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  1. #1
    Super Elite

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    Ehrenberg [NPD] dooms 360... but he's wrong!

    I wasn't going to post this but then I said, "why the heck not"?. Some people might enjoy it some others might not.

    http://www.itwire.com.au/content/view/11545/532/

    BTW I don't know if it was already posted or not.

  2. #2
    SnowHawk
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    lmao at the bit where he says the 360's successor will make the ps3 look like it came out in 2006 hahaha doesn't he know it did come out 2006 and so the next xbox will try and be better then the ps3 while sony make the ps4 and make it even better and in his logic the ps3 is better then the 360 thats why MS will make a new console to compete with it

  3. #3
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    Good article.
    I hate hearing that console doomsday **** and it was nice to read a bit of common sense.


  4. #4
    dead_zen
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    Jesus....

    Did he actually use "fanboi" in his piece?

    Not to mention the only thing he did was criticize a machine not even a year old.

    Most of his criticisms are just as lame as him using "fanboi".

    "Right out of 2006" Imagine that, it's almost as though it DID come out in 2006.

    "Xbox acts as a media center extender." And all I need for my Xbox to act as a media server is another 1000 dollar box. PS3 does it right out of the box.

    "Better games on the Xbox then the PS3" Holy crap, you mean a console that rushed to market a year early, has a more diverse library? Imagine that. The top tier games from first and second party developers are already wowing people in their Alpha, and Beta stages of development. And offering game play experiences that Xbox 360 just CAN'T compete with.

    He mentions the release of another console, how many MORE Billions is the R&D on that piece of kit? What happens if the Xbox 360 fails to even break even?

    The hardcore gamers are starting to wake up about the Xbox 360's pricing structure. With the launch of the Elite, and the 180 US dollar 120gig hard drive, and the consistant hardware failures with little to no satisfactory answer, and it's leaving a sour taste in the hardcore gamers mouth.

    And let's face it, it's the hardcore that lay the brickwork for the casual gamer. And if they're starting to lose hardcore gamers, where does that leave them?

    The ONLY upside to this investment, is the attempt to monopolize gaming, a multi-billion dollar industry YEARLY. That would pay off and then some if they are able to monopolize the industry, which would only blaze the trail for including Microsoft brand DRM in everything. And thus adding relevance to Vista and it's DRM. Like deepthroat said, follow the money.

    His criticisms pull out of the gate like a lame horse, he hasn't expressed how MS is supposed to turn around and make a profit by 2008. He hasn't offered a single compelling reason as to why those who own a share of MSFT should care about H&E division and why it's hemorrhaging cash like a bullet wound.

    Nice attempt but not a single point was refuted, just a whole lot of hot air being blown up our skirts to disguise the fact that MS is only gaining marginal ground for their billions spent.

  5. #5
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    I think is a good article, the guy is somewhat harsh toward the ps3 but he makes some good points. Some people think Microsoft should give up, but Microsoft is not going to make them happy any time soon.

  6. #6
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    Against my co-worker's advice and my better judgement, I had to clear the air on this guy. I can't give specifics since it would give away to much info on how I know this and most likely break some NDA's, but Roger is a hack.

    He has a personal vendetta against MS due to some stuff that went down earlier this year. Why do you think there was a sudden slew of articles against MS and the 360? It's all misinformation shrouded in speculation which has no basis in fact.

    He takes 2 and 2 and tries to make 5, but it just doesn't work. I see that there are some on this site that are actually happy about Roger's prognostications, but don't worry, he's simply on a mission. And based on the article referred to in the first post, anyone with a bit of intelligence can see that.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by dead_zen View Post

    The ONLY upside to this investment, is the attempt to monopolize gaming, a multi-billion dollar industry YEARLY. That would pay off and then some if they are able to monopolize the industry, which would only blaze the trail for including Microsoft brand DRM in everything. And thus adding relevance to Vista and it's DRM. Like deepthroat said, follow the money.
    the only monopoly in cosole gameing is Sony.
    I mean using your console dominance to try to force a HD format that you stand to make money with... Follow the money indeed.

    As for DRM, again sony would be the one you would not want to look at. Installing rootkits and forcing music and movies to use drm that cripples fair use.

    wonder why drm is enbedded into the core of vista.. Oh i know.. music and movie companies (including sony) use the stranglhold they have on music and movies to force MS into developing drm systems that protects the studio's.

    Yea but MS is evil...

    right

  8. #8
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    Achievements IT'S OVER 9000!
    Sounds like a fanboy rant, nothing more, nothing less

    @ThatHurt
    What are chaffin on about?

    "Xbox is about to become the next water cooler”

  9. #9
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    A nobody journalist with opinions Vs a highly respected financial analyst that works for Forbes and knows what he's talking about.


    Who should I trust?

