The old framerate debacle.......

ArnoldRimmer

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May 23, 2015
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On Red Dwarf....
#1
There always seems to be a focus, especially this gen, on the framerate games operate on; 60fps, 30fps, locked, unlocked etc etc. It is becoming the norm on some forums (not this one fortunately) to see comments along the lines of 'the games not 1080p and 60fps, I'm not bothering'.

Just thought I'd throw it out there as I'm curious on others opinions of just how important 60fps is in gaming. Personally I honestly can't tell the difference between 60 or 30, am I alone in this?
 

Nerevar

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#2
I hate playing at 30fps but I can deal with it if I'm using a controller. But if it drops anything below that I found it difficult to play the game.

30 or 60fps on console games should depend on what type of game it is. A FPS, racer, or fighting game benefits greatly from the higher framerate, whereas a third-person shooter or horror game can get by with 30fps pretty easily.
 

Ghost

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#3
I can see the difference but it's in no way a deterrent for me if it's not 60, nor something I'd bitch and moan about. I play games for escapism and fun, not to appease my eyes with some elite performance benchmark.

Sent from my GT-I9000
 

Varsh

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#4
For me I can even notice a difference between 60FPS and 120FPS. Personally I prefer to have as high an FPS no matter the genre but I can still play a game whatever the FPS. But for those that always say "I can't notice the difference between 30 and 60", well you should because your brain can pick up motion way beyond even that.

http://boallen.com/fps-compare.html
 

Fijiandoce

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#5
I'm not too fussed with Frame-rate. Anything above 30 is fine with me.

I won't be put off a game simply because it's not 1080p60.
 

jj03

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Apr 7, 2007
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#6
not arsed at all. but sometimes, when i see people sayin 'i wpuld prefer 60fps', i think, i wonder if the dev's would have been able to raise the framerate to something like 45fps..a bit of compromise...depending on type of game.
 

Major

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Apr 10, 2014
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#7
Like some others have said, it's not important. What's important is if I'm enjoy the game or not. I can't see how a game not being 60fps would ever stop me enjoying it, that just sounds bonkers and elitist. Games work perfectly well at/around 30fps and always will.

I can see the difference between 30 and 60 fps though. There's just an overall pleasing smoothness about it but other than that though there's not a lot to be bothered about.
 

WaxWeazle

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#9
30fps is more than enough.
More is better, but I won't complain if a game plays at 30 fps.
Lots of people whine about it but most of them don't even know the difference between it -.-
 

Varsh

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#10
[QUOTE="jj03, post: 6476393]not arsed at all. but sometimes, when i see people sayin 'i wpuld prefer 60fps', i think, i wonder if the dev's would have been able to raise the framerate to something like 45fps..a bit of compromise...depending on type of game.[/QUOTE]

Having a locked 45 FPS is not possible due to the way monitors work, it's either 30 or 60 for smoothing reasons otherwise you start to get screen tearing. It's the reason games on consoles get locked to either 30 or 60 and why PC games have a VSync option.
 

Bigdoggy

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Jan 24, 2008
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#11
[QUOTE="Varsh, post: 6476390]For me I can even notice a difference between 60FPS and 120FPS. Personally I prefer to have as high an FPS no matter the genre but I can still play a game whatever the FPS. But for those that always say "I can't notice the difference between 30 and 60", well you should because your brain can pick up motion way beyond even that.

http://boallen.com/fps-compare.html[/QUOTE]

They can, they're just talking shit is all. When people say they can't see a difference, I can already tell their lying. This isn't the case of "the eye of the beholder" and the differences one see's isn't the same as the other, in fact it is the same. The difference is while they do notice the difference even if they say they don't (lying out their ass) it doesn't bother them, so the difference is it doesn't bother them.

I can definitely see a difference between 60fps and 30fps, but 30fps doesn't bother me at all. If the game plays well under those framerate conditions, then it's no problem.
 

Duffman

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#12
Again more is better but I won't buy a game because it's 60fps and not bother if it's only 30fps, as long as the game keeps me hooked and is worth the money frame rate for me is not a deal breaker!
 

Lethal

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#13
The only time I want 60fps is when I play a first person shooter online, or a fighting game. Any other time, 30fps is just fine.

But if you play The Last of Us on the PS3, then play it on the PS4, you will clearly see what 60fps looks like. Sharper picture with much less motion blur.
 

