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    PRT (Equivalent of Tiled Resources from DX11.1) on PS4 via Granite SDK

    http://gamingbolt.com/ps4-games-coul...aming-detailed

    PlayStation 4 features PSSL [PlayStation Shader Language], a custom shader language which is a mix of DX11 and OpenGL 4.4. Many of you must not be aware that the PlayStation 4 is capable of supporting Partially Resident Textures, which is roughly equivalent to tiled streaming using DirectX on the Xbox One.
    So what are Partially Resident Textures? As the name suggests, Partially Resident Textures are the only texture portions that needs to be placed in the GPU at one time. John Carmack’s famous ‘Megatexture’ technology in RAGE is an excellent example of Partially Resident Textures. In short this method improves the cache and memory bandwidth. So if the developer does not want to render an entire texture, he/she can load only the relevant bits resulting into better texture streaming and cutting down the amount of redundant texture processing.
    This is where Graphine Software comes in. Graphine focuses on delivering texture streaming and texture compression middleware for the games and visualization industries. Using Graphine Software’s Granite SDK, even more better looking games with reduced load times can be made possible on the PlayStation 4.
    Aljosha Demeulemeester, Graphine CEO confirmed to GamingBolt that Partial Resident Textures for the PlayStation 4 is aimed at doing the same thing as the Tiled Resources feature of DX 11.1+ using Granite SDK.
    “Sony has announced that Partially Resident Textures (PRT) is available for PS4. This is aimed at doing the same thing as the Tiled Resources feature of DX 11.1+. We sometime refer to both using the term ‘hardware virtual texturing’,” he said to GamingBolt.
    So how does Granite SDK actually works with ‘hardware virtual texturing’ and how it can improve graphical fidelity and cut down load times? Aljosha gave a very in-depth explanation for the same.
    “We call Granite SDK a fine-grained streaming system because we load very small tiles of texture data. This is happening in the background while playing the game. The size of the tiles is configurable but a commonly used setting is 128×128 pixels. When using virtual texturing, you will only load the texture tiles into memory that are actually viewed by the virtual camera. The main benefit is that you can save on the amount of video memory that you need for you texture data, but there are a bunch of side benefits. Loading times are reduced and disk access is more constant and predictable. The bottom-line is that you can really increase the graphical fidelity of games, while staying within the limited of the current hardware,” Aljosha stated to GamingBolt.
    But due to slightly different architectures of the PlayStation 4 and Xbox One [the former has unified and the latter has embedded memory architecture], is the process of texture streaming different across the two consoles? This question could easily come up for a developer who is working on a multiplatform game using the Granite SDK.
    That is actually not a problem, according to Aljosha. “Granite SDK indeed takes care of all the platform specific stuff and makes sure that you’re up and running quickly on both platforms. Granite exposes a set of configuration parameters like the size of the texture cache in main memory, the amount of threads used for decoding, the maximum allowed throughput of texture data per frame, etc.”
    However a game developer will still need to tweak the parameters according to the game’s needs.
    “A game developer will want to tweak these parameters depending on the behaviour of his/her own game, and based on the capabilities of the hardware of a specific platform. We provide fast implementations of the Granite runtime for both platforms so that only the values of these configuration parameters might change on the different platforms(from the game developer’s perspective that is),” Aljosha added.
    Granite SDK currently supports PC, Mac, Linux, PS4 and Xbox One.
    This is just a snippet of our interview with Graphine Software and we will have the complete interview this Friday.

    Read more at http://gamingbolt.com/ps4-games-coul...iHjflZWvDqd.99

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    This is good news but the thread title is misleading. There is no Direct x for ps4. Maybe equivalent, but not DX.

    PS4 Games Could See Increased Visual Fidelity and less load times with Granit SDK
    That sound more like a fitting title.

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    Direct x is a MS API so that isnt in the PS4. Open GL is the PS4 equivalent and is what the PS4 uses. So the author is misinformed.

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    I must be really tired, but where does it say the PS4 is DirectX besides what PSSL is?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fenix View Post
    I must be really tired, but where does it say the PS4 is DirectX besides what PSSL is?
    Where it says in reference to the shader language that PS4 features " a mix of dx11 and open gl 4.4." But upon reading again I dont think the author really meant it that way but thats how it sounded at first.
    Last edited by mistercrow; 04-23-2014 at 00:14.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mistercrow View Post
    Direct x is a MS API so that isnt in the PS4. Open GL is the PS4 equivalent and is what the PS4 uses. So the author is misinformed.
    the author isn't making that claim. It's the op that worded the title of the article making it misleading. "It's aimed at doing the same as DX".

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sub-stance1 View Post
    the author isn't making that claim. It's the op that worded the title of the article making it misleading. "It's aimed at doing the same as DX".
    Read my post above yours again and you can see why it sounded like that at first and then read where I said upon reading again I dont think the author really meant it that way.

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    I apologize guys. I never meant to say PS4 is getting DX11. I was just stating out the equivalent.

    Meaning PRT is Tiled Resources Equivalent from DX11. Will change title.