  10. #10
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    The article is nothing more than "the Xbox can do this, and this, and this, and also that, and more of that, etc...". Anyone on this forum could write such a thing, and it's nothing more than a personal and obviously sided take on things. Not even an interesting read, as we've seen it all before. Ignore.

  11. #11
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    Wow, I can't believe he just wrote this because the Wii had a few good months. Wait until summer, when the 360 has Bioshock, Forza and Shadowrun coming out, and the other guys have nothing. Wait until fall, when 360 has Halo, Mass Effect and PGR4. I think that the 360 has too many good games to fail. Sony and Nintendo may have cooler hardware, but the 360's games are gonna set it apart.
    During E3 I check out the booth babes, and if that's wrong...then maybe I'm missing the point of E3

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doc Evils View Post
    A nobody journalist with opinions Vs a highly respected financial analyst that works for Forbes and knows what he's talking about.


    Who should I trust?
    No, he's not respected in the industry. You should really do a little background on this guy. Also, the Forbes gig was a one time thing, he does not work for them. When he got canned, he started his own business, which, by the way, isn't successful. Check it out.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by dead_zen View Post

    "Xbox acts as a media center extender." And all I need for my Xbox to act as a media server is another 1000 dollar box. PS3 does it right out of the box..
    You mean to tell me you can stream your entire music library on your PS3 while still playing the games or chatting to friends WITHOUT a computer? Where the hell was I when they announced that?

    Quote Originally Posted by dead_zen View Post
    "Better games on the Xbox then the PS3" Holy crap, you mean a console that rushed to market a year early, has a more diverse library? Imagine that. The top tier games from first and second party developers are already wowing people in their Alpha, and Beta stages of development. And offering game play experiences that Xbox 360 just CAN'T compete with..
    I'll introduce you to a new word you obviously are unfamiliar with. OPINION. Which means what YOU think is not always a fact and shouldn't be regarded as one. So while you may think Sony's first and second party stuff can not be competed with I will have to use MY opinion to disagree. Will the games look good and be good? YES. Do I think there are games on 360 that can compete with them? Yes.

    Quote Originally Posted by dead_zen View Post
    "He mentions the release of another console, how many MORE Billions is the R&D on that piece of kit? What happens if the Xbox 360 fails to even break even? .
    Microsoft will create a new console. Don't worry about it. They have plenty of money to go around.

    Quote Originally Posted by dead_zen View Post
    The hardcore gamers are starting to wake up about the Xbox 360's pricing structure. With the launch of the Elite, and the 180 US dollar 120gig hard drive, and the consistant hardware failures with little to no satisfactory answer, and it's leaving a sour taste in the hardcore gamers mouth.

    And let's face it, it's the hardcore that lay the brickwork for the casual gamer. And if they're starting to lose hardcore gamers, where does that leave them?.
    LOL. You honestly think WE the minority dictate what the mass casual market purchases? If that was the case we'd ALL be driving BMW's and eating caviar.

    Quote Originally Posted by Doc Evils View Post
    A nobody journalist with opinions Vs a highly respected financial analyst that works for Forbes and knows what he's talking about.


    Who should I trust?
    Does the analyst only know what he's talking about because he backed Sony? Give me a break you people are so ****** onesided and full of ****!

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by dead_zen View Post
    Jesus....

    Did he actually use "fanboi" in his piece?

    Not to mention the only thing he did was criticize a machine not even a year old.

    Most of his criticisms are just as lame as him using "fanboi".

    "Right out of 2006" Imagine that, it's almost as though it DID come out in 2006.

    "Xbox acts as a media center extender." And all I need for my Xbox to act as a media server is another 1000 dollar box. PS3 does it right out of the box.

    "Better games on the Xbox then the PS3" Holy crap, you mean a console that rushed to market a year early, has a more diverse library? Imagine that. The top tier games from first and second party developers are already wowing people in their Alpha, and Beta stages of development. And offering game play experiences that Xbox 360 just CAN'T compete with.

    He mentions the release of another console, how many MORE Billions is the R&D on that piece of kit? What happens if the Xbox 360 fails to even break even?

    The hardcore gamers are starting to wake up about the Xbox 360's pricing structure. With the launch of the Elite, and the 180 US dollar 120gig hard drive, and the consistant hardware failures with little to no satisfactory answer, and it's leaving a sour taste in the hardcore gamers mouth.

    And let's face it, it's the hardcore that lay the brickwork for the casual gamer. And if they're starting to lose hardcore gamers, where does that leave them?

    The ONLY upside to this investment, is the attempt to monopolize gaming, a multi-billion dollar industry YEARLY. That would pay off and then some if they are able to monopolize the industry, which would only blaze the trail for including Microsoft brand DRM in everything. And thus adding relevance to Vista and it's DRM. Like deepthroat said, follow the money.

