bread and butter and your wall of text still does nothing to deter the fact that it is failing.
    if you read it, i clearly state that it's failing but my point is that it's too early to tell. they both have problems. MS just has some problems early on. These problems pertain to gamers, not the average consumer. You need to understand that gamers are a minority, not the majority. Sony will eventually deal with their own set of problems just as bigÖin the next few years. So itís too early to call their strategy as a whole failing. Because weíre not even one year in. remember how the PS3 failed? Yeah, it didnít.

    MS is a software company but what does that have to do with the Xbox 1? Windows 8 failed but that isnít going to matter because they have a monopoly and as long as their OS is supported the most, they donít have to worry. On the OS front, their issue is that theyíre competing with themselves because people donít want to upgrade to Windows 8 and some are downgrading. But theyíre still buying ďWindowsĒ.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sufi View Post
    my perspective was wrong lol.
    imagine that..

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yungstar 2006 View Post
    imagine that..
    jab thrown. didn't know we were still doing that. lol. well done sir, you win today's forums.

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    I don't think MS will cut the price of the xbone next year. I think they'll at least wait until after halo 5 is released.

    Destiny and Middle Earth: Shadow of Mordor is all I need for the rest of the year.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Two4DaMoney View Post
    I don't think MS will cut the price of the xbone next year. I think they'll at least wait until after halo 5 is released.
    that would be a suicide.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sufi View Post
    that would be a suicide.
    It is going to be interesting to see what happens with a new CEO. 2014 may very well be a crossroads year for the Xbox brand.
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  15. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sufi View Post
    so $471 is for the console + kinect. that's not bad. i knew something was up here.

    i don't know too much about manufacturing costs but it seems like their guesses are bloated or under-represented.
    of course they have to. that's why i said that it's important when they do it...i'm not saying that they won't do a price cut. I just donít think they can possibly be as aggressive as Sony can as their console is bare bones compared to the X1. There isnít going to be a Kinect-less bundle.
    Sony was hurting with the PS3. Things have improved a bit since that generation was winding down, but sony need to make money off of the PS4. And seeing as how the X1 is ~$100 more, sony isn't really under any pressure to do price cuts.

    The way I see it, MS will do some kind of price cut/promotion for the X1 in 2014 (~$50 off) and sony will have a PS4 price cut (likely ~$50) in 2015. (probably after E3, possibly not until the end of fall/beginning of holiday season)

    I'd expect MS to have another (~$50) price cut in 2015, but the question is when will the X1 reach price parity with the PS4? And can they do that while offering Kinect with every console? My guess is that it will likely happen in 2016 (possibly with a smaller/redesigned console (assuming a 6 year lifecycle before being replaced with the next generation xbox console)) and still retain kinect. (I'm sure they will find way to make it cost less to produce as well, and I think the slim console redesign of the X1 may be the first time a kinectless X1 may be offered (but probably not)) I'd also expect the second PS4 price cut to come in 2017. (~$50 again) By the time the PS5 comes around I expect the PS4 to be at ~$250, $199 at the bare minimum. (but I think $250 is more likely)

    Quote Originally Posted by thanatos144 View Post
    There strategy is better huh? So that means they are out selling PS4 right? It means windows 8 isn't a giant piece of $#@! right? Means Bing is rolling in the dough correct? Microsoft is making more wrong choices then right ones. Their bread and butter software is going to $#@! as well.
    Clearly you have no idea what you are talking about.

    Quote Originally Posted by PS4freak View Post
    If it performs poorly after launch like PS3 did, then you will likely see a $50 price drop by the end of July. It will make the appeal of the system rise. Just don't know how much. I honestly don't know if this thing is going to skyrocket without a kinectless SKU. Could likely see that next fall. Just thinking out loud.
    Based on what I said above (assuming it plays out like that) I see it doing very well. At $450 (or $50 more than a standalone PS4) with kinect, the X1 becomes significantly more compelling (cheaper than a PS4 + camera).

