Tribunal actually did good for once, and owned a bunch of fools

Spider

Elite Sage
Jul 16, 2008
12,260
8
0
28
#1
im not gonna delete this... cause its proof that i got played...

i have never fallen for an april fools joke until today...

sad........ for me

WARNING LONG POST

Lets Talk It Out


First and foremost, I am writing this on my own! F34R did not ask me to do it, he does not even know that i am.

Now, i know that the staff will be quick to attempt to delete this thread, but please read it first. This is not some fan-boy love in thread for F34R, this is a educated argument for a reverse in the decision. I would prefer to do this in a public thread, cause i think it is a discussion not only for the entire staff to discuss, but the members as well. He was not just a random member, and i think losing him would be a huge loss for the forums, thus i think a public discussion over the decision would be acceptable. If the staff still feels that this topic is "offensive" or not fit for the public in some way, i would be all right with transferring the discussion to a PM.

Now, lets get on topic. I feel that F34R is a good member, and deserves better then he has been treated by these forums. I know he is not perfect, and has not been the easiest to handle as of late, but i do not find any reasoning to justify a perma-ban of a member with such a positive history. In the following 3 reasons I discuss first, F34R's "Trolling", then the lack of warning or justification for a perma-ban, and finally why F34R deserves better. Obviously i am open to any opinion on the matter, and if the provides a better reasoning for the decision then what they did. I would be more then happy to accept that.

I know this will not make me very popular with staff members, but just know that I am not doing this with any personal vendetta in mind. I have recently applauded the staff for doing such a great job lately, and am just inquiring on what i think was a bad decision. I hope no one gets a negative opinion of me for this, but i am ready to accept that. I think if any major member was banned with such little information being given, i would have done the same. F34R is an old enemy, turned good friend, I know as much as anyone how he can appear to be a negative nancy, he has an understandable resentment towards the staff and I think the staff should be able to solve this problem in a better way.

Overall, this is an attempt to make us all friends again ;)

Well here we go!

Reasons that F34R's perma-ban should be reversed:

Reason 1: Trolling?


This part is not so much a defense of F34R, but more a clarifying and questioning look at trolling, so im gonna go against F34R as well as the staff in this reason.

So F34R was banned for this,
F34R I'm tired of you reporting every little ****ing thing you see. Then half the time you go off and just feed the "trolls" right back.

But in truth you're the worst of them all. The staff is tired of all the little shots you take at us whenever you get the chance, and always arguing with EVERYONE on the forums just to report them mid conversation.

The staff has been looking at this for a long long time, and frankly we're tired of it, and we're tired of you.

Peace.
I will talk about report abuse and insubordination in Reason 2, so lets focus on trolling.

I honestly think people do not understand trolling, arguing with EVERYONE on the forums, is not trolling in the least. Im not sure if you are implying that, but if you were then that is a joke. F34R does not troll...
4. No Trolling - The inverse side of Flaming, Trolling is defined by trying to make others insult you. Posts such as "PS3 sux" would be considered trolling, as it is a purposeful act meant to result in argument. Users in violation of this will be Banned. Feeding the trolls is considered equally against the rules.
F34R supplies a negative opinion frequently, that is not trolling in the least. He always will debate/argue/support his opinion, and hundreds of users on this forum can not say the same. Now, "feeding" the trolls is a strange reason to critique someone, cause that implies that F34R insults in response to someone breaking a rule. Thus, shouldn't we see a warning or infraction for the original offender? but in these "countless" cases of F34R feeding trolls, we see no action by the staff. Why? Cause his "trolling" is non existent, at least no more then the majority of members...

People think "trolling" is "arguing for the sake of arguing" that could not be more untrue. As said in PSU's own rules, trolling is trying to make others INSULT YOU. Not debate with you! F34R does often post negative about issues, but so what? how does that hurt anyone?