    His criticisms pull out of the gate like a lame horse, he hasn't expressed how MS is supposed to turn around and make a profit by 2008. He hasn't offered a single compelling reason as to why those who own a share of MSFT should care about H&E division and why it's hemorrhaging cash like a bullet wound.

    Nice attempt but not a single point was refuted, just a whole lot of hot air being blown up our skirts to disguise the fact that MS is only gaining marginal ground for their billions spent.
    Roger, is that you?

    If not, it has to be his son because this is as anti-MS as Roger is. Based on his writing style, I would say that this poster is a still in high school and has a lot to learn about the business world.

    As a Microsoft stockholder, I find it amusing that he seems to care as much as he does about their financial position. They are in a good financial position and making money on every 360 sold and have been since early last fiscal year.

    The amount of disinformation on this an most other message boards is scary.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chee-up View Post
    Roger, is that you?

    If not, it has to be his son because this is as anti-MS as Roger is. Based on his writing style, I would say that this poster is a still in high school and has a lot to learn about the business world.

    As a Microsoft stockholder, I find it amusing that he seems to care as much as he does about their financial position. They are in a good financial position and making money on every 360 sold and have been since early last fiscal year.

    The amount of disinformation on this an most other message boards is scary.
    Now this explains everything.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doc Evils View Post
    Now this explains everything.
    Yes it does. It explains knowledge of the business world and how to maximize stock profits from successful companies. I wouldn't be invested in them if they weren't profitable.

    Do you think that me posting around here is going to increase the P to E of the stock? I think not.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by reality View Post
    I wasn't going to post this but then I said, "why the heck not"?. Some people might enjoy it some others might not.

    http://www.itwire.com.au/content/view/11545/532/

    BTW I don't know if it was already posted or not.
    I think the guy who wrote this is an MS passionata ...He defends with no proper facts and is only quoting Forbes article and braking it up...but it won't work there are still investors who are worried about this.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chee-up View Post
    Against my co-worker's advice and my better judgement, I had to clear the air on this guy. I can't give specifics since it would give away to much info on how I know this and most likely break some NDA's, but Roger is a hack.

    He has a personal vendetta against MS due to some stuff that went down earlier this year. Why do you think there was a sudden slew of articles against MS and the 360? It's all misinformation shrouded in speculation which has no basis in fact.

    He takes 2 and 2 and tries to make 5, but it just doesn't work. I see that there are some on this site that are actually happy about Roger's prognostications, but don't worry, he's simply on a mission. And based on the article referred to in the first post, anyone with a bit of intelligence can see that.
    I don't believe this he used facts.....can you prove him wrong?? try your hardest I know you won't be able to.
    What mission? exposing the true facts about what happens to the money of investors? Trying to warn people...what's wrong with that?

    "Marvel Universe" in 2012 after The FirstAvenger Movie
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  18. #18
    BudFox
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    Quote Originally Posted by dead_zen View Post
    Jesus....

    Did he actually use "fanboi" in his piece?

    Not to mention the only thing he did was criticize a machine not even a year old.

    Most of his criticisms are just as lame as him using "fanboi".

    "Right out of 2006" Imagine that, it's almost as though it DID come out in 2006.

    "Xbox acts as a media center extender." And all I need for my Xbox to act as a media server is another 1000 dollar box. PS3 does it right out of the box.

    "Better games on the Xbox then the PS3" Holy crap, you mean a console that rushed to market a year early, has a more diverse library? Imagine that. The top tier games from first and second party developers are already wowing people in their Alpha, and Beta stages of development. And offering game play experiences that Xbox 360 just CAN'T compete with.

    He mentions the release of another console, how many MORE Billions is the R&D on that piece of kit? What happens if the Xbox 360 fails to even break even?

    The hardcore gamers are starting to wake up about the Xbox 360's pricing structure. With the launch of the Elite, and the 180 US dollar 120gig hard drive, and the consistant hardware failures with little to no satisfactory answer, and it's leaving a sour taste in the hardcore gamers mouth.

    And let's face it, it's the hardcore that lay the brickwork for the casual gamer. And if they're starting to lose hardcore gamers, where does that leave them?

    The ONLY upside to this investment, is the attempt to monopolize gaming, a multi-billion dollar industry YEARLY. That would pay off and then some if they are able to monopolize the industry, which would only blaze the trail for including Microsoft brand DRM in everything. And thus adding relevance to Vista and it's DRM. Like deepthroat said, follow the money.

    His criticisms pull out of the gate like a lame horse, he hasn't expressed how MS is supposed to turn around and make a profit by 2008. He hasn't offered a single compelling reason as to why those who own a share of MSFT should care about H&E division and why it's hemorrhaging cash like a bullet wound.