    Whenever the X1 reaches price parity with the PS4 (hopefully including kinect), it will be pretty much a no brainier. At that point the only major differentiator for the PS4 is its exclusive titles.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sufi View Post
    Wall of text:
    I mostly agree with the general points made in that post. Sony had to get back to business after the PS3, they needed to win back gamers and re establish the gaming prowess/focus of the playstation brand. Which is like you said, why the PS4 is bare bones. i.e. It only does gaming approach. Sony may do well with gamers with the PS4, but the days of consoles essentially only being gaming machines with a few (mostly superficial) features (typically non gaming related) tacked on and doing really well with all consumers, is coming to a close.

    While people may see what MS is doing with the X1 as a mistake, they are putting themselves in a better position for the next generation of consoles, which must offer all kinds of entertainment, not just be a gaming box.

    And sony needs to make money on the PS4 (MS does too, but they have deeper pockets and did much better with profits with the 360) so they can't be aggressive (like I expect MS to be) with price cuts for the PS4.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sufi View Post
    if you read it, i clearly state that it's failing but my point is that it's too early to tell. they both have problems. MS just has some problems early on. These problems pertain to gamers, not the average consumer. You need to understand that gamers are a minority, not the majority. Sony will eventually deal with their own set of problems just as bigÖin the next few years. So itís too early to call their strategy as a whole failing. Because weíre not even one year in. remember how the PS3 failed? Yeah, it didnít.

    MS is a software company but what does that have to do with the Xbox 1? Windows 8 failed but that isnít going to matter because they have a monopoly and as long as their OS is supported the most, they donít have to worry. On the OS front, their issue is that theyíre competing with themselves because people donít want to upgrade to Windows 8 and some are downgrading. But theyíre still buying ďWindowsĒ.
    Um, Windows 8 did not and will not "fail". It has similar sales compared to 7 and XP over the same period of time. Windows 8 may not end up selling as many copies as 7, but a big reason for that is due to timing. And I have no doubt W8 will sell much more than vista (which wasn't a failure either, even though "it only had 400 million sales")

    Quote Originally Posted by Two4DaMoney View Post
    I don't think MS will cut the price of the xbone next year. I think they'll at least wait until after halo 5 is released.
    Seeing as that wouldn't be expected till ~2016, that would be highly unlikely to say the least.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sufi View Post
    that would be a suicide.
    How come?

    I forgot about Titanfall. If that game moves consoles then MS certainly won't cut the price. Halo 5 is a sure system seller. I think they'll want to ride out the $499 wave until the end.

    Quote Originally Posted by MATRIX 2 View Post
    Seeing as that wouldn't be expected till ~2016, that would be highly unlikely to say the least.
    Halo 5 comes next year.
    Last edited by Two4DaMoney; 11-27-2013 at 21:05.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Two4DaMoney View Post
    How come?

    I forgot about Titanfall. If that game moves consoles then MS certainly won't cut the price. Halo 5 is a sure system seller. I think they'll want to ride out the $499 wave until the end.


    Halo 5 comes next year.
    No, that is a separate halo game, not halo 5 the sequel to halo 4.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MATRIX 2 View Post
    No, that is a separate halo game, not halo 5 the sequel to halo 4.
    How is this not a sequel to halo 4?


    Edit:nvm. I see the info. I still think it would have the same selling power of a halo 5 due to master chief being in it.


    Last edited by Two4DaMoney; 11-27-2013 at 21:40.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MATRIX 2 View Post
    Clearly you have no idea what you are talking about.
    In the interest of interesting and intelligent discussion you should refute someone's claims with the aid of some evidence. Without such content in your post, messages like this make it appear as though you're the one who clearly has no idea what you're talking about.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost View Post
    In the interest of interesting and intelligent discussion you should refute someone's claims with the aid of some evidence. Without such content in your post, messages like this make it appear as though you're the one who clearly has no idea what you're talking about.
    Some posts are too stupid to warrant a worthwhile response. That post is one of them. It should be blatantly obvious to anyone that can objectively analyze information that the content of that post is essentially bull$#@!. Hell I'd go so far as to say that that is basically blatant trolling.