Now F34R is not perfect, i think he should not be reporting so much, and he is reporting stuff that i think should not even be reported in the least. So he is at fault as well, but this an easily avoidable problem. Make an ultimatum with F34R maybe? Something like "No more report spamming, or you get banned". Or you could put him in suspension, i remember when members used to be put on suspension for similar offenses. Then they could not report/rep/have an avy or sig for a period of time. Perma-banning seems like a quick fix.


Reason 2: A lack of warning

F34R has recieved the following Warnings:
Warning for F34R: No Abusing the Report Button [Rule 26]
Warning for F34R: No Insubordination [Rule 9]

and the following Infraction:
Infraction for F34R: No Insulting/Harassing Other Members [Rule 27]
Which was a 6 point infraction.

So F34R has a total of 6 infraction points and 2 warnings. The most recent of which dates back to January third. Now the reason F34R has been perma banned is as follows:
F34R I'm tired of you reporting every little ****ing thing you see. Then half the time you go off and just feed the "trolls" right back.

But in truth you're the worst of them all. The staff is tired of all the little shots you take at us whenever you get the chance, and always arguing with EVERYONE on the forums just to report them mid conversation.

The staff has been looking at this for a long long time, and frankly we're tired of it, and we're tired of you.

Peace.
Now, obviously F34R has broken rules, and even though people break rules everyday with no punishment (talk more about that later), I agree with the staff intervening. However, a perma-ban for report abuse, after receiving no infractions for the offense? This seems highly un-regular and also a mockery of the warning/infraction system that the staff has in place. Look at it from F34R's perspective, he is warned for report abuse with the following explanation:
26. No Abusing the Report Button - reports should be made without messages like "Mods do your job", "give this guy an infraction", "ban him already" etc. reports should contain a sentence on why you have reported the post including what rule you believe it has broken.

If you wish to report a post that is fine, adding on swipes at staff is not. Please feel free to go over the rules of the forums next time you get a chance so that these types of incidents don't happen again.
So the problem here was that F34R was addressing his own personal problems with the staff in reports... Now i am not positive, but i am assuming that he stopped doing that, at least he did not do it in the report he was banned for. Even if he did do it, no infraction was given for his lack of change toward the warning. So from F34R's perspective, he must be reporting things correctly cause there was no warning or infraction following the first.

Same thing applies for Insubordination, early warning followed with no infraction, then months later, a full perma-ban.

I am not saying F34R deserves no punishment, i am just saying that he should not get perma-banned. A infraction, threatening a temp-ban would be ideal IMO, however even a temp-ban right off the bat would be understandable, for a week or so.

Obviously the problem was being watch by the staff, and even talked about, would have it been so much to inform F34R about your issues with him? He was openly disscusing his issues with you, I feel you owe him the same courtesy.


3. Reason 3: It's still F34R

I once read on a forum that "All members are equal, but some are more equal then others" (a brilliant play on animal farm). In case the meaning of this eludes you (its pretty self explanatory) in "forum talk" it pretty much means that members who have been active a while, are staff, have donated, contribute, etc. should be treated better and more leniently then others. Now i think this forum does this pretty well, obviously all members are still subject to punishment of the rules, but plenty get away with rule breaking everyday. Use of Leet talk, insubordination, trolling, flaming, go over looked quite a bit, and i understand it because it is not causing a huge problem and it keeps the peace. However, look how little F34R is being banned for, even if you think he trolled, report abused, and was insubordinate, with only 1 infraction and no ban history, it does not follow the norm in anyway with how other members have been treated. Members have been given week ban's for much worse IMO.

Think of all F34R has done. He was a subscriber, he was a moderator, he ran multiple contests giving away games and prizes, as a staff and a member he has made many great contributions. He has done much for the forum, and even though he has some bad history, i think he deserves at least a second chance at being a member here.