    Nice attempt but not a single point was refuted, just a whole lot of hot air being blown up our skirts to disguise the fact that MS is only gaining marginal ground for their billions spent.

    Haha c'mon man that's hilarious. Your post is the same as his article. Just pointed the other way. You have to see that. Your the same person, with different opinions.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sventax View Post
    I think the guy who wrote this is an MS passionata ...He defends with no proper facts and is only quoting Forbes article and braking it up...but it won't work there are still investors who are worried about this.



    I don't believe this he used facts.....can you prove him wrong?? try your hardest I know you won't be able to.
    What mission? exposing the true facts about what happens to the money of investors? Trying to warn people...what's wrong with that?
    He used his own interpretations of some selective statistics to form personal opinions about the state of MS's gaming business.

    Sorry that doesn't mean it's fact.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sventax View Post
    I think the guy who wrote this is an MS passionata ...He defends with no proper facts and is only quoting Forbes article and braking it up...but it won't work there are still investors who are worried about this.



    I don't believe this he used facts.....can you prove him wrong?? try your hardest I know you won't be able to.
    What mission? exposing the true facts about what happens to the money of investors? Trying to warn people...what's wrong with that?
    What FACTS does he use? Do you know them to be true? He doesn't prove them, he just states them. He hasn't proven any of what he said in the articles to be true. What he says is being taken at face value because he put together a resume and has a nice web site.

    If that's all it takes..WOW!

  20. #20
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    Some people seem as they don't have common sense. The Xbox 360 has been doing good despite the shortage they had, the lack of sales in Japan, the fact that their fanbase isn't that big and they have take a fair amount of bad press and a lot of criticism too. 10 million units sold(give it or take), a great sofware attach ratio of 5.7,an increasing game library + lots of games with great potential are coming to the console even some of the Sony's exclusives jumped ship to the 360, they are even getting more Japanese support and JRPGs, Xbox live community is still growing and is going to expand even more with Live Everywhere and later on IPTV will come to the 360. Oh but the 360 is doom . No console is perfect though. The 360 has hardware problems and Microsoft wants the 360 owners to buy the peripherals, it is up to the people to buy them though. Those are the 2 things that I don't like about the console but I can live with that. . Consoles shoud be about games and more games.

  21. #21
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    Time for a post break down:

    Quote Originally Posted by dead_zen View Post
    "Xbox acts as a media center extender." And all I need for my Xbox to act as a media server is another 1000 dollar box. PS3 does it right out of the box.
    Now please tell me, how many people that actually has money and interest to buy an Xbox 360 does NOT have a PC already? Heck, who in the civilized world doesn't have a PC? And now it's not even necessary to have Windows Media Center, so a Media Extender works just fine for now. Besides, you can still use your hard disc to store media so the difference isn’t that big anyways, especially now with the new update that will open up a new variety of codecs (and hopefully this trend will continue)

    "Better games on the Xbox then the PS3" Holy crap, you mean a console that rushed to market a year early, has a more diverse library?
    Imagine that. The top tier games from first and second party developers are already wowing people in their Alpha, and Beta stages of development. And offering game play experiences that Xbox 360 just CAN'T compete with.
    I didn't even think there was still someone around arguing about it. The Xbox 360 library is right now way beyond the one on the PS3 and according to the 2007 plans (check my sig for an example), the gap will continue to expand in terms of Must Have titles this year and will [probably] see a PS3 sort of catch up during 2008 and above. I would also like to know which "gameplay experiences" impossible to match for the 360 are you talking about.

    He mentions the release of another console, how many MORE Billions is the R&D on that piece of kit? What happens if the Xbox 360 fails to even break even?
    As the article stated, Microsoft isn't looking for an immediate profit come back. The console's market is a big risk and they're taking it. More important, Microsoft isn't the only company taking big risks here for when the Playstation 2 was in the market, it was an almost unlimited source of profit whereas now, with the expensive-to-make PS3, Sony is taking a much more risky campaign this time around, in a market where it’s been proven that customers aren't just willing to spend $600 for a console in the massive numbers Sony and even its competitors were expecting just for having the Playstation label on it. Proof of that is that the 360 keeps outselling the PS3 (by a whooping 56% in the U.S.) even without big titles being released recently.

    Imagine what the second half of 2007 will be like with a Halo 3, GTA, Blue Dragon, Mass Effect, Lost Odyssey, Too Human, Bioshock, Forza 2, Assassin's Creed [and many others] combo. Considering that Halo 2 alone pushed the original Xbox beyond the PS2 in sales by its launch, It's not difficult to belive that the effect will hit much heavily with a broader collection of games and a superior marketshare.

    The hardcore gamers are starting to wake up about the Xbox 360's pricing structure. With the launch of the Elite, and the 180 US dollar 120gig hard drive, and the consistent hardware failures with little to no satisfactory answer, and it's leaving a sour taste in the hardcore gamers mouth.