    If you can't see this, than I suggest you pay more attention to the posts.

  21. #45
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    I know I am not a technology guru, but could this have something to do with Japanese or Asian technology/electronics VS U.S. technology? What I am saying, could it be their technology is just more advanced and less costly than U.S. technology?

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Black Wolf View Post
    I know I am not a technology guru, but could this have something to do with Japanese or Asian technology/electronics VS U.S. technology? What I am saying, could it be their technology is just more advanced and less costly than U.S. technology?
    that's definitely part of the reason but i don't know if that's the whole reason. something doesn't make sense here...it must have something in there that's driving up the cost.

    how could it cost $90 more and have less?

    i'm sure they saved more by just having a behemoth of a casing because they could just throw everything together. Sony probably had to spend a lot more money trying to make everything smaller and fit it all into a small form factor INCLUDING the brick...that's insane.

    these figures must not be accurate or there's something we're missing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Black Wolf View Post
    I know I am not a technology guru, but could this have something to do with Japanese or Asian technology/electronics VS U.S. technology? What I am saying, could it be their technology is just more advanced and less costly than U.S. technology?
    You do realize that American companies designed the technology right? Asians just tend to manufacture it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sufi View Post
    that's definitely part of the reason but i don't know if that's the whole reason. something doesn't make sense here...it must have something in there that's driving up the cost.

    how could it cost $90 more and have less?

    i'm sure they saved more by just having a behemoth of a casing because they could just throw everything together. Sony probably had to spend a lot more money trying to make everything smaller and fit it all into a small form factor INCLUDING the brick...that's insane.

    these figures must not be accurate or there's something we're missing.
    Esram and the complexity of producing such a chip would be the likely reasons. Also you have to take out the cost of kinect from the $90 so its more like ~$15 more.

  24. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by MATRIX 2 View Post
    You do realize that American companies designed the technology right? Asians just tend to manufacture it.
    I wouldn't be so sure of that or the X1 would've been just as small and efficient looking.

    I think the Japanese designed it and they gave it to IBM to make it. EDIT: I'm sorry, I meant, IBM designed the chips but they didn't design the console itself.

    Esram and the complexity of producing such a chip would be the likely reasons. Also you have to take out the cost of kinect from the $90 so its more like ~$15 more.
    ok but still more right? In the end, if, at least, part of the reason was to save costs then why did they even bother with this setup? :S

    we're missing something. or they just failed there.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sufi View Post
    I wouldn't be so sure of that or the X1 would've been just as small and efficient looking.

    I think the Japanese designed it and they gave it to IBM to make it. EDIT: I'm sorry, I meant, IBM designed the chips but they didn't design the console itself.

    ok but still more right? In the end, if, at least, part of the reason was to save costs then why did they even bother with this setup? :S

    we're missing something. or they just failed there.
    The goal of the X1 wasn't to be small and/or efficient looking. So it isn't. It is designed to fit in with home theater components and have a long lifespan while being quiet/power efficient.

    Yeah sony designed the console casing, but the innards (hardware) were basically all american designed.

    Go read the anandtech preview on the next gen consoles, that should enlighten you a bit.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MATRIX 2 View Post
    The goal of the X1 wasn't to be small and/or efficient looking. So it isn't. It is designed to fit in with home theater components and have a long lifespan while being quiet/power efficient.
    So PS4 won't have a long lifespan while being quiet and power efficient? What if it's more in those regards as well? Point is, doing all of those things cost more money due to R&D required.

    Yeah sony designed the console casing, but the innards (hardware) were basically all american designed.

    Go read the anandtech preview on the next gen consoles, that should enlighten you a bit.
    it would make sense to me that the japs did not just design the casing but likely the whole layout and probably everything else other than the chips. unless you meant to say that. what does it mean that they designed the casing? like just the way it looks on the outter side? hah. i hope that's not what you meant.

    didn't think americans worked on blu-ray players (as most popular ones are by the japanese companies).

    do you have that anadtech link that says otherwise?

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