    Sony has announced that Partially Resident Textures (PRT) is available for PS4. This is aimed at doing the same thing as the Tiled Resources feature of DX 11.1+. We sometime refer to both using the term ‘hardware virtual texturing’,”
    This is what I've meant. Didn't think people will recognize the name of PRT, so I wanted to tack on a name people were more familiar with which was tiled resources.

    Never meant to say PS4 is getting DX support. Sorry for miswording.
    Last edited by AttackTitan; 04-23-2014 at 01:05.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AttackTitan View Post
    I apologize guys. I never meant to say PS4 is getting DX11. I was just stating out the equivalent.

    Meaning PRT is Tiled Resources Equivalent from DX11. Will change title.
    Personally, I don't see why you would change it from the original title anyway. It's speculation. I don't see ms or Sony using this over their own API.

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    The PS4 sdk is designed to be compatible with DX11+ so that developers can easily port games from PC etc.

    But the Playstation SDK itself is an extremely modified, upgraded version of open GL and allows MUCH more access to the hardware (coding to the metal). Mantle is based on the same concept.

    Basically DX without the baggage.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sub-stance1 View Post
    Personally, I don't see why you would change it from the original title anyway. It's speculation. I don't see ms or Sony using this over their own API.
    It is approved SDK and Sony or MS is not incorporating into their own API. The developers are the one who will choose to use it if they see any benefits.

    Not really a speculation since PS4 will get it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AttackTitan View Post
    I apologize guys. I never meant to say PS4 is getting DX11. I was just stating out the equivalent. Meaning PRT is Tiled Resources Equivalent from DX11. Will change title. This is what I've meant. Didn't think people will recognize the name of PRT, so I wanted to tack on a name people were more familiar with which was tiled resources. Never meant to say PS4 is getting DX support. Sorry for miswording.
    No worries bro. We appreciate the article.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AttackTitan View Post
    It is approved SDK and Sony or MS is not incorporating into their own API. The developers are the one who will choose to use it if they see any benefits.

    Not really a speculation since PS4 will get it.
    I think you are misunderstanding the article. Ps4 uses PRT already. This is just a CEO advertising their SDK. The article doesn't say anything about ps4 actually using this SDK. You didn't pay attention to the the title. Key word is "could". All he is doing is explaining how it works.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sub-stance1 View Post
    I think you are misunderstanding the article. Ps4 uses PRT already. This is just a CEO advertising their SDK.
    I didn't realize there was a game that was running PRT or tiled resources on PS4 or Xbox One. Please name one and provide source.

    The article doesn't say anything about ps4 actually using this SDK.
    Actually it does.

    Gamebolt Article
    This is where Graphine Software comes in. Graphine focuses on delivering texture streaming and texture compression middleware for the games and visualization industries. Using Graphine Software’s Granite SDK, even more better looking games with reduced load times can be made possible on the PlayStation 4."

    "So how does Granite SDK actually works with ‘hardware virtual texturing’ and how it can improve graphical fidelity and cut down load times? Aljosha gave a very in-depth explanation for the same.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sub-stance1 View Post
    You didn't pay attention to the the title. Key word is "could". All he is doing is explaining how it works.
    Actually, that is incorrect. The "could" refers to the technology's effectiveness. PS4 and Xbox One are both getting it and it "could" improve graphics.

    Gamebolt Article
    Using Graphine Software’s Granite SDK, even more better looking games with reduced load times can be made possible on the PlayStation 4.

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    PRT is available on any Southern Island GPU.

    Granite is a middle ware company who specialize in PRT middle ware.
    Its a toolset for incorporating PRT on PC, Xbox ONE and PS4.

    It doesnt give the equivalent of PRT, because both systems have it already, it just makes it easier to use and cross platform creation.

    PRT has always been available on the PS4.

    Quote Originally Posted by AttackTitan View Post
    I didn't realize there was a game that was running PRT or tiled resources on PS4 or Xbox One. Please name one and provide source.
    Trials Fusion
    Much like its predecessor, Trials Fusion uses a virtual texturing system, similar to id Software's Rage, which involves wrapping the world's geometry in one single giant texture and then streaming in segments as you drive to the right.
    http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/di...usion-face-off

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    Quote Originally Posted by mynd View Post
    PRT is available on any Southern Island GPU.

    Granite is a middle ware company who specialize in PRT middle ware.
    Its a toolset for incorporating PRT on PC, Xbox ONE and PS4.

    It doesnt give the equivalent of PRT, because both systems have it already, it just makes it easier to use and cross platform creation.

    PRT has always been available on the PS4.



    Trials Fusion

    http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/di...usion-face-off
    PRT being equivalent of tiled resourced. Not granite SDK being equivalent of PRT.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AttackTitan View Post
    PRT being equivalent of tiled resourced. Not granite SDK being equivalent of PRT.
    ??

    Granite SDK, is just middle-ware building on features already available.

    It's like saying Unreal engine exposes Texturing. It doesn't make it possible, it just makes it easier.
    Last edited by mynd; 04-23-2014 at 02:40.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AttackTitan View Post
    I didn't realize there was a game that was running PRT or tiled resources on PS4 or Xbox One. Please name one and provide source.