    And let's face it. It's the hardcore that lay the brickwork for the casual gamer. And if they're starting to lose hardcore gamers, where does that leave them?
    The Xbox 360 Elite is more aimed to enthusiasts, and while it's been pre-ordered to death (a very healthy signal) I believe that if you are an enthusiast, you might be willing to attach a $80 120GB HDD to the Xbox 360 following this guide.

    Your argument about the Xbox 360 losing the hardcores is very debatable. With the consistent record attach rate of 5.6 in the Xbox 360 according to the latest NPD numbers, I think its userbase is the one filled by most hardcore gamers than any other. A very important point to be taken in consideration when developers choose their primary platform.

    The ONLY upside to this investment, is the attempt to monopolize gaming, a multi-billion dollar industry YEARLY. That would pay off and then some if they are able to monopolize the industry, which would only blaze the trail for including Microsoft brand DRM in everything. And thus adding relevance to Vista and it's DRM. Like deepthroat said, follow the money.
    Sony almost had a monopoly in the consoles market the past generation. I don't think they would've cared if they continued this trend this generation also. Given how difficult is Japan to break, I don't think Microsoft will ever have a monopoly in consoles business but it will indeed push it to its limits, which is always welcome for the customers. If Microsoft didn’t “interfere” Sony would have the undisputed monopoly once again (it would most likely have taken most of the 360 current marketshare) and developers would’ve been pushed to work for the PS3, under Sony’s conditions and customers next-gen hunger would be pushed to buy everything Sony produces without any kind of healthy competition. If Microsoft is doing something good this generation, is battling Sony as very few would’ve been able to.


    His criticisms pull out of the gate like a lame horse, he hasn't expressed how MS is supposed to turn around and make a profit by 2008. He hasn't offered a single compelling reason as to why those who own a share of MSFT should care about H&E division and why it's hemorrhaging cash like a bullet wound.
    Perhaps he didn't say so because it's pretty evident. By 2008, the cost of the 360 should be already reduced by the inclusion of the 65nm technology. With the AAA titles with massive appealing coming out these years, published by MS, they won't only be getting cash from hardware but from software too. That's just how every single generation of a successful console has ever been. Except for the Wii (which strategy has no historic precedent) it should be about the same this time around. Why didn’t this happen to the Xbox? Well, it didn’t have nearly the kick ass library the Xbox 360 has for 2006 – 2007 combined through all its lifecycle, that’s why. But things are definitely set to change in this generation.
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  22. #22
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    Achievements IT'S OVER 9000!
    you ppl have time in your hands....real talk

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by CH!3F View Post
    you ppl have time in your hands....real talk
    Hmmm . Let's see, who posts 10.71 times a day? Not me.

  24. #24
    dead_zen
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    [QUOTE=Aquanox;1340215]Time for a post break down:



    Quote Originally Posted by Aquanox View Post
    Now please tell me, how many people that actually has money and interest to buy an Xbox 360 does NOT have a PC already? Heck, who in the civilized world doesn't have a PC? And now it's not even necessary to have Windows Media Center, so a Media Extender works just fine for now. Besides, you can still use your hard disc to store media so the difference isn’t that big anyways, especially now with the new update that will open up a new variety of codecs (and hopefully this trend will continue)
    Make your excuses actually have substance in the future it might help.

    It's still another 1000 dollars I've got to invest to get the full funtionality that a PS3 offers.

    NEXT!

    Quote Originally Posted by Aquanox View Post
    I didn't even think there was still someone around arguing about it. The Xbox 360 library is right now way beyond the one on the PS3 and according to the 2007 plans (check my sig for an example), the gap will continue to expand in terms of Must Have titles this year and will [probably] see a PS3 sort of catch up during 2008 and above. I would also like to know which "gameplay experiences" impossible to match for the 360 are you talking about.
    Amazing how that extra year of development time helps out huh?

    As for the gameplay experiences impossible to match on the 360 the only game I've got to mention is Lair, you will never find a game that matches it on a purely technical level.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aquanox View Post
    As the article stated, Microsoft isn't looking for an immediate profit come back. The console's market is a big risk and they're taking it. More important, Microsoft isn't the only company taking big risks here for when the Playstation 2 was in the market, it was an almost unlimited source of profit whereas now, with the expensive-to-make PS3, Sony is taking a much more risky campaign this time around, in a market where it’s been proven that customers aren't just willing to spend $600 for a console in the massive numbers Sony and even its competitors were expecting just for having the Playstation label on it. Proof of that is that the 360 keeps outselling the PS3 (by a whooping 56% in the U.S.) even without big titles being released recently.
    I like that bolded part, "in the U.S.". At least you were honest about it. Because there's still PAL territories, and Japan. That are making up for the sales deficit in North America. Which is why Ehrinberg put emphasis on Japan, because Nintendo, and Sony will sell there. Just like they are selling in North America, and PAL territories.