In conclusion: Lets Talk It Out


I dont think F34R is a troll. I do think he has broken rules, and should be punished, but not banned. Hopefully a positive ending to this situation is possible.I know that many will disagree, and i hope they express their opinions. I hope this can stay civil, if it is even allowed to remain open. Again, i have no personal problem with anyone, try not to drag me into it personally. Lets stay on topic, and talk it out ;)

-Spider
 

Yuuichi

Miqo'te Bard
Oct 25, 2009
8,118
73
0
#2
Well I never had a problem with him. ill say about the trolling part that he isnt as abd as other on this forums. by the no trolling rule

4. No Trolling - The inverse side of Flaming, Trolling is defined by trying to make others insult you. Posts such as "PS3 sux" would be considered trolling, as it is a purposeful act meant to result in argument. Users in violation of this will be Banned. Feeding the trolls is considered equally against the rules.

I mean we have a post that says "who else thought FF sucked an was a waste of money?" That the exact same thing that goes agianst that rule but the thread continues. yes I let loose a bit in that thread to and I admit I deserve a warning for some of the stuff I said, but other needed to be banned.
 

Vulgotha

Power Member
Jan 6, 2007
15,776
148
0
29
#6
He caused a little bit of waves back when I was still SMC, we got alot of reports about\from him. This kicked up in a big way after he was no longer with the moderation staff.. There was definitely some bitterness.

I can sympathize there, I haven't much in the way of love for them either.

..,I tend to think that (with exception of a noted few, like Tribunal, Blacksite, Gilly, Cuguy and a few others) the leadership on this forum is by in large incompetent. But you can hardly expect them to act otherwise, they're just hobbyists trying to maintain order and peace on a board they enjoy.

It's a volunteer work force, except for the founder.


Should Fear have been permabanned? Maybe. Or perhaps Temp banned. Regardless some sort of punishment was needed for all the ruckus he caused.
 
S

SnowHawk

Guest
#7
[QUOTE="Vulgotha, post: 0]He caused a little bit of waves back when I was still SMC, we got alot of reports aboutfrom him. This kicked up in a big way after he was no longer with the moderation staff.. There was definitely some bitterness.

I can sympathize there, I haven't much in the way of love for them either.

..,I tend to think that (with exception of a noted few, like Tribunal, Blacksite, Gilly, Cuguy and a few others) the leadership on this forum is by in large incompetent. But you can hardly expect them to act otherwise, they're just hobbyists trying to maintain order and peace on a board they enjoy.

It's a volunteer work force, except for the founder.


Should Tribunal have been permabanned? Maybe. Or perhaps Temp banned. Regardless some sort of punishment was needed for all the ruckus he caused.[/quote]

You mean F34R. :lol:
 

Spider

Elite Sage
Jul 16, 2008
12,260
8
0
28
#8
[QUOTE="SnowHawk, post: 0]You mean F34R. :lol:[/quote]
:lol:
i laughed 2 :)

[QUOTE="djpenny, post: 0]the reason is in his ban msg[/quote]

you were bothered by report abuse?
 

HaTriX

Elite Guru
Sep 26, 2007
5,127
0
0
26
#10
[QUOTE="Sieghardt, post: 0]I just hope it isnt an aprils fools :lol:[/quote]

I'm kind of thinking it is.

Because the reason he was banned is kind of ******ed :confused:

If you can get banned for reporting posts... I think that's just plain stupid.
 

GhostFox61

Elite Member
Jan 26, 2007
1,506
3
0
37
#12
[QUOTE="HaTriX, post: 0]I'm kind of thinking it is.

Because the reason he was banned is kind of ******ed :confused:

If you can get banned for reporting posts... I think that's just plain stupid.[/quote]

I'd report you for complaining about being banned for reporting posts, but I'm not sure where that would leave me.

;)
 

Tribunal

Forum Sage
Dec 10, 2005
9,170
29
0
31
#15
Spider you're ridiculous.

I'm glad you made this thread though. It was totally an April Fools for F34R, but you made it even better. :lol:

For those of you who were happy to see him go. My b. You've all got to admit, he's becoming friendlier.
 