Sajuuk Khar

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May 26, 2005
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#14
[QUOTE="Lethal, post: 6476423]The only time I want 60fps is when I play a first person shooter online, or a fighting game. Any other time, 30fps is just fine.

But if you play The Last of Us on the PS3, then play it on the PS4, you will clearly see what 60fps looks like. Sharper picture with much less motion blur.[/QUOTE]

To be fair, there is a res increase with the 60fps adding to the sharpness :)
 

FinalxxSin

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Jul 26, 2015
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#15
[QUOTE="ArnoldRimmer, post: 6476386]There always seems to be a focus, especially this gen, on the framerate games operate on; 60fps, 30fps, locked, unlocked etc etc. It is becoming the norm on some forums (not this one fortunately) to see comments along the lines of 'the games not 1080p and 60fps, I'm not bothering'.

Just thought I'd throw it out there as I'm curious on others opinions of just how important 60fps is in gaming. Personally I honestly can't tell the difference between 60 or 30, am I alone in this?[/QUOTE]
There is a difference between 30 fps and 60 fps. The gameplay looks a lot smoother with higher fps. Here is an example of a few games being compared with 30 and 60:
http://www.30vs60.com/dirt3.php

60 FPS is very important in shooter games, where smooth movements can be the difference between killing and being killed at times. It's important in racing games as well due to the limited nature of them. Imo, 60 FPS is probably more difficult to accomplish on huge RPG titles console wise than anything else. Hopefully that time comes to an end two console generations from now. Can people still enjoy a game that runs on 30 fps? Of course they can.
 
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ArnoldRimmer

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May 23, 2015
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#16
[QUOTE="Bigdoggy, post: 6476413]They can, they're just talking shit is all. When people say they can't see a difference, I can already tell their lying. This isn't the case of "the eye of the beholder" and the differences one see's isn't the same as the other, in fact it is the same. The difference is while they do notice the difference even if they say they don't (lying out their ass) it doesn't bother them, so the difference is it doesn't bother them.

I can definitely see a difference between 60fps and 30fps, but 30fps doesn't bother me at all. If the game plays well under those framerate conditions, then it's no problem.[/QUOTE]

Wow, I was lying out of my ass and talking shit!

Well, thats me put back in my place
 

Lethal

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#17
[QUOTE="Sajuuk Khar, post: 6476427]To be fair, there is a res increase with the 60fps adding to the sharpness :)[/QUOTE]

When you move the camera in a circle, you will clearly see the difference in sharpness. 60fps gives you a clearer image while the picture is moving. Also helps to prevent screen tearing. 30fps has a motion blur effect
 

PBM

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#18
[QUOTE="Varsh, post: 6476390]But for those that always say "I can't notice the difference between 30 and 60", well you should because your brain can pick up motion way beyond even that.[/QUOTE]
Be nice ... those people are blind.
 

Major

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Apr 10, 2014
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#19
[QUOTE="ArnoldRimmer, post: 6476438]Wow, I was lying out of my ass and talking shit!

Well, thats me put back in my place[/QUOTE]
:lol: take no notice, some people are just plain rude. If you were aware a game is 30 or 60 and you looked for the difference I'm sure you'd see it. Like Lethal says:
[QUOTE="Lethal, post: 6476439]When you move the camera in a circle, you will clearly see the difference in sharpness. 60fps gives you a clearer image while the picture is moving. Also helps to prevent screen tearing. 30fps has a motion blur effect[/QUOTE]
 

Bigdoggy

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Jan 24, 2008
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#20
[QUOTE="ArnoldRimmer, post: 6476438]Wow, I was lying out of my ass and talking $#@!!

Well, thats me put back in my place[/QUOTE]

look, there is a clear distinction between 30fps and 60fps, I'm sorry but if you say there isn't a difference, then yes, you're lying. Like I said, the difference between 30fps and 60fps isn't only a difference in certain people's eye's, that is just the dumbest excuse I've ever heard and when people say "I can't or don't notice a difference", what should be said for example is "You aren't bothered by the difference".
 
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PBM

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#21
The difference isn't even subtle. It's glaringly obvious. Are you guys frame rate apologists?
 