    As for Sony taking a bigger chance couldn't agree more. Which is why they aren't in a rush to see how much money they can rape from your wallet. They are making money back slow and steady, and making sure that they aren't going to be caught with their pants down, much like Microsoft has proven with the release of the "Elite", I'm waiting for Ultimate edition to come out next year.



    Quote Originally Posted by Aquanox View Post
    Imagine what the second half of 2007 will be like with a Halo 3, GTA, Blue Dragon, Mass Effect, Lost Odyssey, Too Human, Bioshock, Forza 2, Assassin's Creed [and many others] combo. Considering that Halo 2 alone pushed the original Xbox beyond the PS2 in sales by its launch, It's not difficult to belive that the effect will hit much heavily with a broader collection of games and a superior marketshare.
    LOL Mass Effect, a great KOTOR3 with out the Star Wars, has already slipped to September, how many more will begin to fall back? Guess we'll see in the coming months. And I'm so leary on the Xbox hype train, anyone remember, the hype the rolled out with "Brute Force" the so called "Halo Killer"?

    And you act like the PS3 isn't full of titles that aren't going to take their fair share. But I guess with your vast knowledge of all things PS3, I'm not supposed to be able to refute any of that.

    Oh wait, I've got these:

    Lair playable in 1080p@30FPS http://www.gametrailers.com/player.p...pe=wmv&pl=game

    Ninja Gaiden:Sigma playable in 1080p@60FPS http://www.gametrailers.com/player.p...pe=wmv&pl=game

    LBP:http://www.gametrailers.com/player.p...pe=wmv&pl=game

    And the Live killer, Home.

    Oh no, what ever will we do, long lasting enjoyable theatrical experiences that are actually worth 60 dollars, versus the majority of throw away games on the Xbox.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aquanox View Post
    The Xbox 360 Elite is more aimed to enthusiasts, and while it's been pre-ordered to death (a very healthy signal) I believe that if you are an enthusiast, you might be willing to attach a $80 120GB HDD to the Xbox 360 following this guide.
    No, the Elite is aimed at enthusiasts wallets. The high price of the hard drive, and the inflated cost of the Elite, with no significant hardware upgrade. No 65nm chipset, no price drops, and there's not even going to be any black peripherals made beyond what you get in the box, the military has a saying Bend Over Here It Comes Again.

    The caveat of that little guide is it only works on one style of hard drive with a specific serial number, and leaves you at the mercy of how big MS decides to make their own hard drives. So you are still at the mercy of MS when it comes to the HDD.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aquanox View Post
    Your argument about the Xbox 360 losing the hardcores is very debatable. With the consistent record attach rate of 5.6 in the Xbox 360 according to the latest NPD numbers, I think its userbase is the one filled by most hardcore gamers than any other. A very important point to be taken in consideration when developers choose their primary platform.
    The damn attach rate, let me know when MS stops cooking the books on the attach rate as well, let's see what they count before we hail the attach rate a triumph.

    As for the hardcore gamers, with the sucking sound coming from the wallet once you own the Xbox, they are getting tired of that sound, and the lack of any respect as a consumer given to them by the faulty Xbox's is making them want to leave, period.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aquanox View Post
    Sony almost had a monopoly in the consoles market the past generation. I don't think they would've cared if they continued this trend this generation also. Given how difficult is Japan to break, I don't think Microsoft will ever have a monopoly in consoles business but it will indeed push it to its limits, which is always welcome for the customers. If Microsoft didn’t “interfere” Sony would have the undisputed monopoly once again (it would most likely have taken most of the 360 current marketshare) and developers would’ve been pushed to work for the PS3, under Sony’s conditions and customers next-gen hunger would be pushed to buy everything Sony produces without any kind of healthy competition. If Microsoft is doing something good this generation, is battling Sony as very few would’ve been able to.
    Almost had? They owned 70% of the market. More excuses about Microsoft, the difference here is that 90% of the people in the world don't need a Sony piece of kit. VG's are a hobby. Try and get a job ANYWHERE in the world with out the knowledge of how to operate a computer. Specifically windows.

    So spare me that monopoly bull****. It's nothing like Microsofts monopoly. I've already gone in to how a MS monopolized console business is bad. In the original thread from Ehrinberg.