Xelios

Elite Sage
Apr 15, 2007
10,419
60
0
27
#17
I read the first few sentences and I was like WUT??

But then I read on and was like damn I got trolled hard. Better than Sony buying the Mario franchise thing though.
 

NYFAN75

Elite Guru
Dec 10, 2005
5,439
25
48
44
NC
#18
[QUOTE="Tribunal, post: 0]Spider you're ridiculous.

I'm glad you made this thread though. It was totally an April Fools for F34R, but you made it even better. :lol:

For those of you who were happy to see him go. My b. You've all got to admit, he's becoming friendlier.[/quote]


Damn beat me to it.... I was getting ready to post that it was a joke... Damn you Trib's for beating me...:lol:
 

Tribunal

Forum Sage
Dec 10, 2005
9,170
29
0
31
#19
[QUOTE="NYFAN75, post: 0]Damn beat me to it.... I was getting ready to post that it was a joke... Damn you Trib's for beating me...:lol:[/quote]

I think it's only fair I posted it. :lol:

It was after all my joke. The Fallingbullets thing was lame.
 

NYFAN75

Elite Guru
Dec 10, 2005
5,439
25
48
44
NC
#20
[QUOTE="Tribunal, post: 0]I think it's only fair I posted it. :lol:

It was after all my joke. The Fallingbullets thing was lame.[/quote]


That is true.... But I am thinking I am going to have to quote vintage and SB about the porn thing...:lol:
 
R

Rapture

Guest
#21
The moderators most likely knew something like this would happen, they were baiting others.

I hereby demand the mods be banned for blatant trolling!
 

Spider

Elite Sage
Jul 16, 2008
12,260
8
0
28
#22
[QUOTE="Tribunal, post: 0]Spider you're ridiculous.

I'm glad you made this thread though. It was totally an April Fools for F34R, but you made it even better. :lol:

For those of you who were happy to see him go. My b. You've all got to admit, he's becoming friendlier.[/quote]

welllllll i said to F34R like 5 times...

it is april fools...

but he was convinced...

god damn it...

someone make me a sig that says i got played...
 

Tribunal

Forum Sage
Dec 10, 2005
9,170
29
0
31
#23
[QUOTE="Spider, post: 0]welllllll i said to F34R like 5 times...

it is april fools...

but he was convinced...

god damn it...

someone make me a sig that says i got played...[/quote]

The April Fools was from me to F34R. But quite a few others were convinced too.
 

Tribunal

Forum Sage
Dec 10, 2005
9,170
29
0
31
#25
[QUOTE="smiggy, post: 0]We had you sussed hours ago in the British thread.[/quote]

You didn't have anything figured out. You just guessed. :rolleyes:
 
Dec 25, 2005
12,258
8
0
#26
:lol: Did anyone really think that he was banned? I just lol'd at the notion. And my lol expressive post in the ban thread even got some troll responses, and that was the real icing on the cake! :lol:
 

Tribunal

Forum Sage
Dec 10, 2005
9,170
29
0
31
#27
[QUOTE="MiNiMaL_sAnItY, post: 0]:lol: Did anyone really think that he was banned? I just lol'd at the notion. And my lol expressive post in the ban thread even got some troll responses, and that was the real icing on the cake! :lol:[/quote]

:lol: I felt bad when people started congratulating me. :lol:

I was totally expecting to get trolled. Hard. But I guess some were afraid if they did I'd just ban them too.
 

Spider

Elite Sage
Jul 16, 2008
12,260
8
0
28
#28
[QUOTE="Tribunal, post: 0]:lol: I felt bad when people started congratulating me. :lol:

I was totally expecting to get trolled. Hard. But I guess some were afraid if they did I'd just ban them too.[/quote]

god ****ing damn it...

i aint no drama queen... i specifically wrote that to stop drama

aisnfasdlf[lsadi'dk;lfjsadlfkjsadflajsdf;kjasdf


MASD
FNAS:DKFN

mannnnnn F34R owes me biggggggg