    Actually it does.





    Actually, that is incorrect. The "could" refers to the technology's effectiveness. PS4 and Xbox One are both getting it and it "could" improve graphics.
    I still think you are misunderstanding the contents that are in the article. It says granite supports ps4 and Xbox one. You titled the thread like they were already using it. What it sounds like to me is that the CEO is saying " look, here is our SDK and it can do the same things as open gl and dx. He's saying if you use granite this is what it can do for you. I didn't see where it said that the console is using it presently.
    Last edited by Sub-stance1; 04-23-2014 at 02:56.

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    Ah k, this is just about the middleware being supported on X1 and PS4. Maybe this should just go into a different section of the forum?


    Don't let this thread blow up and out of proportion. It's simply and article about middleware that lets developers get at the PRT/Tiled resources functions.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mistercrow View Post
    Direct x is a MS API so that isnt in the PS4. Open GL is the PS4 equivalent and is what the PS4 uses. So the author is misinformed.
    Ps4 API's are GNM and GNMX.
    So no OpenGL, just like no-one used OpenGL on ps3 as there were a better choice.
    Last edited by jlippone; 04-23-2014 at 17:51.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sub-stance1 View Post
    I still think you are misunderstanding the contents that are in the article. It says granite supports ps4 and Xbox one. You titled the thread like they were already using it. What it sounds like to me is that the CEO is saying " look, here is our SDK and it can do the same things as open gl and dx. He's saying if you use granite this is what it can do for you. I didn't see where it said that the console is using it presently.
    I do not think you understood quote clearly laid out too you. PS4 API already have support for it. Granite gives additional supports.

    It is not "could" or "speculation" that PS4 supports PRT.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sub-stance1 View Post
    The article doesn't say anything about ps4 actually using this SDK.
    Actually it does.

    Gamebolt Article
    This is where Graphine Software comes in. Graphine focuses on delivering texture streaming and texture compression middleware for the games and visualization industries. Using Graphine Software’s Granite SDK, even more better looking games with reduced load times can be made possible on the PlayStation 4."

    "So how does Granite SDK actually works with ‘hardware virtual texturing’ and how it can improve graphical fidelity and cut down load times? Aljosha gave a very in-depth explanation for the same.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sub-stance1 View Post
    You didn't pay attention to the the title. Key word is "could". All he is doing is explaining how it works.
    Actually, that is incorrect. The "could" refers to the technology's effectiveness. PS4 and Xbox One are both getting it and it "could" improve graphics.

    Gamebolt Article
    Using Graphine Software’s Granite SDK, even more better looking games with reduced load times can be made possible on the PlayStation 4.
    Last edited by AttackTitan; 04-24-2014 at 02:41.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sajuuk Khar View Post
    Ah k, this is just about the middleware being supported on X1 and PS4. Maybe this should just go into a different section of the forum?


    Don't let this thread blow up and out of proportion. It's simply and article about middleware that lets developers get at the PRT/Tiled resources functions.
    Yup. PS4 API already seem to support PRT and middleware coming in to make PRT/Tiled resources easier. However, it is news that PS4 does support it even without the middleware.

    No one is taking it out of proportion like people did with hardware based tiled resource being X1's secret sauce and something only X1 could do. Turns out PS4 supports hardware based PRT, too.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AttackTitan View Post
    I do not think you understood quote clearly laid out too you. PS4 API already have support for it. Granite gives additional supports.

    It is not "could" or "speculation" that PS4 supports PRT.
    ps4's api already supports PRT without having to use granite sdk. we already know that.



    Actually it does.
    doesnt sound like it does.

    Using Graphine Software’s Granite SDK, even more better looking games with reduced load times can be made possible on the PlayStation 4."
    that doesnt say ps4 is using the sdk. it says what can happen if it does.





    Actually, that is incorrect. The "could" refers to the technology's effectiveness. PS4 and Xbox One are both getting it and it "could" improve graphics.
    could meaning if they use it. you still are misunderstanding. it didn't say they are both getting it. it says it supports ps4 and xbox one. There is confusion because you changed the title of the article which is:

    PS4 Games Could See Increased Visual Fidelity, Lesser Load Times, Granite’s Texture Streaming Detailed
    could meaning if they use Granite sdk which is available, but they don't need to because ps4 already supports the features with its own sdk and xbox one has tiled resources and dx11/dx12. Pay attention to this date on the bottom on this AMD slide.

    Last edited by Sub-stance1; 04-24-2014 at 03:43.

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    I don't really know of anyone on these forums who didn't believe the PS4 couldn't do PRT support on chip. Anytime it was bought up we all pointed to the fact that both GPU's could do it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mynd View Post
    I don't really know of anyone on these forums who didn't believe the PS4 couldn't do PRT support on chip. Anytime it was bought up we all pointed to the fact that both GPU's could do it.
    I remember reading something about it early last year. It was some sort of announcement from AMD about their next gen GPU capabilities.

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