    Quote Originally Posted by Aquanox View Post
    Perhaps he didn't say so because it's pretty evident. By 2008, the cost of the 360 should be already reduced by the inclusion of the 65nm technology. With the AAA titles with massive appealing coming out these years, published by MS, they won't only be getting cash from hardware but from software too. That's just how every single generation of a successful console has ever been. Except for the Wii (which strategy has no historic precedent) it should be about the same this time around. Why didn’t this happen to the Xbox? Well, it didn’t have nearly the kick ass library the Xbox 360 has for 2006 – 2007 combined through all its lifecycle, that’s why. But things are definitely set to change in this generation.
    At this point, I've already grown bored with your "dissection". Lame, and full of excuses. A lot like the original criticism of Ehrinberg who supported his analysis with figures of console sales.

    The only thing set to change this generation is Wii dominating the console world, PS3 second, and Xbox 360 dead last, and with just a bit of luck, won't see a profit til 2009.

    Edit:

    Basically all your post amounts to is the last paragraph, wait for this and that, it's ok for Microsoft fans to wait, but not Sony owners to wait?

    The difference is the Xbox had a full year to capitalize on all this. They just haven't. The PS3 is competing with stiff competition from two different sources, the Xbox had a last gen console clean it's clock.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dead_zen View Post
    Make your excuses actually have substance in the future it might help.

    It's still another 1000 dollars I've got to invest to get the full funtionality that a PS3 offers.

    NEXT!
    When you already own the box, which is 99% you will, it's not an investment. You also ignored the part where I said you can still stream all your media from your hard drive.

    Btw, how exactly do you take most off the PS3 as a media center without a PC when people usually has all their media on it or an iPod, which is also supported by the 360.


    Amazing how that extra year of development time helps out huh?
    Indeed, and its also amazing how a company can pull-off a competitive console 1 year before. Talking about history, the original Xbox already surpassed the PS2 with a launch title even when it has 1 year of development experience edge.

    As for the gameplay experiences impossible to match on the 360 the only game I've got to mention is Lair, you will never find a game that matches it on a purely technical level.
    Technically, Lair has a lot of assets, but it also has some serious handicups. Perhaps the game is too ambitious as it is, but one can't help noticing how low res the ground soldiers are and how scripted and smoothless their animations seem to be.

    The dragons and water look great, and so does the scenery but I wouldn't call it an unmatchable experience at all, especially when it still has so much polishing ahead in terms of gameplay and framerate. Remember how people bragged about Motorstorm being possible only on PS3... just weeks later, Sega Rally and Collin McRae shut their mouths.

    I like that bolded part, "in the U.S.". At least you were honest about it. Because there's still PAL territories, and Japan. That are making up for the sales deficit in North America. Which is why Ehrinberg put emphasis on Japan, because Nintendo, and Sony will sell there. Just like they are selling in North America, and PAL territories.
    Do you have any recent sales numbers of the Xbox 360 vs. PS3 in PAL territories? Because I don't. Considering the PS3 launched in March, we would need to wait how good it did by the end of April. Last time I've checked though, sales of the Ps3 dropped dramatically in both software and hardware starting in just the second week of the Ps3 launch in PAL territories. No Record-breaking headlines were seen by then, which only means that that big anticipation was only product of the constant delays of the console which somehow helped collecting pre-orders.


    As for Sony taking a bigger chance couldn't agree more. Which is why they aren't in a rush to see how much money they can rape from your wallet. They are making money back slow and steady, and making sure that they aren't going to be caught with their pants down, much like Microsoft has proven with the release of the "Elite", I'm waiting for Ultimate edition to come out next year.
    Can you elaborate on "being caught with the pants down"? From where I see it, the Elite is experiencing a very positive demmand right now.

    LOL Mass Effect, a great KOTOR3 with out the Star Wars, has already slipped to September, how many more will begin to fall back? Guess we'll see in the coming months. And I'm so leary on the Xbox hype train, anyone remember, the hype the rolled out with "Brute Force" the so called "Halo Killer"?
    So Mass Effect is a great spiritual sequel of one of the best western RPGs of all time? Well, that's a big compliment.

    As for Halo Killers, that's just a marketing label just like Sony labeled Killzone 1 to be a Halo Killer and ended up being a bit above mediocre, at least technically.

    And you act like the PS3 isn't full of titles that aren't going to take their fair share. But I guess with your vast knowledge of all things PS3, I'm not supposed to be able to refute any of that.

    Oh wait, I've got these:

    Lair playable in 1080p@30FPS http://www.gametrailers.com/player.p...pe=wmv&pl=game

    Ninja Gaiden:Sigma playable in 1080p@60FPS http://www.gametrailers.com/player.p...pe=wmv&pl=game

    LBP:http://www.gametrailers.com/player.p...pe=wmv&pl=game

    And the Live killer, Home.
    I honestly don't see the buzz in Lair. It could end up being a good game but It's too arcadeish to my taste. Just like those Legendary Warriors games but with dragons and great visuals... unless you get close to the ground that is. I'm yet to see something that makes it a killer app.