Major

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#22
[QUOTE="Bigdoggy, post: 6476452]look, there is a clear distinction between 30fps and 60fps, I'm sorry but if you say there isn't a difference, then yes, you're lying. Like I said, the difference between 30fps and 60fps isn't only a difference in certain people's eye's, that is just the dumbest excuse I've ever heard and when people say "I can't or don't notice a difference", what should be said for example is "You aren't bothered by the difference".[/QUOTE]
How do you know what people can and can't see Bigdog? Some peoples eyes are not as good as others so it's not a case of people not being bothered about it. AR never said there is no difference, only that he couldn't see it. There should be nothing wrong with that statement at all. Stop sounding like an ass about it.

Not everyone who plays console or PC games get's a hard-on about frame rates and such things though clearly there's plenty here who do.
 

Nerevar

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#24
It has nothing to do with their eyes, it's the way their brain is interpreting the information present. This is influenced by the type of games they play and how much they really care to notice things like the framerate. Not everyone does or has that attention to detail. And that's totally okay, it doesn't make them liars.
 

Scheller

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May 9, 2006
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#25
I'm more than fine if a game is 30fps locked and it never goes below. I really don't notice much of a difference, if any, between 30fps and 60fps.

I'd hope next-gen targets 60fps, simply because they've shown this gen we're getting many games that still dip into the 20s, and I'd be much happier with dips below 60fps than 30fps.
 

PS4freak

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#26
In all honesty it's nice to have 60 fps but it's not as big of a deal everyone makes it out to be. For shooters it's pretty well addition but not much else is it really that big of a deal to me.. It's just an added bonus. But honestly can everyone here play a game and say right at that glance without knowing beforehand say oh that's 60 fps or oh that 30fps without any comparison? The only time i really know about fps if it slows below 30. There have been a few games where I could tell right off the bat that I could tell. Others I couldn't tell because I didn't research the game that much because it's not that big of a deal. It's more of a plus. I've never understood the whole oh god it's 30 fps attitude. Like LoL, i would have never known that game was 60 fps if there wasn't a counter in the corner telling me.

Just a question just to see how well I can tell. What Ps4 games have released at 60fps?
 
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Scheller

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#27
This IGN listing is probably the best one for checking.

http://www.ign.com/wikis/xbox-one/PS4_vs._Xbox_One_Native_Resolutions_and_Framerates

Funny enough, I looked to see what Warframe was (as I've been playing it a lot) and it was 60fps. When I went to GTA the other day to check out the editor it certainly seemed less smooth than Warframe, so perhaps I do kind of notice 30fps versus 60fps (of course, it's completely possible GTA was dipping below 30 since I was messing with the editor recording stuff)?
 

PS4freak

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#28
Yeah shows how good I am at pointing out fps. I would have been wrong on quite a few of those. I think the only time I can tell is games that have really fast motions. But I thought mgs 5 was 30 fps because it slows down bad when Quiet runs by you. Thought that was just the rare instance of framerate drop. So i guess it's not that big of a deal after all.
 
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#29
At least with VR gaming (be that PlayStationVR or Oculus Rift on PC) framerate will always have to be 60+ and the refresh rate will always be 60 / 75 / 90 / 120 Hz. If the framerate & refresh rate is ever inconsistent or goes below the minimum, it breaks the experience and will cause people to feel very uncomfortable (even nauseous) with VR.

As for conventional games on a screen, devs will always be debating and making trade-offs between framerate and graphics. That won't change with PS5 and the next generation. I just hope PS5/Next Xbox can be powerful enough to be an impressive leap beyond PS4/Xbox One and give developers enough of a 'canvas' so they can choose to make their games in either 4K with what would for the time be considered "good enough" graphics and 30fps or 60fps or in 1080p with what we'll consider "amazing" graphics at 30 or 60fps.

It's always going to be a tradeoff in hardware, and also what is done with the given hardware in games.
 
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Scheller

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#30
[QUOTE="PS4freak, post: 6476537]Yeah shows how good I am at pointing out fps. I would have been wrong on quite a few of those. I think the only time I can tell is games that have really fast motions. But I thought mgs 5 was 30 fps because it slows down bad when Quiet runs by you. Thought that was just the rare instance of framerate drop. So i guess it's not that big of a deal after all.[/QUOTE]

I sometimes wish consoles had a framerate indicator like Fraps on PC. I definitely noticed something off with GTA, which is 30fps, but I started up AC: Unity and despite it being 30fps as well, I only really notice anything "off" when I'm doing a viewpoint (and it almost certainly dips below 30fps).