    Ninja Gaiden Sigma is probably the game I want the most on the PS3. I unfortunately don't have enough money to pay $850 over here for one of those, but fortunately, Ninja Gaiden 2, the REAL sequel of that kick ass game is being developed exclusively for the Xbox 360. Something that makes me feel great about the 2008 360 lineup.

    LBP, not much to say about it. Looks nice, seems to play nice, etc. I see it as a game competing on a different league though... not something I would chose over any Big title on any console but definetly something I would love to put my hands on.

    And about Home, please Sony first make the damn thing work and then talk about "Killers".

    Oh no, what ever will we do, long lasting enjoyable theatrical experiences that are actually worth 60 dollars, versus the majority of throw away games on the Xbox.
    If you can't appreciate the goodness of the Xbox 360 lineup for this year, I think I'll have to reconsider discussing about anything game related with you. Very few hardcore fans refuse to see it, seriously.

    No, the Elite is aimed at enthusiasts wallets. The high price of the hard drive, and the inflated cost of the Elite, with no significant hardware upgrade. No 65nm chipset, no price drops, and there's not even going to be any black peripherals made beyond what you get in the box, the military has a saying Bend Over Here It Comes Again.

    The caveat of that little guide is it only works on one style of hard drive with a specific serial number, and leaves you at the mercy of how big MS decides to make their own hard drives. So you are still at the mercy of MS when it comes to the HDD.
    The Elite is $75 more and gives you 100GB more and an HDMI port. I fail to see what's wrong with that. The only negative point I see is the high cost of the hard drive when sold separatedly, but this has been already addressed by a simple mod.

    Now, as for MS deciding the size of the discs, honestly, how mainstream do you think this particular subject is? 120GB in a console is more than enough considering you can still stream all your media from your big ass PC hard drives.

    The damn attach rate, let me know when MS stops cooking the books on the attach rate as well, let's see what they count before we hail the attach rate a triumph.
    Like it or hate it, the Xbox 360 attach rate owns from wherever you see it, that of the PS3 and Wii. Questioning how they calculate their attach rates isn't a solid way to counter an argument that can well decide the next gen console of choice for those big developers.


    As for the hardcore gamers, with the sucking sound coming from the wallet once you own the Xbox, they are getting tired of that sound, and the lack of any respect as a consumer given to them by the faulty Xbox's is making them want to leave, period.
    Lack of respect? since when a warranty extension and full replacement is a lack of respect for the consumer? Perhaps not all of them will have benefit from this but at least is a clear signal that they're working on the curstomer's loyalty. Now that you mention this point, I think that a lack of quality titles and continuous delays plus multiplatform games looking inferior in a so called superior console is a much more efficient way to lose your hardcores, mister.

    Almost had? They owned 70% of the market. More excuses about Microsoft, the difference here is that 90% of the people in the world don't need a Sony piece of kit. VG's are a hobby. Try and get a job ANYWHERE in the world with out the knowledge of how to operate a computer. Specifically windows.


    So spare me that monopoly bull****. It's nothing like Microsofts monopoly. I've already gone in to how a MS monopolized console business is bad. In the original thread from Ehrinberg.
    From a casual gamer's point of view, videogames is just a hobbie. For those who analyze things deeper, it's a big business that can deeply influence your daily life.

    Aynways, your positions is basically justifying Sony's ex-monopoly by saying it's just a hobbie and of course, completly ignoring that fact that they're shaping to be much more than that in home entertainment. Under that logic, you would be happy if Sony owned the market once again and developers and especially CUSTOMERS were FORCED to pay whathever Sony told them to pay for a next generation gamming experience.

    I'm sorry but I can't justify that way of thinking under any means. Even if you were a Sony harcore fanboy I would think you'd be able realize that competition is always healthy, even in this business. Saying it otherwise, if Microsoft wasn't in the market, perhaps some of your most anticipated games wouldn't be as amazing as you think they are and some others wouldn't even exist.

    At this point, I've already grown bored with your "dissection". Lame, and full of excuses. A lot like the original criticism of Ehrinberg who supported his analysis with figures of console sales.

    The only thing set to change this generation is Wii dominating the console world, PS3 second, and Xbox 360 dead last, and with just a bit of luck, won't see a profit til 2009.



    The difference is the Xbox had a full year to capitalize on all this. They just haven't. The PS3 is competing with stiff competition from two different sources, the Xbox had a last gen console clean it's clock.
    Sony had 70% of marketshare past generation with the Xbox on around 15%. This time around, Sony is desperadetly playing catch up against an Xbox 360 with more than 3 times the marketshare and you doubt Microsoft didn't capitalize on the head start? Ohhh well...
    Yup I'm Back. If you wonder, read this. =)
    "Fake Effects"? Read This. Move on. I'm not interested. Thank you


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